Game Discussions The No Man's Sky Thread

[Zak Gordon]

Nothing HG do at this point is going to sooth the internet hate band-wagon. They do not care, about the game, about HG, half of them either did not buy the game at all (and just hated for the fun, or because it was what their friends were doing, or because studio executive X directed them too etc etc) or do not play it because it was not Space CoD.

HG/Sony suddenly putting a disclaimer on those video will change nothing from the haters point of view, they will carry on hating no mater what. All you can do really is ignore them and carry on. They will get bored eventually, this is the internet, the land of short attention spans, and hates of the moment etc. So you just ignore them and get on enjoying the game (it is indeed pretty enjoyable for many aspects of it's gameplay, less so for others).

Mods made a HUGE difference to the game for me, plays like a proper PC game more or less now, rather than a console port which the default game does feel like on PC. Once i have reached my satisfaction with the game (that may or may not involve doing the main quest of getting to the centre) i will put it down and look to see what mods i can make to improve the gameplay further. That will be work, in my own time, but as i found doing mods for other games, is a lot of fun and improving a game you already enjoy is often enough motivation to keep doing that. It would be amazing if we got some mod tools at some point, but looking at the general train-wreck around the game i suspect that might be pushed back a little lower in the priority list for Hello Games (thanks haters for that, good job).

But chatting with other modders, many of whom are dipping into the rather vast and complex code base every day without a guide book, there is a lot of potential here.

For now i'm just enjoying playing the game too much to jump into modding

 

[Leper Messiah]

The crowd is so upset now with HG that I think it would be a good move to add this disclaimer on the store page video.
What is sad - this game really has the potential to become something better, I truly believe this engine can be use for really awesome things. Question is - if HG will get back to it and improve the game. What is the best way to deal with the "haters" - prove them wrong and deliver. I just dont know if HG want to work on NMS more.

The potential is indeed there, I personally hope HG do not shy away from adding things because of the hate brigade, I'm pretty certain there's a lot of people happy with the game that it will attain "cult" status. If it is Seans and HGs "baby" and a project of more love than anything then they should continue with it. It's had a (very) difficult birth, needed critical care to survive and now needs to be nurtured to maturity.

Nothing HG do at this point is going to sooth the internet hate band-wagon. They do not care, about the game, about HG, half of them either did not buy the game at all (and just hated for the fun, or because it was what their friends were doing, or because studio executive X directed them too etc etc) or do not play it because it was not Space CoD.

HG/Sony suddenly putting a disclaimer on those video will change nothing from the haters point of view, they will carry on hating no mater what. All you can do really is ignore them and carry on. They will get bored eventually, this is the internet, the land of short attention spans, and hates of the moment etc. So you just ignore them and get on enjoying the game (it is indeed pretty enjoyable for many aspects of it's gameplay, less so for others).

Mods made a HUGE difference to the game for me, plays like a proper PC game more or less now, rather than a console port which the default game does feel like on PC. Once i have reached my satisfaction with the game (that may or may not involve doing the main quest of getting to the centre) i will put it down and look to see what mods i can make to improve the gameplay further. That will be work, in my own time, but as i found doing mods for other games, is a lot of fun and improving a game you already enjoy is often enough motivation to keep doing that. It would be amazing if we got some mod tools at some point, but looking at the general train-wreck around the game i suspect that might be pushed back a little lower in the priority list for Hello Games (thanks haters for that, good job).

But chatting with other modders, many of whom are dipping into the rather vast and complex code base every day without a guide book, there is a lot of potential here.

For now i'm just enjoying playing the game too much to jump into modding

Mods are key I think, HG need to do a Bethesda and open it up as far as they can for modders (seeing as it's a SP game). I need to look for a mod to increase jump pack time as I feel it's too short and I need Omegon for the next tech update and have no idea where to get it (and haven't found it on planet yet).

 

[Ian Skippy]

Nothing HG do at this point is going to sooth the internet hate band-wagon. They do not care, about the game, about HG, half of them either did not buy the game at all (and just hated for the fun, or because it was what their friends were doing, or because studio executive X directed them too etc etc) or do not play it because it was not Space CoD.

HG/Sony suddenly putting a disclaimer on those video will change nothing from the haters point of view, they will carry on hating no mater what. All you can do really is ignore them and carry on. They will get bored eventually, this is the internet, the land of short attention spans, and hates of the moment etc. It would be amazing if we got some mod tools at some point, but looking at the general train-wreck around the game i suspect that might be pushed back a little lower in the priority list for Hello Games (thanks haters for that, good job).

Haha, so now you're already pre-emptively blaming 'the haters' for HG not updating their game properly? Cool man.

Anyway, NMS is rapidly becoming a bit of a SC thing, where a small group of rather 'passionate' people see conspiracies everywhere while waiting for the Miracle Patch by their Messiah, without any info, release dates or anything. Its got potential, baby, just have faith! And dont listen to the Evil People outside the walls, they are haters who will live for nothing but feast on the flesh of our Beloved Game. We must not let the Wicked triumph!

Its interesting to watch, I have to admit.

Mods are key I think, HG need to do a Bethesda and open it up as far as they can for modders (seeing as it's a SP game). I need to look for a mod to increase jump pack time as I feel it's too short and I need Omegon for the next tech update and have no idea where to get it (and haven't found it on planet yet).

Unfortunately, thats not how mods work. You need to decide that way in advance when designing your game. Bethesda knows modding is the heart of their game, and make sure that every game is easily modable at its very core. Unless HG has been secretly working on it, there is no magical 'enable modding switch'. In which mods will be what they currently are, minor tweaks and changes that do not really change the game in a meaningful way.

 

[Zak Gordon]

I'm not sure now that everyone discussing the game is playing/has played it? Mods make a huge difference to the game, not just graphical changes either. We have everything from some missing content (crashed ship models and building models, just props for sure) to stuff like Low Flight and Big Things and various AI behaviour (Animal AI etc) changing mods.

As i said above, chatting with the mod makers and you can already change quite a lot of the game, not all of it an easy job obviously, and having modding tools would really help, and NMS was built with that in mind, Sean showed us some of that in an earlier video where he talked about modding and providing modding tools. So this is not some assumption that modders have just made up (Oh wouldn't it be nice if we had modding tools?), It was built into the game at some point and talked about.

Obviously the game was not released as Sean and Hello Games wanted, and it seems those modding tools will be a lower priority now, i suspect they are working out how to make NMS the game it was shown to be during earlier development, but that is speculation as is saying 'you can't mod nms' or 'there will be no tools'.

Probably my current favourite gameplay changing mod is Resources Underground, i have to use the grenade launcher to mine for resources now much of the time, or to finish of extracting what is visible above ground etc. That in itself makes mining pretty dangerous, i've nearly killed myself a few times now by either falling down a mine shaft i created to get a resource or firing a grenade to blow rock away too close to where i was standing. It's a huge improvement over the default game where everything was out in the open (or in a tunnel in a cave). Mining feels like mining now.

I can go through my modlist and come up with each mods impact on the overall default gameplay and where it improves things, from visual stuff (easiest to do currently) to the gameplay improving things.

Anyone trying to discredit what the modders already have done with NMS, or trying to pass it off as not important, probably has not even played the game and tried the mods. That persons opinion on the situation may not be worth much?

 

[PiLhEaD]

...Anyone trying to discredit what the modders already have done with NMS, or trying to pass it off as not important, probably has not even played the game and tried the mods. That persons opinion on the situation may not be worth much?

I'll add a ditto to that and a bit'o'rep.

I've done quite a bit of modding and know how time consuming it can be.

The mod community of any game can add a huge amount in terms of content, fun and longevity, so quite why people try to devalue their efforts - and such types lurk in every forum I've been on - always confounds me. But then I guess some people are just 'that way inclined', and each one has received a very warm welcome to my ignore list.

 

[Ian Skippy]

Anyone trying to discredit what the modders already have done with NMS, or trying to pass it off as not important, probably has not even played the game and tried the mods. That persons opinion on the situation may not be worth much?

Well, speaking for myself, I am not discrediting it, never mind talking down the people who make those mods, at all. But I am stating the obvious fact that modding for a TES game was a heck of a lot better than for NMS. With NMS, modders are mostly trying to find out what they can do, whereas with games known for their mods like TES games modders can almost immediately start working on what they want to do. NSM is simply a game that, in its current form, cannot be 'saved' by modders. Improved? Sure. But it has some pretty drastic limits to what can be done until HG gives modders more access and control.

I am not sure why you are trying to discredit the opinion of people who you disagree with. It wouldnt surprise me if I were to have MUCH more experience modding than you do, and I am not stating my concern because I am a 'hater', want to 'troll' you, or have any other hidden agenda. I am just saying that from my perspective the only thing that can save NMS is HG. Either by fixing stuff themselves, or by really allowing others to fix it for them. And as someone who was looking forward to NMS, and is very interested in modding in general, I very much want this to happen. But going around pretending that the NMS mods currently are to NMS what the modding community has managed to do for some other games (X-series for example) is flat-out nonsense. And celebrating relatively minor improvements as amazing new things isn't going to improve that situation.

 

[cpbtrading]

I'm trying to stay as Vanilla as possible now, just running 'Chromatic removal & Fog removal'. These are a must have for me, the other mods I have used, which have been quite a few, were great. But I thought as I'm trying to see if anything changes much, that I'd stay mostly Vanilla.

That said, I am a big lover of mods in games I play. So once I can see what direction the game is taking and what differences they make, if any, I'll be using a number of mods again later.
I like the look of the game in Vanilla anyway, other than those mod changes mentioned here. Changing AI behaviour is not something I'd be interested in until it starts to affect the faction AI, not animals so much.

I have been in a small system with many riches, for the last few days. Planets in the system have been a joy, good variation and interesting to explore. I am tending to keep/gather just the resources I need to keep travelling around and exploring. May sound mundane, but its actually very relaxing and lovely to look at.

 

[Zak Gordon]

Well, speaking for myself, I am not discrediting it, never mind talking down the people who make those mods, at all. But I am stating the obvious fact that modding for a TES game was a heck of a lot better than for NMS. With NMS, modders are mostly trying to find out what they can do, whereas with games known for their mods like TES games modders can almost immediately start working on what they want to do. NSM is simply a game that, in its current form, cannot be 'saved' by modders. Improved? Sure. But it has some pretty drastic limits to what can be done until HG gives modders more access and control.

I agree with that, HG will need to allow the modding scene to really take off (how long has it been now, 3 months or so since release?), working in the dark limits how fast modders can do their thing.

So what are you favourite of the current mods you have tried out? What sort of basic things do you think HG should work on to improve gameplay etc? As a modder yourself it will be interesting to hear you experience on the issue and with NMS as it is and after the mods you have tried

 

[Ian Skippy]

I agree with that, HG will need to allow the modding scene to really take off (how long has it been now, 3 months or so since release?), working in the dark limits how fast modders can do their thing.

So what are you favourite of the current mods you have tried out? What sort of basic things do you think HG should work on to improve gameplay etc? As a modder yourself it will be interesting to hear you experience on the issue and with NMS as it is and after the mods you have tried

Mods I appreciate are so far relatively simple mods that specifically tackle singular issues. A good example is the mod that stops the 'auto flight control', where NMS tells you you cant hug the ground. What I want to see HG do is hard to say, because it somewhat depends on how the game actually works 'under the hood'. Personally, I dont think the space part is worth focussing on: its so underdeveloped that that I doubt it will ever be a strong point in the game. So I'd focus on the planetary stuff, and in particular:

1) AI. So far the AI is very rudimentary at best. Seeing critters interact with each other in more interesting ways would be grand: 'hive-mind', lone wolfs, herds, symbiotic relations between species etc. An old game not many know is creatures 2 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Creatures_2), I always loved just watching how the creatures would act without any guidance. NMS provides a huge canvas where such things could be fascinating, and it could really make each planet far more unique.
2) Creature generation: allow modders to efficiently add parts that the PG system can use. HG intentionally went for a somewhat 'homogenous' creature diversity when it comes to 'being pleasant to look at', like spore. I'd love it if more alien/bizarre things were created, and the AI is linked to the parts with some randomization. Its something mod communities always excel at, and it would allow for TCs that have much darker, nastier atmosphere than regular NMS. That article you linked to a million pages back, with the guy going into the procedure of creature generation, suggests to me that its a system that can be easily expended upon, but we need to know what the properties of new parts need to be to function, and we need HG to allow NMS to read additional files.
3) 'Game modes' TCs: allow modders to set-up different modes. For example, I love survival games, but I dont like the grindy survival of NMS. I want to remove the fuel requirement completely, but have environments on planets much for dangerous/varied. Others may want the opposite, or just a free look mode where all 'gamey' elements are totally removed and people can just casually go sightseeing. You can never please everyone with a specific mode, so mods are ideal for such things.

But at this point I have no idea what they can add on a sunday afternoon, or a large half-year long patch cycle, and what is fundamentally impossible. And the silence from HG really isnt helping here indeed,

 

[Barking_Mad]

Sean Murray's Twitter has been hacked - or maybe not.

https://twitter.com/NoMansSky

Also....

and...

I reached out to the developer and asked them whether it was a hack. A representative of Hello Games replied, telling me that a “disgruntled employee” had made the tweet and that they were “currently trying to sort out the issue.”

 

[Monk]

Sean Murray's Twitter has been hacked - or maybe not.

http://blogs-images.forbes.com/erikkain/files/2016/10/Screenshot-600.jpg?width=960

https://twitter.com/NoMansSky

Also....


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cv3SefuWAAI3i7f.jpg:large

When will people learn...2 factor auth, seriously...do it

 

[Brett C]

When will people learn...2 factor auth, seriously...do it

(Coming soon to the Frontier forums as well)

 

[Shadowdancer]

When will people learn...2 factor auth, seriously...do it

Doesn't help with Twitter, since they use text messages as the second factor which are horribly unreliable and considered insecure to boot. SMS-based 2FA is on the same level as the promise of free candy: just say no.

 

[Monk]

Doesn't help with Twitter, since they use text messages as the second factor which are horribly unreliable and considered insecure to boot. SMS-based 2FA is on the same level as the promise of free candy: just say no.

Did not know that...thanks!

Though, my Twitter hasn't been compromised since I turned 2 factor on. It used to be a regular occurrence for my followers to get bogus DMs from me.

 

[Backer42]

When will people learn...2 factor auth, seriously...do it

How will two factor auth help, if you don't think before you tweet?

 

[Faybs]

How will two factor auth help, if you don't think before you tweet?

I think the idea is that it wasn't Shaun that tweeted, but one of his minions using the company account (and then pretending to be Shaun on email). I don't think they'd refer to their CEO as "a disgruntled employee"

 

[Jack Schitt]

Did not know that...thanks!

It's difficult to know which are worse, the technical vulnerabilities or the social engineering ones. Either way Shadowdancer is right and I wouldn't trust it for anything critical unless there were no other options.

Though, my Twitter hasn't been compromised since I turned 2 factor on. It used to be a regular occurrence for my followers to get bogus DMs from me.

Statistically it is better than nothing when it comes to preventing random opportunistic attacks, but if you've been specifically targeted it may as well not be there.

As for Sean Murray, sometimes I almost feel sorry for the guy. Then I remember how much he's probably made on the back of NMS and my sympathy wanes. He definitely screwed up, and at least part of that screwing up was made worse by external factors, but he'll have made a pretty penny out of it all. If only all of my screwups were as profitable.

And I still like the game, even though I haven't played it much recently because there are some new ED features to be messing around with. I wonder sometimes if that isn't a problem with modern gaming, where a game's success is measured in terms of concurrent Steam users rather than anything qualitative. One scathing report I heard mentioned on a podcast said that at one point there were only something like 300 concurrent users playing NMS, and that is pretty damning in isolation, but does it mean that everyone else who stuck with it has now given up too? Or does it just mean they were doing something else at the time the stats were polled? If I like a game do I have to play it regularly just to make sure my appreciation "counts"?

 

[Zak Gordon]

(Coming soon to the Frontier forums as well)

Will that be opt-in (or opt-out). In general for stuff like game forums they are not that essential i feel the need to give out my mobile number?

As for the Hack or Sean-(as disgruntled employee) posting with despair about NMS, well i think it could be said that looking at the reaction to NMS, in relation to the hate backlash (that is still going strong) then yes as it was released, NMS was indeed a mistake.

The why and how of all that, that we will eventually get to know is what will be really important, important to allow people to either move on with their rage, or important to see what game dev can be like, and how crazy the curve-ball (or googly for us brits) can sometimes be.

As long as they keep updating the game (new patch dropped yesterday for many) and aim to address some of the obvious issues and add more content, then it might have a better long-term outcome than it currently looks like doing. We shall see.

Edit: I saw some interesting animal behaviour yesterday. My better half was playing (we take turns) and on her current planet she found a few 'Predator' types, one was classed 'Hostile' and 'meat eater' (iirc!), the other two were both classed 'scavenger'. So one of those scavengers (a raptor like thing with a large toucan like bill) was over the corpse of another animal (it was like that when she went over the hill and saw it), looked up and started to chase her.

I'd not seen anything like that in my game. The other scavenger class was passive towards her, even though it's description was all the same as bird-raptor scavenger. The top predator was a bigger t-rex type thing and super aggressive also, but it was the difference in the scavengers behaviour that was most striking. Was it because she had interrupted it while eating? Just pretty cool and a nice surprise over the normal bumbling around without much purpose stuff you usually see with the creatures.

Oh yeah we do not run any creature mods, so this was default game behaviour. pretty cool

 

[Leper Messiah]

came across the largest ship I've ever seen today, seriously this thing was HUGE....

Edit: I saw some interesting animal behaviour yesterday. My better half was playing (we take turns) and on her current planet she found a few 'Predator' types, one was classed 'Hostile' and 'meat eater' (iirc!), the other two were both classed 'scavenger'. So one of those scavengers (a raptor like thing with a large toucan like bill) was over the corpse of another animal (it was like that when she went over the hill and saw it), looked up and started to chase her.

I'd not seen anything like that in my game. The other scavenger class was passive towards her, even though it's description was all the same as bird-raptor scavenger. The top predator was a bigger t-rex type thing and super aggressive also, but it was the difference in the scavengers behaviour that was most striking. Was it because she had interrupted it while eating? Just pretty cool and a nice surprise over the normal bumbling around without much purpose stuff you usually see with the creatures.

Oh yeah we do not run any creature mods, so this was default game behaviour. pretty cool

I've found scavenger and predators before now, pretty cool to watch the predators go after it's prey...even cooler to defend the prey then give it some food

 

[cpbtrading]

Sometimes its just nice to clear the screen and walk around and enjoy.

Spoiler

[video=youtube;6NBAvZSKqxo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6NBAvZSKqxo[/video]

[video=youtube;9ZH2KwludPA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=20&v=9ZH2KwludPA[/video]

One of my favorite types of planet. Although, most are pretty much a favorite.
[video=youtube;mlCRgVy68x8]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mlCRgVy68x8[/video]