This is exactly what drives lab rats mad in a Skinner Box.
The relog mechanic (please read FDev)
- Thread starter S3NS3R
- Start date
This is exactly what drives lab rats mad in a Skinner Box.
? why do you think I'm spending any time on this game? I finished Horizons--its done--its the same thing over and over again as well.. You can get away with it in a spaceship, when you start introducing the human element it's much harder to get away with weak gameplay..
Well, you’re still on the Odyssey boards, that expansion you don’t play, seems a bit strange to spend so much time on a game you’ve finished in such a short period of time.
I bet you’ve spent more time on the boards trolling than playing Elite.
Sad really…
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Ian Phillips
Volunteer Moderator
If you two do not cut it out you will very quickly run out of threads to post in.
Wow, you guys report me as a troll because you disagree with me? You are interacting with my posts-- I came here to concur with the OP and you guys jump on me, because you disagree then report me for trolling?
I can live without this forum, please dont take it away from the others I'm not sure where they'd go.
I think if the unlock process is improved (visual progress counters, reduced RNG requirements like SDPs) and we get loot from kills, then all that's left is to just fix the "relog deletes stuff" and make it so there's a short timer on it instead. So we can opt to cruise to a nearby settlement in the same system (like "bounce" between two or three) to get more materials and missions "reset" the items as soon as you load in (encouraging the use of missions further)... it'd be pretty much set. Being able to just do, for example, scavenger or restore/scav missions and get:
- Data as rewards for the mission
- Assets and goods from the kills
- Existing loot from scavenging what's left
For the stuff we commonly "relog" for (which is basically MIs and SDPs now), I'd suggest these are just made less of a requirement (so 5/5 SDPs and dramatically reduce the demand for MIs across all recipes). MIs can be gained up to 5 at a time as mission rewards. I think reducing the demand for this item would be more than enough.
I estimate that it would take around 4-5 hours of relogging at a Impact Site Satellite to get enough Manufacturing Instructions to G5 all 14 items of your gear.
I can't imagine how long it would take to get all those under normal means.
They need to increase drop rates of everything so won't feel like we need to relog. But until they do that I plan on relogging to get everything I need as quickly as possible.
I can't imagine how long it would take to get all those under normal means.
They need to increase drop rates of everything so won't feel like we need to relog. But until they do that I plan on relogging to get everything I need as quickly as possible.
For me, it would be more enjoyable if they simply let us loot kills--different weapons and suit parts- then give the engineers more of a Gaurdian type event gameplay mechanic- Have unique events for each of the engineer unlocks, more quest based than finding random things in peoples bathrooms.
Another thing is that maybe people wouldn't feel the need to grind if the "proper" way of obtaining the materials in question was actually reliable.
As it stands, even something as seemingly certain as a mission reward can be snatched away from you, seemingly at random, thanks to the buggy mess everything is in.
Just now I had a digital espionage mission that simply... didn't spawn the mission objective data in the data port it was supposed to be in. That was supposed to be a relatively painless three manufacturing instructions for that, but instead I completely wasted my time through no mistake of my own.
I'm trying to enjoy this game but it's pretty hard when at completely irregular intervals it just decides to kick me in the nuts out of nowhere.
As it stands, even something as seemingly certain as a mission reward can be snatched away from you, seemingly at random, thanks to the buggy mess everything is in.
Just now I had a digital espionage mission that simply... didn't spawn the mission objective data in the data port it was supposed to be in. That was supposed to be a relatively painless three manufacturing instructions for that, but instead I completely wasted my time through no mistake of my own.
I'm trying to enjoy this game but it's pretty hard when at completely irregular intervals it just decides to kick me in the nuts out of nowhere.
Yes.
Did 2 missions last evening. From allied factions. My negociated rewards were 10 Manufactured Instructions and 8 Ballistic Reports.
I completed them both, the game claimed i got the material rewards, but well... the game didnt gave me any materials... and Inara, surprisingly is saying this:
Seriously, Expired ??? when i completed both missions and when i logged out from the game my transaction list panel was clean?
The issues I see here are mainly that
the numbers of required items for upgrades are too high in some instances.
there are too many 'junk' items that are of no use to any player with credits.
stuff you CAN barter with the barkeeper are stuff that you need for other upgrades.
Surely if you pick up any item that's only good to sell to the barkeep for 100k cr, then (s)he should at least trade it for some Graphene....which costs what? 1300 cr
the numbers of required items for upgrades are too high in some instances.
there are too many 'junk' items that are of no use to any player with credits.
stuff you CAN barter with the barkeeper are stuff that you need for other upgrades.
Surely if you pick up any item that's only good to sell to the barkeep for 100k cr, then (s)he should at least trade it for some Graphene....which costs what? 1300 cr
I've been playing the game for an hour or so each day now since release and I currently have G3 Artemis, G3Maverick with extra backpack and reduced tool consumption and G4 dominator. I have a G3 laser carbine with faster handling and stability and I've just upgraded my Manticore sniper to G3 with silencer. I haven't relogged once, just been playing the game and collecting things and missions rewards as I go. I don't think that's bad for just over a month of release. I can see the engineer stuff lasting a few more months at least and I'm fine with that. People seem to want to get to the end of the road as quickly as possible and they miss the journey.
I like the idea that scavenging and smuggling nets credits though. It would be worse if it was 100% just for upgrading.The issues I see here are mainly that
the numbers of required items for upgrades are too high in some instances.
there are too many 'junk' items that are of no use to any player with credits.
stuff you CAN barter with the barkeeper are stuff that you need for other upgrades.
Surely if you pick up any item that's only good to sell to the barkeep for 100k cr, then (s)he should at least trade it for some Graphene....which costs what? 1300 cr
The only stuff that's tougher to get (goods and data) can be focused on as mission rewards. I'd like it if we had more control over the rewards we can get (and I've suggested this happen via npc contacts, also enabling us to increase the volume of things like gas and schematics).
The remaining issues are all related to unlocking engineers with data, pretty much (and that's only really sdp data now, the rest is OK and I proved it was possible to get this data purely by natural smuggling and restore mission play; sdp would take a ridiculous length of time this way though).
How many hours total do you have? Like 50 hours? Did you upgrade all those suits and weapons and then engineer them? Final question are you telling the truth?
Not everyone comes on here to lie about what they do in the game.
An hour or so a day. 3-4 missions a day, 2 if you're just pottering around, since launch. Seems reasonable enough to me.
IIRC early Horizons already had mechanics in place to completely prevent relog farming. It's why we had crack trains. You could not scan the same settlement twice within a week, so players would build optimized lists of settlements in order (a train) in which they'd visit to scan every week. At the time, cracked industrial firmware was the hot mat in shortage (the crack).
They removed this. The relog farm mechanic was installed (along with Jameson's crash site). Why I can't say, as they seem to have agreed in dev posts that it's a problem they agree needs to be tackled, but I suspect there may have been some goofy conflict between past existing relog-inhibiting functions and something else. Either that, or some rather horrifying levels of incompetence and stupidity were involved with some decision making.
I'm in no way saying grind should take longer. Even with relog mechanics in place, it still takes way too long to accomplish anything. I've already fully raided and plundered some 80 bases, half through relogging, but have yet to purchase a single upgrade or engineering mod and have only one engineer unlocked so far. That's not fun nor is it interesting. In fact, the end-condition of having overpowered gear isn't interesting either. I'm afraid combat won't be as fun, similarly to how certain ships with 10k mj have become, so I've decided to stop here. Unfortunately, that has reduced Odyssey's meaning and value to zero for me. It has no purpose other than ruining itself.
I really wished they hadn't even attempted the whole engineering mat system and simply offered lootable weapons with some rare chance to get modded components out of them. It's similar to what they did placing rare items in shops, but instead of jump dock spamming to get them, it would have been through related gameplay instead (on-foot combat).
Elite already had a complicated-enough mat system in place. I would have much rather seen settlement mats used in effect to craft ship mats, then see those ship mats used in effect for a more diversified, flexible, fair, and balanced p2p sandbox compatible ship engineering system unlike the current click-upgrade-to-become-overpowered-ineers. They had an opportunity here to provide something different than mat traders, alternative methods of obtaining rare components like pharmas rather than randomly jumping from outbreak to outbreak and brainlessly dropping in on effortless unimaginative content like high grade signal sources. Instead, mix some of this fabric, memory chips, bleach, med kits and bio samples to craft a pharma. They also passed the opportunity to add more to what most argued are unfinished features of the past. More weapons, more mods, mods for items that don't currently have any, more MK variants of ships and module storage.
This new isolated game loop of suits and pistol upgrades, where relog farming increases returns 10x, is just another sad story in Elite's history. It doesn't need more crap loops scattered on the outskirts, it needs its previous loops enhanced.
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Fdev: "Uhh, what? You mean we should just add a mess of items with a recipe use, items with no use AT ALL, items with engineer unlock use, and not differentiate between any of them?"
I can't even imagine how they came up with this stuff. The community managers even assured us, before launch, that the relog issues are being taken very seriously this time. Then bam, the expansion ended up being designed completely around it like it was the primary feature of a loop that never had reason to exist.