The roster compared to most common zoo species in real life

[yoav_r]

So here is the most common species in european (+a few other regions) zoos, with domesticated and aviary birds removed. Animals already in the game are crossed

#	# in full list	Species	# of facilities
1	1​	Indian peacock	988​
2	3​	European fallow deer	846​
3	7​	Emu	598​
4	9​	Meerkat	587​
5	11​	Racoon	551​
6	12​	Red-necked Wallaby	547​
7	13​	Llama	547​
8	20​	Ring-tailed lemur	483​
9	22​	Red eared slider turtle	468​
10	25​	Green iguana	450​
11	26​	South American coati	449​
12	27​	Greater Rhea	430​
13	29​	Black Swan	398​
14	30​	Bactrian Camel	397​
15	31​	wild boar	364​
16	32​	African Spurred tortoise	363​
17	33​	Ball python	354​
18	37​	African Ostrich	341​
19	40​	Western Bearded Dragon	329​
20	42​	Patagonian Mara	326​
21	45​	Red deer	319​
22	46​	Common marmoset	313​
23	49​	Ferret	303​
24	52​	Boa Constrictor	289​
25	54​	Cotton top Tamarin	279​
26	56​	African lion	275​
27	57​	Indian crested porcupine	273​
28	58​	Asian small-clawed otter	272​
29	60​	Greek tortoise	269​
30	62​	Leopard gecko	265​
31	71​	Roe deer	249​
32	72​	Capybara	246​
33	80​	European pond turtle	240​
34	88​	Great White Pelican	227​
35	89​	Greater Flamingo	223​
36	93​	European lynx	215​
37	105​	Eurasian wolf (Timber wolf in game)	204​
38	107​	Veiled chameleon	203​
39	111​	black-and-white ruffed lemur	195​
40	112​	Demoiselle crane	193​
41	114​	Black-tailed prairie dog	192​
42	117​	Red panda	190​
43	118​	Siberian tiger	189​
44	119​	helmeted guineafowl	187​
45	123​	Chinese muntjac	182​
46	124​	Axolotl	182​
47	125​	Eurasian brown bear	181​
48	128​	Red fox	179​
49
50

So how likely are the rest to get in, in your opinion?

 

[nutrit]

I would really like to see such an animal pack with the most common zoo species

None of them except for Coati are my favorites but they would definitely add realism to our creations.

I think Capybara, Emu and Porcupine are given but the rest I would not be so sure.

Dream line up for Common in Zoo’s DLC
would be:

Emu
Porcupine
Mara
Red necked wallaby
Rhea
Coati
Asian otter

 

[TheYeti]

Emu, Bennett's Wallaby, any Porcupine, Asian Small-clawed Otter, Capybara and any Pelican are a must in my opinion.

I also really hope we will get a Black Swan, South American Coati, Rhea, Patagonian Mara and a smaller tortoise species.

 

[Aidan635]

So here is the most common species in european (+a few other regions) zoos, with domesticated and aviary birds removed. Animals already in the game are crossed

1​	Indian peacock	988​
3​	European fallow deer	846​
7​	Emu	598​
9​	Meerkat	587​
11​	North American raccoon	551​
12​	Bennett Wallaby	547​
13​	Llama	547​
20​	Ring-tailed lemur	483​
22​	Red eared slider turtle	468​
25​	Green iguana	450​
26​	South American coati	449​
27​	Greater Rhea	430​
29​	Black Swan	398​
30​	Bactrian Camel	397​
31​	wild boar	364​
32​	African Spurred tortoise	363​
33​	Ball python	354​
37​	African Ostrich	341​
40​	Western Bearded Dragon	329​
42​	Patagonian Mara	326​
45​	Red deer	319​
46​	Common marmoset	313​
49​	Ferret	303​
52​	Boa Constrictor	289​
54​	Cotton top Tamarin	279​
56​	African lion	275​
57​	Indian crested porcupine	273​
58​	Asian short-clawed otter	272​
60​	Greek tortoise	269​
62​	Leopard gecko	265​
71​	Roe deer	249​
72​	Capybara	246​
80​	European pond turtle	240​
88​	Great White Pelican	227​
89​	Greater Flamingo	223​
93​	European lynx	215​

So how likely are the rest to get in, in your opinion?

Source?

 

[jcp011c]

Capybara is practically non-negotiable at this point. It has to make it in, the only questions is how long until we get them.

If Australia/Oceania is revisited, as it should be, an Emu should definitely be at the forefront of their choices.

I think another otter is likely as well, and Asian Small Clawed Otter seems to be the popular consensus to pick. Which doesn't mean Frontier will necessarily pick them, but it's certainly possible.

To me those are the most likely three (well, one almost definite and the next two most likely). I think a swan, a pelican, either the raccoon or coati and maybe the porcupine and red deer might have a better chance of being included as well. We have nothing from the Procyonidae family and I doubt well get both the raccoon or coati but can't imagine they'll skip one of them. Now that Europe's pack has been released the Red Deer's chances fall dramatically, but I think it's still possible since we have build items for it. A Porcupine would be a great addition to the rodent family, now that we're getting some, and while I'd prefer an Old World species they may surprise us with a New world species, assuming we get at all. The Swan and Pelican would be great for water-based birds, but that depends on if they want to include them without flying animations. I think they should myself, but of course, also would love the flying mechanic in general.

The Wild Boar may have a chance, even though we've had the European pack - in fact it may be even more likely than the Red Deer in some ways. We got a deer in the Europe pack, and we now have 3 deer and 2 from the Boar's family. So...maybe? The Patagonian Mara would be great and give us a second South American rodent (which we don't have even one yet, but we will!) The Rhea and Wallaby might also be possible giving some diversity to their families. The Tamarin would be visually distinct from the rest of the primates. But i think all five of these animals (Mara, Rhea, Boar, Tamarin and Wallaby) are probably in the third tier on this.

The rest are mostly exhibit animals if I'm reading right, and given we'll probably only get 4 more exhibit animals (for 4 more packs) those definitely have a slimmer chance of making it in.

 

[Fabian]

Thanks for your interesting list, @yoav_r!
I'd also be interested in the source, particularly in order to know which aviary and domesticated animals were removed.

I'd love most of them to be fair, but the top ones (Emu, Wallaby, Raccoon, Coati, Patagonian Mara) are really the ones that I think are necessary to flesh out our zoos.

 

[yoav_r]

Thanks for your interesting list, @yoav_r!
I'd also be interested in the source, particularly in order to know which aviary and domesticated animals were removed.

I'd love most of them to be fair, but the top ones (Emu, Wallaby, Raccoon, Coati, Patagonian Mara) are really the ones that I think are necessary to flesh out our zoos.

The source is zootierliste.

It's in german unfortunately, so I had to translate manually

 

[Fabian]

The source is zootierliste.

It's in german unfortunately, so I had to translate manually

Thank you, fantastic! I've used zootierliste frequently, but never realized they had an actual ranking list.

 

[Veah]

So here is the most common species in european (+a few other regions) zoos, with domesticated and aviary birds removed. Animals already in the game are crossed

#	# in full list	Species	# of facilities
1	1​	Indian peacock	988​
2	3​	European fallow deer	846​
3	7​	Emu	598​
4	9​	Meerkat	587​
5	11​	North American raccoon	551​
6	12​	Bennett Wallaby	547​
7	13​	Llama	547​
8	20​	Ring-tailed lemur	483​
9	22​	Red eared slider turtle	468​
10	25​	Green iguana	450​
11	26​	South American coati	449​
12	27​	Greater Rhea	430​
13	29​	Black Swan	398​
14	30​	Bactrian Camel	397​
15	31​	wild boar	364​
16	32​	African Spurred tortoise	363​
17	33​	Ball python	354​
18	37​	African Ostrich	341​
19	40​	Western Bearded Dragon	329​
20	42​	Patagonian Mara	326​
21	45​	Red deer	319​
22	46​	Common marmoset	313​
23	49​	Ferret	303​
24	52​	Boa Constrictor	289​
25	54​	Cotton top Tamarin	279​
26	56​	African lion	275​
27	57​	Indian crested porcupine	273​
28	58​	Asian short-clawed otter	272​
29	60​	Greek tortoise	269​
30	62​	Leopard gecko	265​
31	71​	Roe deer	249​
32	72​	Capybara	246​
33	80​	European pond turtle	240​
34	88​	Great White Pelican	227​
35	89​	Greater Flamingo	223​
36	93​	European lynx	215​
37	105​	Eurasian wolf (Timber wolf in game)	204​
38	107​	Veiled chameleon	203​
39	111​	black-and-white ruffed lemur	195​
40	112​	Demoiselle crane	193​
41	114​	Black-tailed prairie dog	192​
42	117​	Red panda	190​
43	118​	Siberian tiger	189​
44	119​	helmeted guineafowl	187​
45	123​	Chinese muntjac	182​
46	124​	Axolotl	182​
47	125​	Eurasian brown bear	181​
48	128​	Red fox	179​
49
50

So how likely are the rest to get in, in your opinion?

If we get the number 1, the emu, it would be too much overlap with the rhea, the number 12 (which is also too similar to the ostrich). I think the same about capybara and mara, both are very common but a choice will be made. Or about roe deer and red deer, now that we have 3 cervids it's not very likely we get one of them, and even more unlikely to get both... The muntjac is maybe the most different deer from that list, it could make the cut in an Asian pack.

Sometimes I prefer a less common equivalent, e.g. I would rather have yellow-footed wallaby instead of Bennet's, and radiated tortoise instead of African spurred. Eurasian brown bear has almost no chance as it would be the 3rd brown bear subspecies, but I would accept it gladly if they use it to improve the current brown bear neckless model which I hate

To be fair, my top-3 from that list would be swan, pelican and crane (4th place for the coati) even though I don't consider myself a bird guy

 

[biggest_dreamer]

If we get the number 1, the emu, it would be too much overlap with the rhea, the number 12 (which is also too similar to the ostrich).

I find it a bit difficult to consider animals in the same family as overlapping considering we've already gotten two DLC animals that are the same species as a base game animal. Personally I'm rooting for all ratites to make it in, especially if aviaries end up not happening.

 

[Old Country]

It shocks me that there are that many racoons in European zoos. I've been to over 20+ zoos in the states and can only recall 1 that had racoons.

 

[Veah]

I find it a bit difficult to consider animals in the same family as overlapping considering we've already gotten two DLC animals that are the same species as a base game animal. Personally I'm rooting for all ratites to make it in, especially if aviaries end up not happening.

The problem is the game roster is designed with lots of bias: favouring terrestrial animals over aquatic and flying, vertebrates over invertebrates, big vertebrates over small vertebrates, mammals over other vertebrates, and carnivores over other mammals. That's why the only 2 animals with more than 1 subspecies are the tiger and the brown bear, but at the same time we have only 1 non-arthropod invertebrate. And that's why I think it's unlikely we will get 2 more ratites given the very limited number of birds we have seen in base game and DLCs, and even if an aviary pack happens (hopefully) it would be a waste including non-flying birds.

 

[biggest_dreamer]

the only 2 animals with more than 1 subspecies are the tiger and the brown bear

The wolf is actually the one I was referring to with its three subspecies, but I get your point. I guess more than anything I'm clinging to the cassowary and 2 penguins as a justification for additional flightless bird DLC, because I fully do not expect aviaries to happen, and Frontier has at least shown a tiny bit of willingness to add additional flightless birds.

 

[turkeyfox]

The emu and black swan are almost necessary to flesh out a full Australian area, and would add much needed birds but would work with current mechanics (don't need to fly, similar to the cassowary or flamingo already in-game).

 

[markun]

If we get the number 1, the emu, it would be too much overlap with the rhea, the number 12 (which is also too similar to the ostrich).

The emu doesn’t overlap with anything. It’s an iconic Australian species and Australian zoos - indeed Australian enclosures in non-Australian zoos are incomplete without it. The ostrich is no substitute. The rhea is perhaps less iconic but still has an important roll to play as a representative South American species and is necessary for a realistic pampas enclosure, a common feature of real life zoos.

Both species are also commonly found in smaller zoos which is another plus.

If you’re happy with the ostrich and cassowary ticking the big flightless bird box for a line-up of interesting and varied but ultimately random species that doesn't allow us to build lifelike zoos then fine but for those of us who want to make realistic zoos with realistic species we need at least the emu and ideally both the rhea and emu.

The problem is the game roster is designed with lots of bias: favouring terrestrial animals over aquatic and flying, vertebrates over invertebrates, big vertebrates over small vertebrates, mammals over other vertebrates, and carnivores over other mammals. That's why the only 2 animals with more than 1 subspecies are the tiger and the brown bear, but at the same time we have only 1 non-arthropod invertebrate. And that's why I think it's unlikely we will get 2 more ratites given the very limited number of birds we have seen in base game and DLCs, and even if an aviary pack happens (hopefully) it would be a waste including non-flying birds.

Real life zoos are also designed with a similar bias, not exactly the same but big 'abc' zoos favour megafauna.

 

[avietar]

Ooh! What a great list, thanks for putting it together

My ultimate 'Common in Zoos DLC', based on this list:

Emu / Rhea
Raccoon
Bennett's wallaby / South American coati
Patagonian mara
Red deer
Asian small-clawed otter / Wild boar
Indian crested porcupine
+ Leopard gecko

Raccoon, mara, and red deer are 100% in, because I doubt we'll revisit Europe, North America, or South America in general DLCs, which is where these would fit in. I also doubt we'll revisit Africa again, so I doubt we'd get the African crested porcupine which is why I included the Indian crested porcupine, which is apparently also a very common zoo animal

I do think an Oceania DLC might not be out of the question, which would undoubtedly include the emu and wallaby. That's why I put two additional options as their replacement in the rhea and coati.

The capybara is 100% coming in game, so I didn't include it here. If it comes, it could very likely come in a rainforest DLC of some kind, in which case the widely requested Asian small-clawed otter could be included as well. So I also put a replacement for the otter in the wild boar, another common staple of European wildlife and zoos unlikely to be included somewhere else.

 

[Veah]

If you’re happy with the ostrich and cassowary ticking the big flightless bird box for a line-up of interesting and varied but ultimately random species that doesn't allow us to build lifelike zoos then fine but for those of us who want to make realistic zoos with realistic species we need at least the emu and ideally both the rhea and emu.

I am not "happy" and I am not against the rhea as I like Pampas enclosures, I'm just explaining Frontier's criteria when designing PZ roster and why getting both rhea and emu is unlikely.

Real life zoos are also designed with a similar bias, not exactly the same but big 'abc' zoos favour megafauna.

The emu doesn’t overlap with anything. It’s an iconic Australian species and Australian zoos - indeed Australian enclosures in non-Australian zoos are incomplete without it. The ostrich is no substitute. The rhea is perhaps less iconic but still has an important roll to play as a representative South American species and is necessary for a realistic pampas enclosure, a common feature of real life zoos.
Both species are also commonly found in smaller zoos which is another plus.

Big ABC zoos are not the only kind of zoos, as you said small zoos also exist and that's why the list of most common animals looks like that.

But anyways, either you agree with me about the bias in the game (which reflects the bias in big zoos) and that makes rhea&emu unlikely, or you disgree with me because both species are so different and Frontier will prefer to design a 3rd and 4th ratite instead of a 2nd aquatic bird after the flamingo or a 2nd landfowl after the peafowl.
I mean, I didn't understand your point in your answer to my post, sorry

 

[Mjmannella]

Out of curiosity, why were domesticated animals removed? They're staple animals in zoos and don't need any new mechanics like aviary birds. Heck, we already have 2 domestic species in the game.

You also removed a lot of bird species that wouldn't need aviaries to be housed in PZ:

Spoiler: A lot of these are fowl, which could easily work in an open-exhibit setting like the current peafowl and flamingo

• Golden Pheasant
• Chicken
• Mandarin Duck
• White Stork
• Silver Pheasant
• Wood Duck
• Muscovy Duck
• Other Domestic Geese
• Mallard
• Indian Runner Duck
• Domestic Guineafowl
• Lady Amherst's Pheasant
• Mute Swan
• Bar-headed Goose
• Barnacle Goose
• Other Domestic Ducks
• Chinese Goose
• Scarlet Ibis
• Common Shelduck
• Red-crested Pochard
• Ruddy Shelduck
• King Pheasant
• Ringed Teal
• African Sacred Ibis
• Domestic Turkey

 

[yoav_r]

Out of curiosity, why were domesticated animals removed? They're staple animals in zoos and don't need any new mechanics like aviary birds. Heck, we already have 2 domestic species in the game.

You also removed a lot of bird species that wouldn't need aviaries to be housed in PZ:

Spoiler: A lot of these are fowl, which could easily work in an open-exhibit setting like the current peafowl and flamingo

• Golden Pheasant
• Chicken
• Mandarin Duck
• White Stork
• Silver Pheasant
• Wood Duck
• Muscovy Duck
• Other Domestic Geese
• Mallard
• Indian Runner Duck
• Domestic Guineafowl
• Lady Amherst's Pheasant
• Mute Swan
• Bar-headed Goose
• Barnacle Goose
• Other Domestic Ducks
• Chinese Goose
• Scarlet Ibis
• Common Shelduck
• Red-crested Pochard
• Ruddy Shelduck
• King Pheasant
• Ringed Teal
• African Sacred Ibis
• Domestic Turkey

I removed most birds and domestic animals because the discussion is about the future of PZ's roster, which is very unlikely to have all these different goat breeds and wotefowl species. The list is long as-is and I didn't want to muddle it down with a lot of animals which are extremely unlikely to make it in by category. However I'd love to discuss the place of domesticated species on the PZ roster in a different thread, and birds and aviaries have already been discussed a lot.

 

[markun]

I removed most birds and domestic animals because the discussion is about the future of PZ's roster, which is very unlikely to have all these different goat breeds and wotefowl species. The list is long as-is and I didn't want to muddle it down with a lot of animals which are extremely unlikely to make it in by category. However I'd love to discuss the place of domesticated species on the PZ roster in a different thread, and birds and aviaries have already been discussed a lot.

But we actually have no idea about what is likely or unlikely. There could be an 8 breed domestic animal pack for all we know.