The Shield discussion thread
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Asp: Should I put the shield in the class 6 slot?
Normally I would have gone straight for a class 6A the moment I had the credits but after a number of threads about shields I've begun to wonder.
Using the bigger slot loses 32 tons of cargo space off the bat and it's a whopping 16 million for the privilege.
The trouble for me starts with the fact that the default position is in the class 5 slot and there has been a thread or two suggesting that with some ships the bigger shield isn't necessary if the one you put in has a big enough tonnage coverage for the ship class, so now I'm confused. I'd like to have the ship as well shielded as possible, but if the 6A and the 5A provide the same protection I'm not wanting to waste cargo space and credits.
Thoughts?
Normally I would have gone straight for a class 6A the moment I had the credits but after a number of threads about shields I've begun to wonder.
Using the bigger slot loses 32 tons of cargo space off the bat and it's a whopping 16 million for the privilege.
The trouble for me starts with the fact that the default position is in the class 5 slot and there has been a thread or two suggesting that with some ships the bigger shield isn't necessary if the one you put in has a big enough tonnage coverage for the ship class, so now I'm confused. I'd like to have the ship as well shielded as possible, but if the 6A and the 5A provide the same protection I'm not wanting to waste cargo space and credits.
Thoughts?
http://imgur.com/omzijnI
That should help you decide, all depends if you want those few extra points of Shield for an A6 over an A5.
That should help you decide, all depends if you want those few extra points of Shield for an A6 over an A5.
If I recall some of the Excel sheets shared on the forum (cant remember the link, sorry) the 6D and the 5A are approx the same, and then the 6 just gets better and better.
Maybe someone else have the links handy?
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Edit - someone beat me to it. Thanks
Maybe someone else have the links handy?
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Edit - someone beat me to it. Thanks
doesn't it depend on the total mass of your outfitted ship? my asp for example has an all A grade full class fit-out and so the mass is over what an A5 is specced for, hence i'm running a 6C shield, until i can pick up an A6, a B6 is too heavy and reduces jump distance by too much. personally i prefer having the max shield capacity fitted that i can, lesson learnt from face planting station walls and being head rammed by other ships.
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I think that it's more complicated than that.
An asp fully fitted for combat have a mass exeeding the optimal A5 shield and i don't know if it's taken into account in that chart. I'm i'm reading the explaination correctly, the chart is only true for a very specific ship mass.
Apparently, the shield strengh is related to the shield class and rating and the ship mass, so it would be possible to get a different Mj output on with two asp fitted with an A5 shield, if one is heavier than the other.
http://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/2rsnkn/absolute_shield_ratings_update/
I removed the cargo to get the total mass with fuel :
A5 shield asp : 486t with fuel (with a shield optimal mass at 405t)
http://eliteshipyard.nfshost.com/#/...7sh7sh7sh4yG4yG,317_7_7_6u6Q7_8I,mpT7Sk7fE7fE
A6 shield asp : 506t with fuel (with a shield optimal mass at 540t)
http://eliteshipyard.nfshost.com/#/...7sh7sh7sh4yG4yG,317_7_7_6u6Q7_8I,7UImpT7fE7fE
For an heavy asp, the A5 shield is probably underperforming because the ship total mass is way over the shield optimal mass.
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It is based on the mass of your ship but I think its the base weight, not the fitted weight so putting all heavy stuff on doesn't increase or decrease your shield for example, the spreadsheet provided has all the exact numbers I believe.
Ive run my ASP with an A5 for quite some time.. its fine for general use and couriering around.. i go NPC bounty hunting to mix things up and havent had much issue.
If thats your plan, an A5 will do you fine
if your planning to go into warzones in open play ect then you may want the better shield just due to the conda's and Pythons out there
If thats your plan, an A5 will do you fine
if your planning to go into warzones in open play ect then you may want the better shield just due to the conda's and Pythons out there
Oh, it's the ship hull mass w/o upgrades?
yeah if you look when you buy a ship, it has a listed mass that isn't anything like when it has equipment on, I'm fairly certain that is the mass thats used.
Edit: Though I do think it would be cool if you could use a lighter shield on a low mass outfit and still get full strength, maybe something to look for in the future.
Thanks everyone.
I'm going to assume it's total mass not base mass until FD say otherwise. My reasoning is that total mass effects top speed, handling and jump capability, so it's quite possible it affects shielding too.
The other elephant in the room is the upcoming pips into shield rebalance, but I suppose we'll just have to wait and see what effect that has on everything.
I suppose I could make do with a class 5a for a while and then trade up when I've a bit more in the piggy bank.
I'm going to assume it's total mass not base mass until FD say otherwise. My reasoning is that total mass effects top speed, handling and jump capability, so it's quite possible it affects shielding too.
The other elephant in the room is the upcoming pips into shield rebalance, but I suppose we'll just have to wait and see what effect that has on everything.
I suppose I could make do with a class 5a for a while and then trade up when I've a bit more in the piggy bank.
I brought an asp yesterday, fitted it out for trading with an A3 shield, and 120T cargo capacity, worked fine as far as interdictions etc went, dropped into a few USS's to test the combat capabilities against NPC's... Not so flash for that, after about 10 - 15 fights with NPC wanted ships I had lost my shields about 5 times and had taken over 35% hull damage (and that is with using the run and rebuild shields method, today I decided to do some resource point mining and bounties in it, I fitted a B5 shield and got into it with a number of NPC pirates for about an hour, the shields did not drop once... and thats with typically 1 to 2 pips in system and the rest mostly in weapons... with some adjusting as needed of course...
I would think that for most uses apart from maybe PVP conflict zones, A5 shields would suffice nicely especially when you consider the impacts on range and the cost of the A6 vs having a shield cell or 2 with the A5....
I would go back to an A3 for close by trading between 2 systems where I am friendly or higher with as the police response seems to be a bit quicker than when you have no relationship with a system...
an A5 and probably at least 1 A3 shield bank for rares running and NPC bounty hunting and probably an A5 shield and 2x A3 and 2x A2 shield banks for PVP
I would think that for most uses apart from maybe PVP conflict zones, A5 shields would suffice nicely especially when you consider the impacts on range and the cost of the A6 vs having a shield cell or 2 with the A5....
I would go back to an A3 for close by trading between 2 systems where I am friendly or higher with as the police response seems to be a bit quicker than when you have no relationship with a system...
an A5 and probably at least 1 A3 shield bank for rares running and NPC bounty hunting and probably an A5 shield and 2x A3 and 2x A2 shield banks for PVP
its HULL mass, not cargo.
I have got A5 shields + Mirrored armor = you can take a bad beating.
Cheers Cmdr's
I have got A5 shields + Mirrored armor = you can take a bad beating.
Cheers Cmdr's
Balancing Shield Cells in an unconventional way
I had a random thought earlier today, with all the talk recently about how 'overpowered' shield cell units are, and how many want them balanced. Instead of outright lowering their potency, why not give them some kind of unconventional drawback that makes you think before you use them. What if they literally were 'over-powered?' More specifically...
What if using them produced a large, very noticeable spike in heat?
Heat management is currently a mechanic that's a little underutilized in combat. Typically, heat doesn't even spike unless you're using weapons like PAC's, and while I wouldn't want this to become Mechwarrior-in-Space, I think this idea is logical.
Consider that your ship's capacitor holds enough power typically to recharge your shield to full, and yet slowly meters out this charge in a gradual manner, even if the System capacitor is completely full and the shield is nearly depleted. Perhaps the shield emitters are prone to overheating unless a limiter works to moderate the flow of shield stuff used to recharge the field around your vessel. Shield cell units bypass that by forcing a large amount of potential energy held in cells into your shield projector arrays, recharging them instantly and bypassing the limiter, at the cost of drastically increasing your ship's heat. Excessive use of the shield cell system can indeed spike heat enough to damage the vessel, and any usage is sufficient to make you a far easier target to resolve on sensors than you otherwise would be.
It adds an interesting dynamic to combat where you have to balance preventing the enemy's ability to harm you with the potential of harming yourself. In the very least, it might render yourself unable to use your more potent weapons until your ship cools down a bit. It also gives heatsink modules yet another use to consider. However, their limited ammunition and the need to use an internal slot AND utility slot brings the power level down slightly below what we've got now, even if using them in tandem.
I had a random thought earlier today, with all the talk recently about how 'overpowered' shield cell units are, and how many want them balanced. Instead of outright lowering their potency, why not give them some kind of unconventional drawback that makes you think before you use them. What if they literally were 'over-powered?' More specifically...
What if using them produced a large, very noticeable spike in heat?
Heat management is currently a mechanic that's a little underutilized in combat. Typically, heat doesn't even spike unless you're using weapons like PAC's, and while I wouldn't want this to become Mechwarrior-in-Space, I think this idea is logical.
Consider that your ship's capacitor holds enough power typically to recharge your shield to full, and yet slowly meters out this charge in a gradual manner, even if the System capacitor is completely full and the shield is nearly depleted. Perhaps the shield emitters are prone to overheating unless a limiter works to moderate the flow of shield stuff used to recharge the field around your vessel. Shield cell units bypass that by forcing a large amount of potential energy held in cells into your shield projector arrays, recharging them instantly and bypassing the limiter, at the cost of drastically increasing your ship's heat. Excessive use of the shield cell system can indeed spike heat enough to damage the vessel, and any usage is sufficient to make you a far easier target to resolve on sensors than you otherwise would be.
It adds an interesting dynamic to combat where you have to balance preventing the enemy's ability to harm you with the potential of harming yourself. In the very least, it might render yourself unable to use your more potent weapons until your ship cools down a bit. It also gives heatsink modules yet another use to consider. However, their limited ammunition and the need to use an internal slot AND utility slot brings the power level down slightly below what we've got now, even if using them in tandem.
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I like this idea. Rep.