Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread - Part the Second [Now With Added Platforms].
- Thread starter Robert Maynard
- Start date
- Status
Around and around
Two representative quotes from this entire thread, repeated over and over like a mantra through 600+ pages.
If "occupied space is big enough etc" then tell me why all the camping in central hubs like (Leesti) (Lave)(etc)? Because those are critical systems on a long-established rares trading run. Most new players get themselves into something other than a Sidewinder through these routes. Why don't pi-rats establish themselves at remote stations near the edge of occupied space?
If you're talking "realism," it is stupid to think that such hub systems of the Sol and Antares sectors would have weak enough police (and a navy) to let you just cruise in and start blasting. Even Freelancer had better mechanisms to deal with that. The fact is that those are both desireable systems for trade and historical systems in the game, and are one of the new player's goals of things-to-see.
There's only 1 reason for camping those systems and that's to blow away noobs or screw traders. Convince me otherwise.
Almost every third page in this forum this other "line of reasoning" ["open is harder!"] pops up. I thought guys like you wanted the danger; the thrills, the kills, the deaths, all of that. But over and over, open-only players complain that open is harder. That's what you said you wanted. That's exactly the "danger" you say you crave. So there's your game reward; action.
But somehow this line of "reasons" to ditch solo are repeated ad nauseum. For some reason, "open-only" zealots cannot get their head around these simple things. They crave "action and danger" and then complain that open is... "dangerous!"
Yeah.
Two representative quotes from this entire thread, repeated over and over like a mantra through 600+ pages.
If "occupied space is big enough etc" then tell me why all the camping in central hubs like (Leesti) (Lave)(etc)? Because those are critical systems on a long-established rares trading run. Most new players get themselves into something other than a Sidewinder through these routes. Why don't pi-rats establish themselves at remote stations near the edge of occupied space?
If you're talking "realism," it is stupid to think that such hub systems of the Sol and Antares sectors would have weak enough police (and a navy) to let you just cruise in and start blasting. Even Freelancer had better mechanisms to deal with that. The fact is that those are both desireable systems for trade and historical systems in the game, and are one of the new player's goals of things-to-see.
There's only 1 reason for camping those systems and that's to blow away noobs or screw traders. Convince me otherwise.
Almost every third page in this forum this other "line of reasoning" ["open is harder!"] pops up. I thought guys like you wanted the danger; the thrills, the kills, the deaths, all of that. But over and over, open-only players complain that open is harder. That's what you said you wanted. That's exactly the "danger" you say you crave. So there's your game reward; action.
But somehow this line of "reasons" to ditch solo are repeated ad nauseum. For some reason, "open-only" zealots cannot get their head around these simple things. They crave "action and danger" and then complain that open is... "dangerous!"
Yeah.
Last edited:
Wow, mods on holiday? Usually posts like this get cast into the pit of Open v Solo doom within minutes.
Another thing I notice far too often in this thread is "open-only" supporters do, in fact, "slip into solo play" to do X. If you searched for that string in this thread you'd find a whole lotta posts with that in them.
AFAIK, most solo players stay in solo. They aren't the ones slipping back and forth to "benefit" from the "mechanics" of the game. They don't wish to run into other human players. They are just fine with playing solo.
It is only in the "kill solo cuz they r cheetings us!" posts that this flipping-back-and-forth seems to occur. It's quite hypocritical.
AFAIK, most solo players stay in solo. They aren't the ones slipping back and forth to "benefit" from the "mechanics" of the game. They don't wish to run into other human players. They are just fine with playing solo.
It is only in the "kill solo cuz they r cheetings us!" posts that this flipping-back-and-forth seems to occur. It's quite hypocritical.
How about a bonus to players that mind their own business and don't try to tell others how to play 
Guessing you don't play solo. This reminds me of hotel taxes that get voted in easily by local voters who don't stay in those hotels, but obviously don't consider voters in other areas are doing the same thing which eventually will cost them money when they travel.
You have insulted through veiled comments more than once and every time been called on it and your response is "Quit putting words in my mouth". No one is putting the words in your mouth but you. It is their "Reading Comprehension" that allows them to call you out for insults you apparently felt people were too stupid to catch. Apparently you keep thinking some of us have elementary school educations and not Bachelor Degrees and can't see what your trying to slide in. You want people to quit saying your insulting others, then don't do it. It is rather simple. Yes I called them whiny, when the argument is pretty much a temper tantrum because they can't force people to play their way.. I called it out. Was I to harsh, possibly, but at no point did I attack them personally or try to insult them.. unlike you.
Now as too your Mobius comment.
I would love to know what "rules" that those in Mobius don't play by that everyone else does, are those in Mobius now some clan of cheaters?. Are there rules in Solo that Mobius somehow have negated? If anything they follow more rules than others. And PVPers already exclude PVEers in open. Otherwise they would complain about seeing other CMDR's in open and not being able to shoot them.
And if you want something, Flipping WORK FOR IT. Make a rule set, strive for it. If it is too much work for you and not worth the effort then how can you or anyone else feel that it is justifiable for FD to do all the work for you plus more and make a Open only server with all the hassle and cost it would be?
Worst idea I've ever heard. Make the trade dividends from the station equal to trader profit so that escorting traders around is actually worth it for players in fighting ships, and suddenly it might seem more reasonable.
Last edited:
I agree with this. Or at least let the trader set a percentage of there profit to go to the escort
+1 rep for being cool enough to make this post. If I could be assured of meeting mostly players like you in Open, I might go for it. Sad that your eminently-sane post "from the other side" will probably be lost in all the bombast on this thread.
(I just made myself cachinnate
I concatenate your cachinnate with my own chuckle, chortle, guffaw, cackle, giggle, er, twitter, snigger, snicker, yuk & tee-hee!
Hang on - are you suggesting that you, as a hired gun in a combat ship protecting a fat, juicy trader ship want the exact same amount of profit by simply making sure fat trader doesn't get shot up?
That is completely senseless - you don't have the operating costs of the trader, you don't have the cargo outlay of the trader, and you don't have the vulnerabilities of the trader. If things go horribly wrong and trader gets blown up - (and you have failed in your protection duty) you have a far higher chance of making it out alive in your combat ship.
If you want income parity with the trader, then either get really good at shooting ships with high bounties, or become a trader, or start pirating traders you wing up with
It's a bit like those McDonalds peeps demanding double their earnings whilst providing no extra skills or value to their employer. It's the same as it's always been - if you want more money, find a way to earn it, or at least rob it in style
OMG! I JUST GOT IT! My Head is Exploding from your Logic! Your forum-fu is mighty!
Hang on - are you suggesting that you, as a hired gun in a combat ship protecting a fat, juicy trader ship want the exact same amount of profit by simply making sure fat trader doesn't get shot up?
That is completely senseless - you don't have the operating costs of the trader, you don't have the cargo outlay of the trader, and you don't have the vulnerabilities of the trader. If things go horribly wrong and trader gets blown up - (and you have failed in your protection duty) you have a far higher chance of making it out alive in your combat ship.
If you want income parity with the trader, then either get really good at shooting ships with high bounties, or become a trader, or start pirating traders you wing up with
It's a bit like those McDonalds peeps demanding double their earnings whilst providing no extra skills or value to their employer. It's the same as it's always been - if you want more money, find a way to earn it, or at least rob it in style
Allow me to explain. I AM a trader, and I trade in an Anaconda. An unarmed anaconda, to maximize my jump range.
Here's the problem. What is realistic in a video game does not necessarily equal what is attractive and creates a sufficient incentive for traders to play in open - Or fighters to escort those traders. If I make a profit of over a million in a run, know what my wingman gets? 50,000. The run takes ten minutes, and he knows he can easily make ten times that amount in the same amount of time in a high-intensity RES. My wingman leaves, and I have to switch to Solo play, because Elite is not designed in a way that lets traders do business with wing escorts unless it's out of the goodness of their hearts. I don't think that's realistic, and so I switch to Solo play because I have no intention of giving some puke in a python an easy shot in a ship he knows can't defend itself against him.
It's terrible game design, and that's why most traders use Solo. It'd be nothing short of stupid not to.
Last edited:
There should be a slider from between 0-50% of the profits as well as some time based lockout that lets the escort know that there is no possibility of changing the slider to 0 right before the trade is finished. This would allow players themselves to negotiate the terms involved in the value of the escort.
Why would any trader in their right mind fly with an escort when they have to share their own hard-earned profits? If the game was designed better with less grinding, that wouldn't be a problem at all, but it just isn't. In the end, that constitutes a tax for operating in Open play. I'll just trade in Solo, thanks, and make my money without having to share it.
- Status