Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread [See new thread]

[Jorlin]

IF i will be "encouraged" (forced) into open play i will just change profession.
From trader/mercenary to full time terrorist.

That's something supported by the game (even NPC do it).

I will roam around and kill innocent... as many as i can get.
- I won't ask for cargo... just kill.
- I will only prey on the weak, since i don't want to give any entertainment to the PvP crowd.
- I'll do it on the purpose that any others that were forced into open come to the forums and tell how much more they enjoy the game then.
- I'll do it untill FD changes the rules so i can't do it anymore.

It won't be "griefing" since:
- i'll keep moving and not making it personal.
- it even has a RP background... i want to change the society


If some more would join my terrorist cell, we could maybe change the game to a PvPers hell.

Let them completely run out of targets, make changes to unconsentual PvP a must.
We wouldn't have to kill that many... but everyone coming to the forum to complain counts.

I don't say "let's do it now".
Just in preperation if something unexpected happens

This said, let me rephrase that i like PvP and don't want it removed.
But if i'm forced into it, i'll do my best to get it nerfed to the next black hole and back.

 

[CMDR Reza Malin]

I just want to give this thread a lethal injection by this point.

 

[Uueerdo]

I just want to give this thread a lethal injection by this point.

That'd just be throwing a gremlin in a pool though.

 

[Messaline]

I just want to give this thread a lethal injection by this point.

We're in disagreement on an awful lot here, but I just had to give you a +1 rep for that! Thing is, we all keep coming in and commenting so we only have ourselves to blame.

 

[ermtony]

I just keep on dropping in with a fresh bowl of popcorn at my side

With a Marmite dip of course

 

[Mikkel Toxwenius]

Let the game reach its full potential and I hope the the Devs do something quick to correct the notion that this game is not only a Space Trucking Simulation but a living, breathing space ecosystem full of riches for the brave entrepreneur, untold mysteries for the bold explorers and danger for the cunning pirates and bounty hunters.

+1 to you for hitting the nail tight on the spot here. I agree completely on your sentiments on a living breathing space ecosystem. Space Trucking Simulation alone is not enough.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

IF i will be "encouraged" (forced) into open play i will just change profession.
From trader/mercenary to full time terrorist.

That's something supported by the game (even NPC do it).

I will roam around and kill innocent... as many as i can get.
- I won't ask for cargo... just kill.
- I will only prey on the weak, since i don't want to give any entertainment to the PvP crowd.
- I'll do it on the purpose that any others that were forced into open come to the forums and tell how much more they enjoy the game then.
- I'll do it untill FD changes the rules so i can't do it anymore.

It won't be "griefing" since:
- i'll keep moving and not making it personal.
- it even has a RP background... i want to change the society


If some more would join my terrorist cell, we could maybe change the game to a PvPers hell.

Let them completely run out of targets, make changes to unconsentual PvP a must.
We wouldn't have to kill that many... but everyone coming to the forum to complain counts.

I don't say "let's do it now".
Just in preperation if something unexpected happens

This said, let me rephrase that i like PvP and don't want it removed.
But if i'm forced into it, i'll do my best to get it nerfed to the next black hole and back.

You know if you did go full terrorist I think it would be awesome.

 

[Robert Maynard]

I just want to give this thread a lethal injection by this point.

If that did happen then there would be a clone (or six) of it within days as someone new to the topic would appear and expect that the topic had either not been discussed or had not been discussed enough. At least, with this single thread there is one place where all other such threads will either be merged into or closed with a pointer to this thread.

 

[Uueerdo]

If that did happen then there would be a clone (or six) of it within days as someone new to the topic would appear and expect that the topic had either not been discussed or had not been discussed enough. At least, with this single thread there is one place where all other such threads will either be merged into or closed with a pointer to this thread.

Yep, before they were merged into this monolithic thread, people could barely discuss anything else over the noise the dozens of near duplicate threads were generating.

 

[ChrisUK27]

IF i will be "encouraged" (forced) into open play i will just change profession.
From trader/mercenary to full time terrorist.

That's something supported by the game (even NPC do it).

I will roam around and kill innocent... as many as i can get.
- I won't ask for cargo... just kill.
- I will only prey on the weak, since i don't want to give any entertainment to the PvP crowd.
- I'll do it on the purpose that any others that were forced into open come to the forums and tell how much more they enjoy the game then.
- I'll do it untill FD changes the rules so i can't do it anymore.

It won't be "griefing" since:
- i'll keep moving and not making it personal.
- it even has a RP background... i want to change the society


If some more would join my terrorist cell, we could maybe change the game to a PvPers hell.

Let them completely run out of targets, make changes to unconsentual PvP a must.
We wouldn't have to kill that many... but everyone coming to the forum to complain counts.

I don't say "let's do it now".
Just in preperation if something unexpected happens

This said, let me rephrase that i like PvP and don't want it removed.
But if i'm forced into it, i'll do my best to get it nerfed to the next black hole and back.

1. Who is asking for Solo to be removed?
2. People are already doing the above, it's small scale but enough to put the wind up a few gullible CMDRS.

 

[Uueerdo]

1. Who is asking for Solo to be removed?

Pretty sure it was actually the topic of one of the original threads that was merged to create this one.

 

[DAYLEET]

IF i will be "encouraged" (forced) into open play i will just change profession.
From trader/mercenary to full time terrorist.

That's something supported by the game (even NPC do it).

I will roam around and kill innocent... as many as i can get.
- I won't ask for cargo... just kill.
- I will only prey on the weak, since i don't want to give any entertainment to the PvP crowd.
- I'll do it on the purpose that any others that were forced into open come to the forums and tell how much more they enjoy the game then.
- I'll do it untill FD changes the rules so i can't do it anymore.

It won't be "griefing" since:
- i'll keep moving and not making it personal.
- it even has a RP background... i want to change the society


If some more would join my terrorist cell, we could maybe change the game to a PvPers hell.

Let them completely run out of targets, make changes to unconsentual PvP a must.
We wouldn't have to kill that many... but everyone coming to the forum to complain counts.

Yeah we need to liven up the place, ive been playing since gamma, trading and exploring, and only been interdicted by a dude once and to this day i only have 56 bounty returned and all npcs. You think what you describe is traders hell, it's actually open play free for all heaven even for simple trader explorer Joes like me. You also disregard that for every action there is a consequence and your little group might en up having more fun than you think.

I know the devs have an anti pvp thing going on but we could have another website where we can keep track of pirates and other things like that and actually play together be it killing each others or defending each others.

 

[ChrisUK27]

Pretty sure it was actually the topic of one of the original threads that was merged to create this one.

I've followed/posted on here for a little while and the issue people have with Solo is that you can jump between it and Open at will, thus avoiding player driven scenarios but still affecting Open.

I've not seen any posts asking for Solo to be removed and all those players 'forced' (They like using those emotive words) into Open.

 

[Ghostickles]

I've followed/posted on here for a little while and the issue people have with Solo is that you can jump between it and Open at will, thus avoiding player driven scenarios but still affecting Open.

Imagine it like Space-Time Zones and you can get over it, works for me.

 

[snowleopard]

I think it would be useful to collect all reasons that were discussed in this thread why things should stay the same as they are now into one list.
Switching from Solo/Group to Open cannot be restricted (and hence having separate saves for each one) for the following reasons (in the order I deem most important to the least):

-Practicality: It has been said before several times that one can play "solo" in the open. Now its not against TOS/EULA (and unlikely ever be) but even if it was, there would be no way to enforce always having P2P open.

-Business: Alienating significant chunk of game population is not a good idea, especially those who made the game possible in the first place. Making E: D similar to Star Citizen (which, as I understand and forgive me if I am wrong) is turning into a true EvE with cockpits) is not a sound business decision.

-Behavioral: Even if it was possible, one of the groups would simply be renamed "The new Open" (since there would still be a possibility of switching between open and private group) and we will arrive at exactly where we are now

-Ideological: "Freedom of choice" and all that brainwashing drivel.

Did I miss anything?

 

[Uueerdo]

I've followed/posted on here for a little while and the issue people have with Solo is that you can jump between it and Open at will, thus avoiding player driven scenarios but still affecting Open.

I've not seen any posts asking for Solo to be removed and all those players 'forced' (They like using those emotive words) into Open.

Eh, it may not have been one of the threads this one was merged from, but I do recall there being a thread specifically asking for the removal of Solo.

Edit: Either it was deleted, or I am going crazy, cause I can't find it after a couple of searches.

 

[Driver]

I've followed/posted on here for a little while and the issue people have with Solo is that you can jump between it and Open at will, thus avoiding player driven scenarios but still affecting Open.

I've not seen any posts asking for Solo to be removed and all those players 'forced' (They like using those emotive words) into Open.

So what makes, "player driven scenarios" worth my interest?

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

If that did happen then there would be a clone (or six) of it within days as someone new to the topic would appear and expect that the topic had either not been discussed or had not been discussed enough. At least, with this single thread there is one place where all other such threads will either be merged into or closed with a pointer to this thread.

It would be far easier to make this look like a big problem that has a lot of support if we go back to having multiple threads.

I've seen several instances of people saying that the mode switching has to be a big problem, just see how many people are complaining. With this single thread, it is reduced to being not much of a problem.

 

[ViciousMink]

eDid I miss anything?

Technical/Design Limitations - There is one "server" (actually a series of servers) that handles matchmaking, manages accounts/saves, manages the background simulation (economic changes, faction influence changes, reputation and rank gains, system passes) that all "modes" -- single, open, group -- interact with. Repeat: All modes -- solo, group, and open -- interact with this database equally. Breaking off any of the three "modes" away from the others will mean another installation of the existing infrastructure, as well as the design questions as to what player data the forked simulation(s) will run with. If Solo cannot affect Open, can Open affect Solo? Likewise for Group play: Is the simulation further forked into one for Group, and if so for each group?

(There are 4 billion unique systems in the database, each (relatively) different. Of them, several thousand have active economies that are affected by players. Assuming each has a 32-bit integer key X, Y, and Z coordinates,... a varying number of orbital bodies which themselves have X,Y,Z coords, some of which have satellites (moons), and some of those moons in turn have their own satellites... this is an extremely large database already, 128 gigabytes with just the keys alone. Forking a database this size would take more than just copying the database to another location on the server, it will need its own hardware to run, and that's only for one dupe of the DB. Possible -- any computer problem is solvable by throwing enough money at it, which at enterprise levels starts at "thousands of dollars" -- but depending on how many physical resources it will need to run and how many factors are used in the simulation it may need hardware up to and equalling the existing hardware.)

 

[Uueerdo]

Technical/Design Limitations - There is one "server" (actually a series of servers) that handles matchmaking, manages accounts/saves, manages the background simulation (economic changes, faction influence changes, reputation and rank gains, system passes) that all "modes" -- single, open, group -- interact with. Repeat: All modes -- solo, group, and open -- interact with this database equally. Breaking off any of the three "modes" away from the others will mean another installation of the existing infrastructure, as well as the design questions as to what player data the forked simulation(s) will run with. If Solo cannot affect Open, can Open affect Solo? Likewise for Group play: Is the simulation further forked into one for Group, and if so for each group?

(There are 4 billion unique systems in the database...

I could be wrong, but I'd almost be willing to bet money (and I am no gambler) that not all 400 billion systems are recorded at any given moment. It is much more likely that zooming into sector X yields star configuration Y, and going into star Z in that sector yields planetary arrangement Q, etc.... At this point, if you could carve your name into an asteroid, I am pretty sure it wouldn't remain there if you exited and re-entered the system. That said, we don't know how much processing power the background simulation takes, or how much authored content they are planning that would be overly hindered by diverging simulations. Assuming the haven't bought any more hardware than they need, they would likely have to double it (along with maintenance and running costs) just to create a second simulation.

 

[ViciousMink]

Random suggestion: Instead of seeking to put up a wall between the existing Open and Solo/Group "modes," which are all tied into the existing database, why not push for their an isolated database? A system completely separate from the current, in which all players are open, which is not affected by the actions of players on the server which can be affected (in theory) by players who can switch between open, group, and solo play? This would appear to be a route with more potential success, in that they could choose to play in that separated, open-only 'hardcore' environment; FDev could offer a one-time-only option to transfer from the 'switchable' environment to the 'non-switchable. Because it strikes me that the desire to retain the existing arrangement, and the desire to isolate 'solo/group mode' interaction with the simulation from 'open mode' interactions are, as the designer intimated once, mutually-exclusive experiences.

 

[Jorlin]

1. Who is asking for Solo to be removed?
2. People are already doing the above, it's small scale but enough to put the wind up a few gullible CMDRS.

1. just read the thread. it's about destroying solo play.
2. im not talking about "a few gullible" but destroying PvP entirely.

It's live and let live.
Don't harm my style of play and i won't harm yours.