Where are my 2 games, hardback manual, extra special green case, and USB space ship drive, and all the other gumpf Chris?
The Star Citizen Thread v8
- Thread starter Yaffle
- Start date
- Status
Where are my 2 games, hardback manual, extra special green case, and USB space ship drive, and all the other gumpf Chris?
Goose4291
Banned
This is why when I need humorous Star Citizen mockery, i look outside this thread.
A citizen tried to defend the likeness of the Not-Venture by stating that the Venture is a mining ship, whereas the Vulture is a salvage ship.
An EveRedditors response?
"Obviously it’s a salvage ship. I’d venture to say it’s salvaging art from other games."
A citizen tried to defend the likeness of the Not-Venture by stating that the Venture is a mining ship, whereas the Vulture is a salvage ship.
An EveRedditors response?
"Obviously it’s a salvage ship. I’d venture to say it’s salvaging art from other games."
Why would any semi-competent manager at CIG/RSI allow expenditure on devtime and deplete their budget for fulfilling "assets" and "roles" that do not exist in-game, and cannot exist without fundamental change that is way beyond competent manager level?
Yeah 3.3.0 is unrealistic for Q3, and 3.4.0 adds land claims supposedly in Q4. Why are they making these promises when they know it is not realistic?
"Unforseen complexity" my behind, it is completely obvious if you think about the implications for a minute.
You used the words "semi-competent" and "CIG/RSI" in the same sentence.
Well there's your problem.
Viajero
Volunteer Moderator
It would be foolish to pay any heed to that man. Although maybe Cobra1984 wants to weigh in and correct me as he seems to refer to him quite often?
Last edited:
Nah between politics and science posts, he seems to be riding the same lollercoaster as the rest of us about the new ship sale.
I have now seen SC fans stating that the twin prong design was in Freelancer2 so Eve ripped off CR... except I thought he had precious little to do with that game?
I have now seen SC fans stating that the twin prong design was in Freelancer2 so Eve ripped off CR... except I thought he had precious little to do with that game?
Last edited:
Jacques d'Orleans
Banned
Isn't it the same at their Spectrum Forum where anything gets deleted, closed or members outright banned for just even asking noob questions?
TBH, if CIG would have asked CCP for the ships design they never would have said No.
If they would have made a short time coop between CiG and CCP that would have been a huge positive PR thing specially for CIG after that Legatus thing.
Lets say:
1. CIG announces Cooperation with CCP and Venture mining ship in SC.
2. CCP announces SC shipskins and one or two new EvE online ships based on SC models in their own EvE online shop.
3. CCP and CIG announce that a certain percentage of those ship sales go to charity.
4. Press reacts
5. Classic Win-Win situation for both companies.
But no, they had to "borrow" the design and thus starting The Meme War.
Now even some CCP devs have started trolling them.
Ah, this will let B-R5RB look like a Kindergarten party.
Cry 'Havoc,' and let slip the dogs of war; That this foul deed shall smell above the earth With carrion men, groaning for burial.
I think I will pass on all the Star Citizen ships until there is a game to go with them...
Jacques d'Orleans
Banned
Not sure if this one got posted
"Let us therefore brace ourselves to our duties, and so bear ourselves that, if EvE Online and its Universe last for a thousand years, men will still say: ‘This was their finest hour."
they rip off anything they can get their dirty hands on, it's really sad actually.
I spotted that thread filled with puns and wordplay, really cracked me up. Those EVE folks are a prime example for a laid back and relaxed community. Honest tears in my eyes laughs I swear to god
I always was of the opinion that a game like Star Citizen which focuses on ships mainly should provide those ships for FREE as a form of content ingames instead its turning out to be a Real Life simulator where nothing is either free or cheap. In fact monetizing everything this heavily while the game isnt even out of alpha only shows CiGs true colors. I dont care about the standard excuse by the SC fanatics claiming its "for funding the development". At this point in development CiGs focus should be to make a working foundation, not shuffle in more money but obviously CiGs focus is all too apparent in this question. Other companies provide developer tools in their alphas or give out all the things for free to enable heavy testing.
In SC 3.2, IF it even makes it into the cut.....mining will instead be only testable for those who dig in and pay them in cash for the privilege to do so. Kind of perverse if you ask me. Of course people will defend this approach calling you all kinds of names on the process because the entitled usually dont see a problem with their entitlement regardless how unfair or broken it is.
I think it's foolish to be ignoring him. A lot of CIG and ex-CIG have been reaching out to him for years. He should be part of your recommended daily intake if you're trying to make sense of this catatrosphically failing project.
To stay on topic - there was downsizing in Jan this year and afaik the numbers and details have not been posted anywhere. John Pritchett being on video working from home, Ben & Alexis moving to Washington to 'work remotely' and Lando (and others) moving out of the allegedly subsidised apartments are the only glimpses of this we've seen (so far).
There's a lot of stuff floating around and there have been serious concerns coming from "people close to the project". There is only one person crazy enough to blurt any of it out in public. I think he's waiting for it to come out first, and I think he has genuine reason to.
I know how ridiculous this might come across but there just isn't an appreciation for the state this project is in organisationally and financially - there has been no oversight or transparency whatsoever.
However poorly backers think they've been treated and strung along all these years, factor that by ten for the folks trying to build a game and earn a living under the direction of Chris Roberts - and then wonder why so much stuff is leaking out all over the place.
They know this, they've known it for years. A full on rewrite of the networking from the metalwork up was always on the cards. Erin referred to it in a video prior to 2.2 as "the networking overhaul". This is what I was referring to when I asked Ben Parry in this very thread if they'd started it yet, he replied 'no'.
In 2017 Chris Roberts made a plea on one of the videos for networking techs.
At the end of 2017 they cranked the client count in Evocati and decided it was 'good enough'.
In 2018 Erin unveiled the plan to use instanced zones, a zone per server. That's the last ditch attempt sans proper networking and backend. Anyone can see that.
All throughout this they've marketed 'bind culling' to make it look like they're tackling the networking issue. Bind culling has been in their monthly dev schedules since June 2016.
CIG are so far out of their depth on this single issue of networking that anyone with the merest comprehension of basic comms can see that right away.
They cannot build what they're selling. It's either incompetent management or wilful deception. Take your pick....
Incompetent management.
Chris has always been a nightmare to work for. Not only is he a strong believer in micromanagement, but he also seems physically incapable if feature locking a design. Add in that he is overseeing a project in an industry he'd been removed from for about a decade and appears to be stuck in the 90s as a result....
But...yes.
Until CIG get the backend working, until they implement netcode viable for the game they want to create, until they get their server backend designed and added to the engine then most if what they are currently doing is essentially worthless. Even the NBC and OCS they are working on....I have to query if this simply optimises the existing netcode or if it (at the very least) can be scaled up so it can support the number of players and systems CIG want to have.
So much of the game design here is interconnected, with changes in networking affecting server requirements which then affect performance which then place limits on instance design which then dictates all manner of player interactions with each other and the environment which then affects balance and spawn rates, mission design and flight models which then impact on the data that needs to flow to and from each server and player and that impacts the design of each packet which then impacts on routing which impacts on network design....etc.
Which is why having a good design is important. Chris Roberts ran a Kickstarter for what is effectively S42 and added a throwaway stretchgoal of a full MMO.
You CANNOT design or build an MMO as a stretch goal. It takes a lot more work and effort to turn a 16 player multiplayer game which had limited openworld gameplay into a full blown full scale full openworld game capable if supporting 1000 players an instance.
The entire project needed to back to the design stage when CR made that decision. That design would then have provided a framework upon which to decide what game engine to use. That choice of game engine, by necessity, should have been "lets take three years to build our own"
But what about funding? Simple....he should have continued to develop the game the Kickstarter was designed and intended to create, and sold that.
It's easy to say hindsight is 20:20. Trouble is, any competent manager should have foreseen the difficulties....indeed, many did. Even Derek Smart did...he simply created a stink about something that was obvious to anyone who knew development.
Again, that's not to say CIG couldn't have made it work. CR choses a path that made development more expensive, more difficult, more time consuming....not impossible.
Today, CIG are still on that path. But that it is still technically possible for them to deliver doesn't make it likely. I still think CIG are running out of cash and are behaving like a company running out of cash.
Worse, though there are plenty of defenders, the tone on the forums is changing and becoming mire critical, more hostile and the press seems less enthralled by CIG. More, interest seems to be waning...CIG is putting more effort into fundraising but getting relatively less return for that work.
And the market has changed. Space games are still a niche, but if the niche is bigger than some thought, there is also a lot more competition. More, Star Citizen is showing its age. In 2012, its graphics were first rate. By 2013, we were already getting games that blew it out of the water. By E3 2018.....we all saw the games and how SC looks in comparison....average and inconsistent, with some parts looking great but others looking ugly.
Which is, of course, another problem Star Citizen is facing. Backers pour a lot of derision upon publishers for cancelling games or pushing them out too early.
I can sympathise with that. But there are other issues to consider. Investors want a return in their investment. Most investors are only willing to wait so long...so unless you are truly remarkable, 5 years is about how long you have.
More importantly, in some ways, the market doesn't stay still. It changes and after 5 years, those changes can be significant. A design begun with great promise can find itself released in a market where expectations have changed. One response to this is to delay release and update the game to account for changes in technology and expectations. The most extreme do a complete engine overhaul or even replacement.
At 6 years and more of development, Star Citizen is approaching that point in its life cycle when such a tech refresh needs to be considered. Or...should be. It wouldn't be the first game to do so, won't be the last.
But right now, it is using Lumberyard...modified. And CryEngine 3.....modified. And quite a bit of it is missing and quite a bit doesn't appear to work correctly.
The market is going to change even more by the time it is released...if it is released and the game design and looks and engine don't seem to reflect that.
Even tho I sometimes would hope for a bit more "rubbing" and "teasing" towards Star Citizen from the rest of the industry I also am glad that most folks either ignore CiG outright or mention them in as neutral a tone as possible. Going into the trash talking routine really affects your professionalism and how others see you as is evident with certain individuals. Still not an excuse for all the gaming magazines IMO who trip around the issue like a minefield or outright shill the thing because its their job to transport an opinion but anyway.
Remember how the SC community hoped for some real gamechanger in Star Citizen when they theorized other companies would approach CiG in order to lease or purchase user rights to all the incredible technology and tools CiG was surely inventing as we speak? Well either CiG is showing possible interested parties some very different samples then what the cash mules are getting (alpha) or there arent any. And while other companies who do get this threatment dont mention Star Citizen I m sure it stings to see that such an often smashed and condemned game (shallow, bad, copycat, lolz) obviously delivered enough quality and radiates competence to a degree that makes others approach them in search for business partners.
Or do you think its possible what the SC rumor mill says? That there are actually a TON of investors all approaching CiG to get in on the winning horse but everybody keeps quiet about it for some obscure reasons?
Remember how the SC community hoped for some real gamechanger in Star Citizen when they theorized other companies would approach CiG in order to lease or purchase user rights to all the incredible technology and tools CiG was surely inventing as we speak? Well either CiG is showing possible interested parties some very different samples then what the cash mules are getting (alpha) or there arent any. And while other companies who do get this threatment dont mention Star Citizen I m sure it stings to see that such an often smashed and condemned game (shallow, bad, copycat, lolz) obviously delivered enough quality and radiates competence to a degree that makes others approach them in search for business partners.
Or do you think its possible what the SC rumor mill says? That there are actually a TON of investors all approaching CiG to get in on the winning horse but everybody keeps quiet about it for some obscure reasons?
Not seen that one - the one I saw was the opposite that investors were being looked for but no-one was interested.
Frankly I take both with a lorry load of salt.
That said I'm struggling to see how anyone would consider it a worthwhile investment given the state it seems to be in and the court case hanging over it.
- Status