This game has become to complex (to use).
- Thread starter OxKing
- Start date
The Codex creates a framework by which this kind of information can be made available in-game. I'm hoping that over time, they'll expand the codex to cover all these sorts of details, and then I think the complexity will be nice - ignore it when you're not interested, whereas when you need to know then you can consult and figure out from theoretical info what to do... and then try to put it into practice and see what happens! 
As it stands in the beta, the Codex is insufficient, but hopefully it will be expanded rapidly. Or at least expanded...
As it stands in the beta, the Codex is insufficient, but hopefully it will be expanded rapidly. Or at least expanded...
Its ok lads Ive got your theme tune.
[video=youtube;fQO5yeVJdaI]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fQO5yeVJdaI[/video]
Never understood the whole "real gamer" bulls waste, been gaming since I was 7, and now I'm 48 does that make me a "real gamer"...
There are some games I play as a casual and some I sink more hours into that I care to admit.
As for the OP, I agree this is not a game that is user friendly for the new player, but then nor wa Eve when I started playing that and after six years of play before I parked up my Anathema there was still so much I didn't know.
Even though I find social media to be a bane of today's society I am thankful for youtube.
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It's 3am, the rest of the raid wants to have one more go, you have an important meeting at 9am with your boss about your 'future', AND you need the toilet. What do you do...?
1) Pee in a mountain dew bottle, spark up another onionhead cigarette, buff the party and pretype LEEEEROOOOOY JENKIIIIIIIINS in the chat in anticipation of the pull.
2) Say sorry guys, you have to work tomorrow, pack it up and shut down.
Only one of these people is a hardcore gamer.
As regards the OP. When you are inside a (game) system, changes to it are more obvious, you have to unlearn and relearn something. 2 steps.
When you are learning a system for the first time, regardless of logic or complexity, you slowly gain an understanding of the game and you store the knowledge you acquire compartmentally and accept it is 'how the game works', regardless of judgments concerning propriety or logic. You've never known any other way to play the game, so you build a knowledgebase of expectations which remains valid until the change is introduced. Then you are either resistant or positive to that change. The first time player (like the goldfish in a bowl) has nothing to compare to.
The reason this game has problems with player retention is because of the fake time sinks.
1) Pee in a mountain dew bottle, spark up another onionhead cigarette, buff the party and pretype LEEEEROOOOOY JENKIIIIIIIINS in the chat in anticipation of the pull.
2) Say sorry guys, you have to work tomorrow, pack it up and shut down.
Only one of these people is a hardcore gamer.
As regards the OP. When you are inside a (game) system, changes to it are more obvious, you have to unlearn and relearn something. 2 steps.
When you are learning a system for the first time, regardless of logic or complexity, you slowly gain an understanding of the game and you store the knowledge you acquire compartmentally and accept it is 'how the game works', regardless of judgments concerning propriety or logic. You've never known any other way to play the game, so you build a knowledgebase of expectations which remains valid until the change is introduced. Then you are either resistant or positive to that change. The first time player (like the goldfish in a bowl) has nothing to compare to.
The reason this game has problems with player retention is because of the fake time sinks.
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So much disagree.
Engineers, Tech brokers & alien tech .. are not "necessary", you can jump in any stock Sidewinder and bounty hunt, smuggle, trade, explore without any of them. What they are is extensions to delve into if you want, you don't have to though. Mining with laser/refinery will also still be possible for beginners in 3.3, new mechanics just another extension. C&P isn't complex either .. break obvious laws? Expect justice imo.
I'm sure the new exploration system will want a tutorial but it finally puts a scientific slant on how to find planets, much more consistent with a hi-tech future than honk and fly ever was. If you don't like complex technology, space travel possibly isn't for you then; the Saturn V rocket and ISS are up there with some of the most complex machines every built, necessarily because space is a deeply hostile environment and pre-industrial tribes that rely on bows and arrows are yet to put a man on the moon afaik.
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The manual was really handy in 2014/5 its been superseded now though by things like Inara and the wiki. FDEV can see how times its accessed I'd assume so maybe its just not popular enough to be worth the effort.
Exactly! The game isn't too complex, it just isn't accessible which is a short coming in design in my opinion.
![[VR] Mad Mike](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/27/27910.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
i kind of agree.... it is kind of a tug of war in a way, because i DO want much more complexity in the game, however with that complexity i think means the ui needs a lot of work.... imo good controls and good ui mean that we can do very complex things without even knowing we are doing it........ Some of the stuff in ED isnt really intuitive at all. (why do we have 1 button to go into a scanning mode and a different mode to exit?, why do i ever see "you cant use this <item> in this hud mode - imo as an option either remove the option to select none relevant items when in the wrong hud mode OR just switch to the correct mode automatically (i prefer the former as it means we can assign the same controls multiple times but if it is an option then even better)
but most of all the game needs better documentation, as well as a live ingame tutorial to handhold us through all the features at the start - possibly to earn our wings in the pilots federation???
![[VR] Frank_G](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/59/59394.jpg?1553527111){kind=avatar}
Very relaxing - best done before one gets seated to floor the thruster pedals
This is a spaceship sim. It is meant to be complex and in my opinion it is going the absolute right way. The fact that you don't need to rely on any of those mechanics makes a newcomer able to focus on whatever activity is desired in the game.
The true learning curve is to learn how to pass the mail slot and dock, how to avoid jettisoning cargo by accident or boost into the station wall and of course finding yourself in a shiny Sidewinder for the second time, so you don't ever fly without insurance again.
Very relaxing - best done before one gets seated to floor the thruster pedals
This is a spaceship sim. It is meant to be complex and in my opinion it is going the absolute right way. The fact that you don't need to rely on any of those mechanics makes a newcomer able to focus on whatever activity is desired in the game.
The true learning curve is to learn how to pass the mail slot and dock, how to avoid jettisoning cargo by accident or boost into the station wall and of course finding yourself in a shiny Sidewinder for the second time, so you don't ever fly without insurance again.
The game wouldn't become less complex if there would be just one context sensitive limpet type rather than 5 different controllers and limpets. It would become less clumsy though.
The same applies to all the different scanners, sensors and mining equipment.
The problem isn't how complicated elite is but that the stuff doesn't make sense, for example c&p, mission system, bgs states, new PWS and mining etc. list goes on. None are complicated but make little sense. Stuff need to be explained to many because its not obvious for player who use it. PWS doesn't highlight asteroids with the highest and most dense metal contents which is the logical expectation most if not all who have played beta made when they installed it. Some bother to seek how it actually woks, but many just deemed it bugged.
Players should be able to work out how systems in a game work by looking at the system and making logical conclusion. Elite doesn't exist in a vacuum and Fdev should design things so stuff make sense to people. Player should never have a need to look up how something works in generally.
Players should be able to work out how systems in a game work by looking at the system and making logical conclusion. Elite doesn't exist in a vacuum and Fdev should design things so stuff make sense to people. Player should never have a need to look up how something works in generally.
relative to what it does? yes, it is. of course it's much more complex to take off in a plane in il2-sturmovik in full realistic simulation mode, but there you are actually simulating a real takeoff, that's the goal.
the point here is that to collect some materials you need 3 different hardpoints (while firegroups are limited to 2), switch between two artificial modes, of course needing two specific bindings, and several controls more to bind for scanning. yes, for what it does it is indeed quite complex. and it will get even more complex if frontier keeps adding 'core' (joke) stuff in this fashion without streamlining the 'core' (serious) mechanics and interface first.
I agree with the 'clumsy' description.