Newcomer / Intro Trading efficiency

Andravez

Andravez
Commander's.

I have been trading the two last days with very little result. I trade silver and other metals from Dahan to Aluin. Stopping in between at Eranin to supply them with agricultur tech from Aluin. And from there I pick up liquer,wine and tobacco for the desolate station in Dahan. And then back again to Aluin with the metals.

One run gives me ca 8k. I have 14 slots in my cargo hold.

If you have any suggestion as to how to improve the efficiency of trading I would love to hear your ideas. Because it seems to me that I'm wasting more fuel than the amount of profit coming in, in the long run.

And the trade data is faulty. Ex: I see a system importing performance enhancer, so i grab that with me, when I come to the destination it is a profit loss. Is the trading buggy ? I would love to get some insight on this, maybe someone can link a simple trading tutorial video explaining it properly and thourgouhly , though it would be preferable to get your take on this.

Peace :)
 

Tsunamicom

T
Look for High Population, Wealthy stations. I've noticed they have a tendency to have the most stock and demand, and usually you can buy low from them and sell high because of this without having to change up your route too often. Look for HIGH Supply and HIGH Demand items. Then narrow the items down that are a good bit below or above the Galactic Average (500-1000 credits). Usually these are the more expensive items (Gold/Palladium/etc).

Also, never ever buy anything in advance of a trade route. Always scout out your route and then come back. The exception being trading in rares, where you just need to sell anywhere between 140-160LY away from the station you bought the commodity.

Also, check this out: http://i.imgur.com/ang1e0I.jpg

Try to find routes that don't make you travel too far (both jumping and also while frame-shifting in-system). Anything past 1,000-1,500 Ls might take you way too long to travel the route. Try to find a route that is similar to: Buy from A, Sell at B, Buy from B, Sell at A. Or do something like A-->B-->C-->A.

If you're having issues with fuel costs, try using a fuel scoop. Most of the time, though, the time wasted scooping fuel cuts too far into your profit margin for consecutive runs (depending on the ship of course).

The trade data usually reflects when a system buys a particular product; Remember that it's not just system-based, but station-based as well.
If you get really lucky you can find a route that is strictly between two stations of the same system, although this is rare.
 
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DCello

DCello
First of all, your priority should be to change the ship whenever you got money enough to buy a new one + it's rebuy cost. That will increase your cargo hold, which will increase your profits. If you can't change ships soon, try upgrading your cargo racks.

Missions are a nice source of profit early on, specially haulage ones. Those are the ones where the station *gives* you the cargo and asks you to deliver somewhere else. They usually pay from 3k to 180k for those and your only expense is the fuel =)
 

gooddoc

gooddoc
iv got myself what i think is a nice little earner for now...iv got one system that i take Beryllium to & make profits of 900cr per ton & then return with Bertrandite & make 600cr per ton...iv just bought myself a Cobra & upped the cargo to 36 ton, so thats 32.4k profit one way & 21.6k on the return....more if i can get some missions between these two stations
 

Andravez

Andravez
Nice route and even nicer profits, gooddoc:)

Thank you Tsunamicom, that clarified a lot. As explained in the top post, it seems like I have been using the enroute to stations, A-->B-->C-->A. I think I need to take notes on the supplies at each station. I can't remember all the markets. Or maybe just change systems. Where I'm at now the stations and systems are too far apart. Only short route near me is Aluin to/from Rakapila. But there is only booze, auto fabricators,he suits,clothing and consumer commodities to trade between.

Sidenote: I'am where I'm at now because I want to stay close to Sol. Upon recieving permit it's only a few jumps, I think. But I digress.. It will be a while until that permit is recieved since I have only done trading, and have no reputation to speak of..

@DCello, I did upgrade to the hauler, but that got sold quickly. Too few hardpoints imo. I then changed to Viper. And I like this vessel very much. But I only get to lift 14tons. Got rid of discovery scanner and shield generator. No weapons - I have invested what I have in trade. And interdictions isn't that big of a threat.

Are there other components I can replace with more cargo stacks? I only get to change the shield generator and discovery scanner into cargo stacks, as mentioned above.
 

BigBadB

B
I think the Hauler and the Viper have the same cargo capacity (Max of 22 tons if you have no shield, although I prefer having one).

(The Viper is really intended as a combat ship.)

I think the Adder can carry 26t without shields, and then the next step up is the Cobra.
 

Andravez

Andravez
@ HipToss. Idk rly. I want to earn credits enough to get a big ship, that can combat as well as hauling bigger amounts of cargo. Trading and mining will be my first priorities. However, when I get interdicted I like to fight a bit also, to get acquainted with dogfighting, in space :)

I think i have wasted both time and creds because of the lack of experience and efficiency. I chose the Viper because it had 2x medium hardpoints and 2 small hardp. Ah, plenty firepower I thought. But I do not have weapons. Nor will I acquire weapons until I'm either bored of trading or have plenty creds.

Furthermore, I crashed inside a station once, carrying over 60k worth of goods. Spacedust now...Used an entire day just to get back that amount. I think I got restless and careless when docking, too much speed on a 180 turn inside station makes you stall, or should I say, loses lift, because the angle of attack is decreased. Caused by the gravitational differences inside each station, I assume.

@BigBadB. I consider the adder heavily. But I do not have the creds yet. But how do I get 22tons in the Viper, what do I need to sell? I currently only have 3x4cargo hold and 1x2cargo hold = 14.
 

HipToss

HipToss
I used a hauler with zero shields, 20t cargo. Went to the Type 6 no shields 116t cargo. Now in the Type 9 and several other fighting ships sprinkled around my current system.
 

DCello

DCello
Andravez said:
@ HipToss. Idk rly. I want to earn credits enough to get a big ship, that can combat as well as hauling bigger amounts of cargo. Trading and mining will be my first priorities. However, when I get interdicted I like to fight a bit also, to get acquainted with dogfighting, in space :)

I think i have wasted both time and creds because of the lack of experience and efficiency. I chose the Viper because it had 2x medium hardpoints and 2 small hardp. Ah, plenty firepower I thought. But I do not have weapons. Nor will I acquire weapons until I'm either bored of trading or have plenty creds.

Furthermore, I crashed inside a station once, carrying over 60k worth of goods. Spacedust now...Used an entire day just to get back that amount. I think I got restless and careless when docking, too much speed on a 180 turn inside station makes you stall, or should I say, loses lift, because the angle of attack is decreased. Caused by the gravitational differences inside each station, I assume.

@BigBadB. I consider the adder heavily. But I do not have the creds yet. But how do I get 22tons in the Viper, what do I need to sell? I currently only have 3x4cargo hold and 1x2cargo hold = 14.
Click to expand...

I *strongly* consider you trade your Viper in for something else. It's absolutely, completely, totally unfitted for trading in any kind, shape, or form. If you trade it in for a new ship, you get around 75% of the value back (exact percentage escapes me). Also, any module bought can be sold for the same price you paid, so have fun experimenting and switching them about.

About crashing inside a station, there is no lift and the gravity is only 0.1g, making it virtually impossible to stall. However you are dealing with Newtonian physics, meaning that if you enter a station above 25% thrust, you *are* going to keep going even if you turn around. So until you get confident enough to do sweeping landings at full speed, practice slowly (activating your landing gears lowers the ship's terminal velocity, allowing you to learn to dock in higher speeds since you can't go as fast as you normally can).
 

Andravez

Andravez
Nicely put, now I learned something new(tonian) today as well :) Math was never my strong side:p

Ok, I will change ships. I also have the sidewinder stored, stripped, with no value on it. If I re-equip it will it be valuable again, or just the amount you spend returned on modules etc.?

@ HipToss. I don't think I understand the cargo properly. If I have 14 slots, that is equal to 14 tons? And the types you are talking about, is that an class upgraded cargo hold?
 

Andravez

Andravez
@HipToss. How do you get so big cargo hold for the hauler..? What else can I sell on my vessel, to trade in for more cargo space?

Have not played for an entire day. Getting the, what u call it, sigh. Whatever.. I will pick a new ship today, no doubt about it :)
 

Nounverber

Nounverber
For max cargo on any ship you would sell the shield generator and basic discovery scanner and run the largest cargo racks available to each slot.
 

Andravez

Andravez
Nounverber said:
For max cargo on any ship you would sell the shield generator and basic discovery scanner and run the largest cargo racks available to each slot.
Click to expand...
Ok, I have done so. But only got 14 slots for the hauler and Viper. Could anyone tell me where I can buy the Adder BigBadB speaks of ?
 

HipToss

HipToss
You can upgrade existing cargo racks from 4 to 8 I believe. Its been a long time since my hauler days. Check the existing cargo racks you have to see if you can increase their size.
 

Andravez

Andravez
HipToss said:
You can upgrade existing cargo racks from 4 to 8 I believe. Its been a long time since my hauler days. Check the existing cargo racks you have to see if you can increase their size.
Click to expand...

Ah, yes, I just found that out. :eek:

Well, now I have 22 slots. Would it be advisable to drop the small 2x cargo rack with the basic shield bank cell? And, that Adder vessel..Can not find it. So I guess I'll stay with the viper for now.
 

HipToss

HipToss
Andravez said:
Ah, yes, I just found that out. :eek:

Well, now I have 22 slots. Would it be advisable to drop the small 2x cargo rack with the basic shield bank cell? And, that Adder vessel..Can not find it. So I guess I'll stay with the viper for now.
Click to expand...

Honestly the ship is so cheap with insurance, I kept the extra cargo = extra profit. Really never had to worry about interdictions, unless I was carrying all gold :)
 

DCello

DCello
Andravez said:
Ah, yes, I just found that out. :eek:

Well, now I have 22 slots. Would it be advisable to drop the small 2x cargo rack with the basic shield bank cell? And, that Adder vessel..Can not find it. So I guess I'll stay with the viper for now.
Click to expand...

Cargo racks max upgrade levels work like this:
Class 1 - 2 tons
Class 2 - 4 tons
Class 3 - 8 tons
Class 4 - 16 tons
So on and on.

As far as flying without shields go, is up to the pilot. Some rather have an extra cargo rack, some rather have protection between their hull and space - and please note that shieldless, *any* hit equals damage, which equals repairs, which equals money. So I always fly with shields on, since I want something else between me and the cold vastness of space than just a flimsy piece of metal =P

About the Adder, it is hard to tell you exactly where it is in a galaxy of 400 billion star systems. If you fly around enough, you will find it. Where are you located? Empire Space, Federation space, name a few nearby systems so I can give you station names nearby. ;)
 
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