VKB 2 stage trigger question

[Fnord Velkor]

Good thing you chose such a sublte material color. Those levers don't look like they are painted into the photo with crayons at all

I have to admit that the whole idea of spending hundreds on a throttle and then bolting-on a throttle lever to that throttle seems very weird. (Yes I can see why they are doing it, it just makes my teeth itch.)

 

[Pville_Piper]

Good thing you chose such a sublte material color. Those levers don't look like they are painted into the photo with crayons at all

I'm grateful my brother didn't pick hot pink!

Ooooh wow, I don't recall ever knowing that

See, you never know what you might pickup whilst perusing the forums... One reason I started this thread and continued to share. Sometimes, someone posts a helpful tidbit!

 

[Pville_Piper]

I have to admit that the whole idea of spending hundreds on a throttle and then bolting-on a throttle lever to that throttle seems very weird. (Yes I can see why they are doing it, it just makes my teeth itch.)

I must admit I feel the same, but flying last night proved thier worth. The handle sits at the right height so that my hand naturally rests on the lever while resting on and extending from the arm rest. No more fumbling around looking for the switch when trying to land, best of all, you can't miss these!

 

[Pville_Piper]

Read more answer by following the this link:
[REDACTED - Sorted]

Don't go there

 

[Pville_Piper]

Don't go there

the middle section takes you to a site off the forums

 

[Neilski]

the middle section takes you to a site off the forums

Reported

 

[Ian Phillips]

Thanks everyone - it's been dealt with!

 

[Lhorndra]

Is this a function/option within Elite or is it the VKB software? I had no idea this was possible

As @Helmut Grokenberger said, the game can distinguish between short and long press. However, with the VKB software, you can fine tune it even more. You can define at least 3 different logical button numbers to one single physical button, maybe more (I don’t have it in front of me now). So just as an example you could define this:
short-press A2 = JOY 10
long-press A2 = JOY 11
double klick A2 = JOY 12

For the game (or any kind of app really), it looks like you would press three totally different independent buttons. However, be aware that ED can only process 32 buttons per device.

 

[Neilski]

As @Helmut Grokenberger said, the game can distinguish between short and long press. However, with the VKB software, you can fine tune it even more. You can define at least 3 different logical button numbers to one single physical button, maybe more (I don’t have it in front of me now). So just as an example you could define this:
short-press A2 = JOY 10
long-press A2 = JOY 11
double klick A2 = JOY 12

For the game (or any kind of app really), it looks like you would press three totally different independent buttons. However, be aware that ED can only process 32 buttons per device.

Nice! And does the VKB software automagically hide the real A2 button when you create a mapping like that, so that the game doesn't detect multiple things? (I've not yet used HidHide but I think I might need it soon.)

 

[Lhorndra]

Nice! And does the VKB software automagically hide the real A2 button when you create a mapping like that, so that the game doesn't detect multiple things? (I've not yet used HidHide but I think I might need it soon.)

I'm not sure I understand your question correctly, so please bear with me.

Windows (or any operating system) doesn't see an A2 or any real physical buttons at all. The processor of the Gladiator emulates "a joystick" for Windows, and you can "build" this virtual joystick with the VKB software, so to speak. If you set the number of buttons to 128 in the VKB software, then Windows will see a joystick with 128 buttons. If you set it to 32, Windows will think this controller has 32 buttons. If you deactivate all axes in the software, then Windows will think this controller doesn't have any axes, regardless of how many axes the real world Gladiator has.

So, if you program the A2 button to trigger logical button #1 on a short press and logical button #29 on a long press, then Windows (and ED for that matter) will see that the button #1 ("JOY 1" in ED) was pressed when you short press the real world A2 button, and it will think that a button #29 was pressed when you long press A2. It doesn't know that it's the same physical button at all. You can even program the length of that logical button press in milliseconds, and the exact time period after which a long press instead of a short press should register. You can also generate a periodical pulse (JOY 1 pressed, JOY 1 released, pause, JOY 1 pressed, JOY 1 released ...) and all sorts of mind boggling stuff.

 

[Neilski]

Windows (or any operating system) doesn't see an A2 or any real physical buttons at all. The processor of the Gladiator emulates "a joystick" for Windows, and you can "build" this virtual joystick with the VKB software, so to speak.

Ahhh, I get the idea now, thanks.

 

[pFVD]

Thanks @Pville_Piper @Helmut Grokenberger @Lhorndra !
I knew you could use hold functions for some of the buttons; the option is right there as a toggle in the menu's. I had know idea it was possible with most/all the buttons. I've spent the last couple of days redoing my binds. Things I find obvious/intuitive but have never worked, now do e.g. having boost and 100% speed on the same button, or night vision and lights. This frees up buttons I can now use for other things I'd like easy and quick access to.

 

[Pville_Piper]

Thanks @Pville_Piper @Helmut Grokenberger @Lhorndra !
I knew you could use hold functions for some of the buttons; the option is right there as a toggle in the menu's. I had know idea it was possible with most/all the buttons. I've spent the last couple of days redoing my binds. Things I find obvious/intuitive but have never worked, now do e.g. having boost and 100% speed on the same button, or night vision and lights. This frees up buttons I can now use for other things I'd like easy and quick access to.

Cool, use the EDRefCard and share so we all might learn something!

 

[- Mando -]

Yes, I use both stages for primary and secondary fire. Of course, you'll need to bind secondary fire to another button to trigger your second weapon seperately. Depending on the situation and the loadout, pulling the trigger all the way back to fire all you have can be really satisfying. My usual setup:

• Primary Fire: fire trigger stage 1
• Secondary Fire: fire trigger stage 2 & button A2

On my left omni throttle, I don't use an axis for throttle. Instead, all axes are bound to thrusters. So, during combat I just set my throttle to 50% via button and then manage thrusters with the 3 grip axes. That works exceptionally well for me. Also, with 6 very precise axes and the throttle set to 0, tricky landings are a lot easier now. So I've come up with these bindings for my left stick to manage the throttle:

• Throttle -100% (full reverse): long press button B1
• Throttle 0% (all stop): short press button B1
• Throttle 50%: pull rapid fire (B2)
• Throttle 75%: push rapid fire (B2)
• Decrease throttle continuously: button A2
• Increase throttle continuously: fire trigger stage 1
• Throttle 100%: fire trigger stage 2

So, to continuously increase the throttle, I pull the trigger to stage 1, but if I want 100% instantly, I pull the trigger all the way to stage 2. You can see the whole shebang in the attached file.

Another rather unusual thing you could do, if you travel a lot:

• Target next system in route: fire trigger stage 1
• Hyperspace jump: fire trigger stage 2

I haven't tried this yet, but with the analogue ministicks of both grips, on-foot combat might be as precise as with a gamepad. There, you could bind “Open Item Wheel” to stage 1 and “Open Emote Wheel” to stage 2 on the left stick.

I know this post is over a year old, but I just found it and I really, REALLY like your setup! I would change up the A4 and C1 like you mentioned when replying to Helmut Grokenberger. That combo would be ideal for me (I think). Just 2 questions.
1) Did you set up macros for the pips in your setup A3 "Long Press"?
2) Would you mind sharing your key binds file, so as to same me the time from mapping all the buttons individually?
Thanks for all the great info on this post by you and all the others

 

[Lhorndra]

I know this post is over a year old, but I just found it and I really, REALLY like your setup!

Thanks a lot!

1) Did you set up macros for the pips in your setup A3 "Long Press"?

Yes, I did, using the VKB software. All the other "long press" options are simply mapped to a different button number.

2) Would you mind sharing your key binds file, so as to same me the time from mapping all the buttons individually?

I modded my whole bindings setup quite a lot, so you can't just drop my .binds in your ...\Options\Bindings folder, I'm afraid. What you need to do:

1. Find DeviceMappings.xml in ...\Elite Dangerous\Products\elite-dangerous-odyssey-64\ControlSchemes
2. Insert the following lines right before the very last line that only contains </Root>:
   <VKBGladiatorEVOSpace> <PID>0200</PID> <VID>231D</VID> </VKBGladiatorEVOSpace> <VKBGladiatorEVOOmni> <PID>3201</PID> <VID>231D</VID> </VKBGladiatorEVOOmni>
   Make sure that your sticks really have those PIDs, otherwise change the PIDs here.
   This is a step you need to repeat after every update, but it's the only step here where this is neccessary.
3. In your options folder (usually at ...\AppData\Local\Frontier Developments\Elite Dangerous\Options\Bindings), create the folder DeviceButtonMaps.
4. Copy my two .buttonMap.txt files to that folder.
5. Rename .buttonMap.txt to .buttonMap (you can't upload files with a .buttonMap extension in this forum)
6. (Semi)Finally, you can drop my .binds.txt into ...\Options\Bindings
7. Rename .binds.txt to .binds
8. Now you have nice icons in some of the in-game button info, instead of JOY_15 etc.

I hope I have made no mistakes here. It's a convoluted mess.

Alternatively:

1. Download my .binds.txt and rename it to .binds
2. Drop it into ...\Options\Bindings
3. Search and replace every single VKBGladiatorEVOSpace with 231D0200
   (I think that ID is correct for all VKB Nxt Evos, but do look up the correct number in your own *.binds file)
4. Search and replace every single VKBGladiatorEVOOmni with 231D3201
   (again, that number should work for all VKB Nxt Evo Omnis)
5. Done, but no nice icons for you

Another word of caution, though: I've changed my bindings quite a bit since my last post here, especially the A4/C1 hats. I've found that I can't always use C1 reliably in the heat of a battle, so I put the countermeasures on A4. Also, because I almost never use ship launched fighters, I put them on the right C1 which I happily ignore most of the time.

EDIT: With the vanilla, unaltered files of the game, these icons are meant to show up when using a Logitech/Saitek X52 Pro, so not every icon fits the VKB Gladiator perfectly. You can read more about icons in the file ...\Elite Dangerous\Products\elite-dangerous-odyssey-64\ControlSchemes\DeviceButtonMaps\Readme.txt

 

[Pville_Piper]

@Lhorndra I don't know if I can recommend this anymore. The 3d printed throttles have both brown a couple of times and now the throttle tab on the Omni throttle is broken.

 

[- Mando -]

Thanks a lot!


Yes, I did, using the VKB software. All the other "long press" options are simply mapped to a different button number.


I modded my whole bindings setup quite a lot, so you can't just drop my .binds in your ...\Options\Bindings folder, I'm afraid. What you need to do:

1. Find DeviceMappings.xml in ...\Elite Dangerous\Products\elite-dangerous-odyssey-64\ControlSchemes
2. Insert the following lines right before the very last line that only contains </Root>:
   <VKBGladiatorEVOSpace> <PID>0200</PID> <VID>231D</VID> </VKBGladiatorEVOSpace> <VKBGladiatorEVOOmni> <PID>3201</PID> <VID>231D</VID> </VKBGladiatorEVOOmni>
   Make sure that your sticks really have those PIDs, otherwise change the PIDs here.
   This is a step you need to repeat after every update, but it's the only step here where this is neccessary.
3. In your options folder (usually at ...\AppData\Local\Frontier Developments\Elite Dangerous\Options\Bindings), create the folder DeviceButtonMaps.
4. Copy my two .buttonMap.txt files to that folder.
5. Rename .buttonMap.txt to .buttonMap (you can't upload files with a .buttonMap extension in this forum)
6. (Semi)Finally, you can drop my .binds.txt into ...\Options\Bindings
7. Rename .binds.txt to .binds
8. Now you have nice icons in some of the in-game button info, instead of JOY_15 etc.

I hope I have made no mistakes here. It's a convoluted mess.

Alternatively:

1. Download my .binds.txt and rename it to .binds
2. Drop it into ...\Options\Bindings
3. Search and replace every single VKBGladiatorEVOSpace with 231D0200
   (I think that ID is correct for all VKB Nxt Evos, but do look up the correct number in your own *.binds file)
4. Search and replace every single VKBGladiatorEVOOmni with 231D3201
   (again, that number should work for all VKB Nxt Evo Omnis)
5. Done, but no nice icons for you

Another word of caution, though: I've changed my bindings quite a bit since my last post here, especially the A4/C1 hats. I've found that I can't always use C1 reliably in the heat of a battle, so I put the countermeasures on A4. Also, because I almost never use ship launched fighters, I put them on the right C1 which I happily ignore most of the time.

Just wanted to say a quick THANK YOU for such a lengthy and detailed write up. I will try this out as soon as I get a chance.

Also wanted to ask, what is the best way to reach out to you again if I have a question or two. I can reply here or message you privately. I don't mind either way.

Again, Thank you!

 

[Lhorndra]

Also wanted to ask, what is the best way to reach out to you again if I have a question or two. I can reply here or message you privately. I don't mind either way.

If you ask here, others with similar issues/questions may be able to also benefit.
Although I suspect with every new post, we stray further and further away from the OP by @Pville_Piper

 

[Pville_Piper]

If you ask here, others with similar issues/questions may be able to also benefit.
Although I suspect with every new post, we stray further and further away from the OP by @Pville_Piper

no worries

 

[- Mando -]

If you ask here, others with similar issues/questions may be able to also benefit.
Although I suspect with every new post, we stray further and further away from the OP by @Pville_Piper

Quick update. I don't have the GladiatorEVOs or the Omni. I have two older GladiatorNXTs but figured that all the buttons are in the same places so it should hopefully work.

I was able to follow the steps in your first option. I liked the idea of nice icons (question about that below). The only thing I had to do was change the PIDs for my particular sticks, just like you said. Everything after that also worked perfectly and now, I have everything mapped the way I want/need.

8. Now you have nice icons in some of the in-game button info, instead of JOY_15 etc.

I didn't get a chance to play much after changing things up but the only icons I saw were in the options menu when you are mapping/binding buttons. Is that what you meant? Or do you get the nice icons in the ships HUD while you are playing?

Thanks