VKB 2 stage trigger question

[Lhorndra]

I was able to follow the steps in your first option. I liked the idea of nice icons (question about that below). The only thing I had to do was change the PIDs for my particular sticks, just like you said. Everything after that also worked perfectly and now, I have everything mapped the way I want/need.

That's great! You can change the name of a button/hat in the .buttonMap files to your liking, but I guess you figured that out already.

I didn't get a chance to play much after changing things up but the only icons I saw were in the options menu when you are mapping/binding buttons. Is that what you meant? Or do you get the nice icons in the ships HUD while you are playing?

They should show up in some parts of the HUD as well, yes. For example, in the "Press X for disembark options" right in the middle of your canopy window, or in the help text on the bottom of the FSS, the galaxy map, the system map, and the camera suite.

By the way, I used the icons that are meant to be for the Logitech/Saitek X52 Pro, so not every icon fits the look of the VKB Gladiator perfectly. You can read more about the available icons in the file ...\Elite Dangerous\Products\elite-dangerous-odyssey-64\ControlSchemes\DeviceButtonMaps\Readme.txt

 

[- Mando -]

You can change the name of a button/hat in the .buttonMap files to your liking, but I guess you figured that out already.

Didn't really think about that but good to know!

They should show up in some parts of the HUD as well, yes. For example, in the "Press X for disembark options" right in the middle of your canopy window, or in the help text on the bottom of the FSS, the galaxy map, the system map, and the camera suite.

Ok, that makes sense. I have some time to play today so will be looking for those.

You can read more about the available icons in the file ...\Elite Dangerous\Products\elite-dangerous-odyssey-64\ControlSchemes\DeviceButtonMaps\Readme.txt

Also good to know. Never really bothered with going through all this stuff before or even knew where to find it.

Very much appreciate all the great information. After years playing the game, this is one aspect I spent very little time on and I'm definitely learning some things.

Thank you!

 

[UberDuper]

Using two gladiators in a hosas setup, I have the first stage of each trigger assigned to primary and secondary fire. Second stage places a "hold" on the first stage so I can release the triggers completely and they'll keep firing. Pressing the first stage again will release the hold. Good for mining and ax cold orbiting.

 

[- Mando -]

Using two gladiators in a hosas setup, I have the first stage of each trigger assigned to primary and secondary fire. Second stage places a "hold" on the first stage so I can release the triggers completely and they'll keep firing. Pressing the first stage again will release the hold. Good for mining and ax cold orbiting.

How are you doing ax cold orbiting with two gladiators? Do you need to set up curves or something? I tried a bit here and there but I just can't seem to control the ship with FA off.

 

[pFVD]

Second stage places a "hold" on the first stage so I can release the triggers completely and they'll keep firing.

Is this done via the VKB software? I've taken to not using the second stage at all but this would open up possibilities that wouldn't strain my delicate manly fingers too much. And I presume you just pull the trigger again to cancel it?

 

[UberDuper]

How are you doing ax cold orbiting with two gladiators?

Short answer: Badly.

Long answer: I do alright with cyclops, basilisk and medusa. Hydra has been a wall for me. I flew FA on up until a few months ago. With FA on, I was able to get 2 or 3 hearts on a hydra semi consistently. I wasn't able to progress from there and decided flight assist was holding me back. So I started over with cyclops FA off and I've worked my way back up to hydra. I'm not as good as I was before with FA on, but I'm still trying to get better. I can occasionally get 2 hydra hearts, but my aim is pretty bad and I end up having to re-exert hearts once or twice and burn through a whole lot of gauss synth materials. Extends the fights until I inevitably screw up my orbit and die.

 

[UberDuper]

Is this done via the VKB software? I've taken to not using the second stage at all but this would open up possibilities that wouldn't strain my delicate manly fingers too much. And I presume you just pull the trigger again to cancel it?

Yes it's done in VKB config. After the second stage hold is applied, I can pull just to first stage and if I hold that it'll keep firing. If I release it, it'll stop firing.

On my stick;
first stage trigger is Physical Button 10 (P10) and it is mapped to Logical Button 1 (L1). This is the default
second stage trigger is P9 and maps to L2. I change P9 to be a "ButAlt" type of button with Def. State: Off, Set: Off, Pulse: unchecked, still mapped to L2. This makes a P9 press toggle L2 on or off.

Then I add two booleans;
L2 NOT Virtual Button 10 (V10) - So when L2 is "on" (because P9 toggles L2 on), V10 will also be pressed. which causes L1 to be on, firing the weapon. When L2 is off, the bool doesn't match and it does nothing.
L2, P10 2AND P9 - This works out to 'if L2 is on and P10 is pressed, press P9'. So if we've activated the stage 2 hold, L2 will be on and if we then pull the stage 1 trigger, pressing P10, the boolean will press P9, which then toggles L2 off, making the previous boolean stop pressing V10. If I'm still holding the stage 1 trigger, P10 is still being pressed, and so we're still firing even tho the boolean is no longer keeping V10 pressed. When I release the stage 1 trigger, nothing is keeping V10 or P10 pressed, and it stops firing.

Hope that makes sense. The way VKBConfig works is pretty confusing. I can post some screenshots later if needed.

 

[UberDuper]

Do you need to set up curves or something?

I forgot to answer this one. Yes I use some very shallow curves when FA is off. When I was flying FA on, I still frequently flipped FA off for various maneuvers and it was absolute chaos without curves. I didn't want shallow curves while flying FA on tho. The way I handled this;

Create my curves - In VKBConfig, on the bottom select Profile, at the top of that frame, select Axes (I know...), then bottom right, click Physical Axes. For each axis 1, 2, and 3, check the "Eq" box and select 1 in the "Eq N" pulldown.
Click Response Curves on the bottom right. Then click into the first cell for curve #2. Click on the curve image to the right and set the curve however you want. I left the first one default, which is no curve. I set the second one to be what I use for my X and Y axis while FA is off. I set the third one to be what I use for my Z (twist) axis while FA is off.

Reconfigured Physical Button 121 (P121) to be type "Curves" with a subtype "Crv2" with "alternate action" checked. Selected axis 1, 2, and 3 and set the curve # to use while FA off for each one.

I use the pinky finger button on my stick to toggle FA off and on. This is Physical Button 11 (P11) and is mapped to Logical Button 5 (L5). I change P11 to be a button subtype "ButAlt" with Def. State: Off, Set: Off, Pulse: unchecked. This makes a press of the pinky button, P11, toggle L5 on or off.

I add a boolean;
L5 NOT P121 - So when L5 is on (because the pinky button, P11, toggled L5 to on), the boolean will press P121, which sets the axis to those curves you selected. Pressing P11 again, toggles L5 off, so the boolean stops pressing P121, which restores your axis to curve #1.

In ED, I bind button Joy 5 to disable flight assist and select the hold option.

So when I press the pinky button, ED disables flight assist and the joystick applies my FA-off curves. When I press the pinky button again, ED enables flight assist and the joystick goes back to curve #1.

 

[Pville_Piper]

I forgot to answer this one. Yes I use some very shallow curves when FA is off. When I was flying FA on, I still frequently flipped FA off for various maneuvers and it was absolute chaos without curves. I didn't want shallow curves while flying FA on tho. The way I handled this;

Create my curves - In VKBConfig, on the bottom select Profile, at the top of that frame, select Axes (I know...), then bottom right, click Physical Axes. For each axis 1, 2, and 3, check the "Eq" box and select 1 in the "Eq N" pulldown.
Click Response Curves on the bottom right. Then click into the first cell for curve #2. Click on the curve image to the right and set the curve however you want. I left the first one default, which is no curve. I set the second one to be what I use for my X and Y axis while FA is off. I set the third one to be what I use for my Z (twist) axis while FA is off.

Reconfigured Physical Button 121 (P121) to be type "Curves" with a subtype "Crv2" with "alternate action" checked. Selected axis 1, 2, and 3 and set the curve # to use while FA off for each one.

I use the pinky finger button on my stick to toggle FA off and on. This is Physical Button 11 (P11) and is mapped to Logical Button 5 (L5). I change P11 to be a button subtype "ButAlt" with Def. State: Off, Set: Off, Pulse: unchecked. This makes a press of the pinky button, P11, toggle L5 on or off.

I add a boolean;
L5 NOT P121 - So when L5 is on (because the pinky button, P11, toggled L5 to on), the boolean will press P121, which sets the axis to those curves you selected. Pressing P11 again, toggles L5 off, so the boolean stops pressing P121, which restores your axis to curve #1.

In ED, I bind button Joy 5 to disable flight assist and select the hold option.

So when I press the pinky button, ED disables flight assist and the joystick applies my FA-off curves. When I press the pinky button again, ED enables flight assist and the joystick goes back to curve #1.

I've been thinking about doing this for mining, I scoop when I'm using the the Keelie in deep core mining and the forward/reverse, left/right thrust is too sensitive.
I had set it up so I pressed a button and it reduced the axis outputs by 50%. This was handy for landing but I need all the thrust to quickly pivot around an asteroid fragment and this is too limiting.

 

[- Mando -]

Short answer: Badly.

Long answer: I do alright with cyclops, basilisk and medusa. Hydra has been a wall for me. I flew FA on up until a few months ago. With FA on, I was able to get 2 or 3 hearts on a hydra semi consistently. I wasn't able to progress from there and decided flight assist was holding me back. So I started over with cyclops FA off and I've worked my way back up to hydra. I'm not as good as I was before with FA on, but I'm still trying to get better. I can occasionally get 2 hydra hearts, but my aim is pretty bad and I end up having to re-exert hearts once or twice and burn through a whole lot of gauss synth materials. Extends the fights until I inevitably screw up my orbit and die.

So, you're saying there's a chance! lol
I can do a few things FA off but keeping aim steady on a heart while also trying to cold orbit is NOT one of them. I'll just need to keep practicing.

You lost me at

Create my curves - In VKBConfig...

lol
I thought curves could be set up in the game options menu but I'm probably thinking dead zones or something.

After about 2 years of playing Elite with the GladiatorNXT's straight out of the box I am recently getting into more of the configurations and button modding and where files are for certain things. I was looking into macros for pips in VKBconfig and OMG it looks crazy confusing. But I found a video that should help set that up. I'll keep your info handy for when I'm ready to do more in VKBConfig. Thank you.

 

[UberDuper]

So, you're saying there's a chance! lol
I can do a few things FA off but keeping aim steady on a heart while also trying to cold orbit is NOT one of them. I'll just need to keep practicing.

I finally managed to kill a hydra solo back on the 7th. My FA off aim isn't great, but it's surpassed where I was with FA on. Next challenge is killing a medusa with less than 176 medium gauss rounds.
Takes a lot of practice and it's harder than using keyboard/mouse, but I just can't fly a spaceship with a mouse.