What the heck kind of heat map is this?!

[WeComeInPeace]

Ah, but the trick might be that we can find a much less energy-intensive way of flipping bits. Much like Thomas Malthus's notion of when human population became unsustainable has long since been smashed, or that dates of exhausting the world's oil running out have been successively put back by advanced extraction techniques.

I suppose much of science and science fiction is wondering where the hard limits will eventually kick in. But have to say - taking 200 years to travel 30 LY would put quite a crimp in E: D's gameplay. It's not like those pre-FSD colony megaships seem to have come to happy endings.

First of all: Malthus was "slightly" off with regards to the date, but there is still no doubt that he was right. You cannot have infinite exponential population growth in a system with finite resources. To believe in that you must be "Either an economist or a madman".

The "new" oil reserves are large, but the part of them being extractable as in feasible with regards to EROI is smaller than you think. Furthermore extracting them is a flipping mess. Peak oil is still a thing, and in current years we are just about to peak. This can be delayed somewhat due to demand, but since the area beneath the curve represent the total true reserve (not the ressource), delaying the peak will only lead to the downwards slope after the peak becoming steeper. Contrary to Malthus' predictions, the peak oil "debate" will be settled in both our lifetimes, and unless you disregard physics, that's a problem, given that 1/3 of the global energy consumption (TPES) goes to food production and distribution. Roughly 90% of that energy comes from fossil fuels and we still haven't gotten around to finding an alternative, so yes, we're pretty DOOM'ed. The peak theory (by Hubbert) is widely accepted among scientist and it also shows that phosphorus will become sparse in this century, so eat/live while you still can.

With those details out of the way, if you look at the amount of bits being flipped, even today, they still follow Moore's prediction. Of course that can't continue. And yes, the energy spent per flipped bit is falling as well, though not at nearly the same rate, still resulting in the energy demand growing exponentially. Also, it will never be able to go below Landaur's Limit. The calculation showing when we need to convert the Universe into energy to keep Facebook running was not even based on current consumption, but instead it was based on... Landaur's Limit. Not that it matters, because it's the exponential growth in demand that is dominant.

In a game you have a certain amount of artistic freedom, so let's just say that I appreciate my FSD

 

[Walter2]

It’s not showing the likelihood. It’s showing areas where the life form might be.

The heat map of the Alpha was a probability map. Not everywhere it was “hot” would have life, but more times than not it would.

The new system just highlights the environments where it’s possible to find that life form. When it’s bacteria it’s almost planet wide, much as you’d expect.

I thought that's exactly what I said, apart from the different interpretation of FD's use of "heat", to which most people would assign a literal meaning.

Homogenised planets? There’s far more variation than Horizons.

I had intended to mean that each planet's surface was homogenised: there is currently a distinct lack of high mountains and deep valleys in the landscapes. There is a wide variation in Odyssey, but the inevitable repeats start showing after a time.

 

[varonica]

Ok... I edited this post for a last try: how do you find anything ELSE than biomass if the entire planet is blue? Easy to replicate explanation, please! Maybe we are all missing something here that only you know?

PLUS all the other things I pointed out in DETAIL. Read them or leave it.

The filters show the spread of each bio, bacteria is often but not always planet wide, I posted a picture earlier showing the location of a bio in one tiny area on the dark side of a planet, the filters and your own knowledge of environments will let you easily find individual species. I am not even sure what you are saying biomass, that makes no sense, the blue filters are made to help you find bio and/or geo. If the entire planet is blue do you have it on all permanently? If the entire planet is blue for bacteria then it will be found anywhere you care to land, so set the filter to another bio type, you will that other type AND bacteria in that location.

Really, none of what you are saying seems to make any sense in regard to how the DSS and bio/geo filters work. Maybe you are doing something wrong?

 

[Belandriel]

The filters show the spread of each bio, bacteria is often but not always planet wide, I posted a picture earlier showing the location of a bio in one tiny area on the dark side of a planet, the filters and your own knowledge of environments will let you easily find individual species. I am not even sure what you are saying biomass, that makes no sense, the blue filters are made to help you find bio and/or geo. If the entire planet is blue do you have it on all permanently? If the entire planet is blue for bacteria then it will be found anywhere you care to land, so set the filter to another bio type, you will that other type AND bacteria in that location.

Really, none of what you are saying seems to make any sense in regard to how the DSS and bio/geo filters work. Maybe you are doing something wrong?

So, if the whole planet is blue because of some bacteria and I want to look for, let's say, geysirs (which is, in my opinion, strictly geological and not biological). Then unfortunately the filter does absolutely nothing, nada, niente, nichts. The whole planet stays blue, no matter which filter I set.

Or aren't you supposed to find geological POIs with the DSS anymore? How can I find raw materials, for example?

 

[Koma Pahu]

I thought that's exactly what I said, apart from the different interpretation of FD's use of "heat", to which most people would assign a literal meaning.

My point was that the new system doesn't give any indication of the probability of encountering a lifeform, only that it's an area where it might grow. I had one which took about 3 hours of flying to find the tiny spot where it grew on that particular planet.*

I had intended to mean that each planet's surface was homogenised: there is currently a distinct lack of high mountains and deep valleys in the landscapes. There is a wide variation in Odyssey, but the inevitable repeats start showing after a time.

I get you now. Yeah, there's a tendency for (almost) all planets to have all the same topographical features across the surface in one way or another. It does allow me to learn what environments each species likes to live in, but as it stands I can't look at a planet and predict what species I may find on the surface.

* I actually kinda like this as it makes the search for life more skill-based, but I can see why people get frustrated.

 

[Koma Pahu]

So, if the whole planet is blue because of some bacteria and I want to look for, let's say, geysirs (which is, in my opinion, strictly geological and not biological). Unfortunately the filter does absolutely nothing, nada, niente, nichts. The whole planet stays blue, no matter which filter I set.

Or aren't you supposed to find geological POIs with the DSS anymore? How can I find raw materials, for example?

Geysers are geological signals, and no, there are no Geo POIs any more.

I'm not 100% convinced that geological signals are fully fixed - I've never seen anything with a small range - but you can use some skills and deduction to find geological features. Look for extinct volcanoes, they're always a good place to start.

I've found raws to be more abundant than in Horizons - although bugged so only dropping low-grade mats - when generally pottering about, but the concentrated clumps of Horizons have (mostly?) gone.

 

[Belandriel]

Geysers are geological signals, and no, there are no Geo POIs any more.

So then the information "10 human, 5 geological and 2 biological signals" is useless from now on. Or let's say a lot less useful! Except you like to find geological spots blindfolded. But then again... the info itself is useless. They might also say "Meh... go look, maybe you'll find something somewhere"

 

[Koma Pahu]

So then the information "10 human, 5 geological and 2 biological signals" is useless from now on. Except you want to find geological spots blindfolded.

The human signals are still POIs…

It does act as a reminder of how many there are to find, but other than that it’s a bit of an artefact leftover from Horizons I think.

 

[Belandriel]

The human signals are still POIs…

It does act as a reminder of how many there are to find, but other than that it’s a bit of an artefact leftover from Horizons I think.

So you just fly somewhere fingers crossed to find raw material nodes? And you can't even set waypoints / POIs for yourself...

Ok... then let me conclude this: if this is really what it's supposed to be, I just don't like the new system.

 

[Koma Pahu]

So you just fly somewhere fingers crossed to find raw material nodes? And you can't even set waypoints / POIs for yourself...

Ok... then let me conclude this: if this is really what it's supposed to be, I just don't like the new system.

Most of my mats are picked up while exploring in the SRV even in Horizons, they still show up in the scanner the same. Just a shame it’s bugged atm.

 

[Belandriel]

Most of my mats are picked up while exploring in the SRV even in Horizons, they still show up in the scanner the same. Just a shame it’s bugged atm.

Hopefully they will fix it soon.

 

[Burstar1]

Nope, doesn't happen, I have always found bacteria where indicated on the heat map, sure sometimes I can't land because the ground is to rough and I have to fly on to find flatter terrain, but it's always there, there is no mismatch, if it's blue, it's there!

See, now I know you don't know what you're talking about. Go to Schadgae AM-L c8-0 4 and then post video evidence of you finding Bacteria there. Good luck with that.

 

[krisuus]

I don't mind the heat map, but I really think it needs to be integrated with the surface map so you can access it at any time after probing the planet. Then you should be able to zoom in and look in more detail, and place your own waypoints.

It doesn't feel like flying around aimlessly if you could plan your journey first.

 

[Koma Pahu]

See, now I know you don't know what you're talking about. Go to Schadgae AM-L c8-0 4 and then post video evidence of you finding Bacteria there. Good luck with that.

That sounds a bit entitled. Maybe you should provide video proof that it’s not there.

 

[Burstar1]

That sounds a bit entitled. Maybe you should provide video proof that it’s not there.

Nah, more like you can't prove it's not there as someone will just say you didn't find it, but you can certainly prove it is. That's the point. I'm saying you can easily, without a doubt, discredit my stance by simply going there and pointing to a bacteria colony. That's how confident I am. I even left first footfall available to be claimed just for you.

Edit: added some screenshots just to prove I'm not wasting your time. Also be sure to record the whole thing including DSS scan and your entire search.

 

[Vardaugas]

See, now I know you don't know what you're talking about. Go to Schadgae AM-L c8-0 4 and then post video evidence of you finding Bacteria there. Good luck with that.

You really expect someone to fly out some 8k ly just to prove you wrong? And you think that's not silly?

 

[Burstar1]

You really expect someone to fly out some 8k ly just to prove you wrong? And you think that's not silly?

The irony of it being silly that I waste your time, but it isn't for FDev is just sooo... <mwah, chef's kiss>.

 

[varonica]

So, if the whole planet is blue because of some bacteria and I want to look for, let's say, geysirs (which is, in my opinion, strictly geological and not biological). Then unfortunately the filter does absolutely nothing, nada, niente, nichts. The whole planet stays blue, no matter which filter I set.

Or aren't you supposed to find geological POIs with the DSS anymore? How can I find raw materials, for example?

No, if you select the filter for geysers it shows the coverage of geysers, if it's staying blue no matter which filter you set then there's a problem your end, a bug or something. I will scan a planet and show you my filters in a following post.

 

[Koma Pahu]

Nah, more like you can't prove it's not there as someone will just say you didn't find it, but you can certainly prove it is. That's the point. I'm saying you can easily, without a doubt, discredit my stance by simply going there and pointing to a bacteria colony. That's how confident I am. I even left first footfall available to be claimed just for you.

Edit: added some screenshots just to prove I'm not wasting your time. Also be sure to record the whole thing including DSS scan and your entire search.

I’m not going to. I mean, I could refund my client’s £1,000 and cancel their photoshoot because I’ve got to prove some entitled jerk on the internet wrong, but that’s not deemed very professional. So, no.

 

[varonica]

So, if the whole planet is blue because of some bacteria and I want to look for, let's say, geysirs (which is, in my opinion, strictly geological and not biological). Then unfortunately the filter does absolutely nothing, nada, niente, nichts. The whole planet stays blue, no matter which filter I set.

Or aren't you supposed to find geological POIs with the DSS anymore? How can I find raw materials, for example?

Here, I don't have a body with bio and geo but the geo filters work the same, here is a body with 8 bio and respective filters;

As you can see each bio covers a different area, but many overlap, it's the overlapping areas you aim for when landing to get as much bio coverage as possible. A planet with Geo will show a different filter, although the geo filters are often very similar or identical because all geo features are usually found in the same areas.

In this case I would aim to land on that spot directly under the central white dot because it is the spot that appears to have all 8 bio types available.

If all you are seeing is solid blue when going through the filters it's a bug of some sort!