What went wrong with Elite Dangerous

[Kewpa Eurus]

You are entirely correct, joining open to interact with other people should on its own be its own incentive to actually join open.

However if people's experience with open is seal clubbing, and to note here I haven't really experienced it myself, but if that is people's experience, I can easily see why if what should be a part of open becomes a majority, that they would shy away from open.

Ultimately the community can come together and does some times, but the exact things that people complain about combat loggers and such in terms of PvP then are used by said griefers.
And the fact that right now, catching one specific person is significantly harder then one person targeting random weak person.

But yes you are right the community can and in my opinion does come together, and a lot of PvP'ers miss the fact that the exact things they complain about, also affects those that want to PvP the griefers.
With 2.1 we should be getting a proper consequence system to the game, and hopefully that will mean that griefers can't just keep on doing what they are doing while laughing at system forces response. Which is needed in a game with P2P nature, but it is not a bad thing in my book, it means that npc's will, as they should in lore, being people, protect those in their system, then the community can shift focus towards hunting down those that do those actions, and show them what they think about it, and no, hunting someone that has attacked others, is a reaction not griefing on its own, because said person being hunted can stop doing what they do and they won't get hunted for it.

Most of the PvP community I know would love an actual proper crime and punishment system. We think it is way too easy to be able to do as we please and still operate in system freely in which we are working against.

 

[DaveB]

So in essence, DavidB admitted to creating a stale economy and we are satisfied with this answer? Perhaps a more creative process would have gotten around this problem of being "too big to effect"

Dont confuse this DB with the DB that actually created the game. First name the the same (maybe not as I go by my middle name and that's the D) Last name totally different.

 

[Kewpa Eurus]

I have, but it's not the same. I know exactly what to do in order to put myself back into a Python or larger ship within a week. Although I've been thinking about buying a second account to "Iron Man" in. Each death requires me to reset fully. Some of my friends are already doing it and they say it changes everything, in a good way.

 

[DaveB]

However, I wouldn't diss the other DB for creating a "static economy" - it's not static, it's just bigger than you can wrap your head around in an MMO setting.

 

[Kewpa Eurus]

Dont confuse this DB with the DB that actually created the game. First name the the same (maybe not as I go by my middle name and that's the D) Last name totally different.

I havn't which is why I typed DavidB instead of DaveB

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Not all of us are so equal. I've talked my wife into the possibility of a Maserati. But a Rift or Titan card? Nope. "Disposable income" is a moving target. Maybe I need to start hiding 20s here and there.

Strangely I have just tonight forwarded this advert to a friend
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201602151043910

Sadly my sports car owning days came to an end last september

 

[Scoopy Doopy]

I have, but it's not the same. I know exactly what to do in order to put myself back into a Python or larger ship within a week. Although I've been thinking about buying a second account to "Iron Man" in. Each death requires me to reset fully. Some of my friends are already doing it and they say it changes everything, in a good way.

Iron man is the way to go. Personally as I'm 58000LY out and have travelled 97000 LY to get here, I'll pass on it for the moment but when I reach a point where I get bored, I'll iron man.

 

[Kewpa Eurus]

However, I wouldn't diss the other DB for creating a "static economy" - it's not static, it's just bigger than you can wrap your head around in an MMO setting.

Big or small, it's still static and again there are only 4-5 important items that are being traded and the rest are fillers for the screen. Using the "Too big to comprehend" excuse is no reason for it to feel and remain static. A bit more creative thinking could have been used here. What would happen if the 4-5 items that generated the most profit now had to be supplied by CMDRs via planetary landings instead of being auto-refreshed? I feel there were missed opportunities to improve on what we have instead of creating more "content" that is still empty.

 

[DaveB]

Big or small, it's still static and again there are only 4-5 important items that are being traded and the rest are fillers for the screen. Using the "Too big to comprehend" excuse is no reason for it to feel and remain static. A bit more creative thinking could have been used here.

No it's not static.. Before you leap down my throat pointing out all the ways it "doesn't change" let me explain.

It's not static it's just HUGE. You can maybe move it a little locally but eventually the steamroller that is the galactic economy is going to roll over you and flatten any bumps you raised. When you have effectively an infinite number of markets within a few hours flight time of where you are, that can supply what you need, the sale price locally isn't going to rise that much no matter how much you need it. There will always be somebody willing to sell lower than the rest and trade margin for volume. That's where the traders will buy so you won't be paying that much of a higher price.

There are not enough players in the game to overcome that momentum on any major market so they don;t try. They look for the places where the system they can't influence has created local imbalances they can exploit. Or they go broke.


ETA: It's no different to a margin trader on todays stocks. If you;re ahead of the trend, you win big. Once the trend rolls over your sweet spot you get out because if you end up behind the trend you lose big too.

 

[Kristov]

What I said about a player driven economy has nothing to do with your argument points. You've stated that it would take months for a massive amount of players to effect the economy, which the first CG proved you wrong. 200 L.Y. is not very local in the bubble, sorry to say. It was not a very small change as well. Supplies were DEPLETED and only recovered after the CG was over. People were traveling to my trade route 250 LY away from CG at the very edge of the bubble to get metals. Sorry but it's not local.

As stated before I said nothing about cornering markets, so your whole DavidB thing is a pretty useless argument. A player driven economy is not possible as the way items work now, but as soon as you give real value and uses for those items, then what DavidB and you are stating can be null. Again, before you go skewing my words or not comprehending what I'm trying to get at is that the current economy system won't work according to DavidB is because there's only 4-5 items worth trading and that due to the profit margin assigned to them. Introduce another element such as a stations need for precious metals to operate at full capacity then the current market and trading game changes drastically. You don't need to Google anything when you can think outside of the box aside from what your dear leader tells you.

Largest bracket is 18-35, second largest bracket is 18 and below. Combined they make up 56% of the market. It's not about the teens personal income, it's the fact that the teen can use their parents income to purchase something. A lot of companies target teens and want to hook them at an early age? Ever wonder why?

I cannot deal with your condescending attitude as long as your reading comprehension remains so impaired. You've labeled me as one of the "griefers" and have a mindset that I want to change the game to meet my own personal needs for PvP and griefing which is not the case. Why have you glossed over certain points such as crime and punishment needing a fix? That I feel things like this would help improve the game overall for EVERYONE. Of course I've already caught you out about being something which you are not, not sure why I need to entertain you anymore. Keep looking at the stars while others will reach for them, stay basic buddy.

If people were traveling that far, that was silly, there's no need to travel that far unless it's a rare. But people don't tend to actually look around much, they hear that X is being sold at Y for Z and head there, never bothering to see if it's somewhere closer. Seen that plenty of times in CGs, people traveling 2 to 3 times as far as needed for goods that were right next door. And yes, local saturation happens, all the time, it's why trade routes constantly get changed, the markets do fluctuate according to supply and demand. Once people stop saturating, they settle right back down to their previous levels within a week. But most people don't bother to go back to them, they just move on to the next route they've found or heard about and keep repeating the process.

Oh, and DaveB isn't my dear leader, I've been pointing out the way the economy works in E: D for quite a while when people complain that it doesn't work the way it should like EvE does. EvE's economy isn't even close to realistic, ain't seen many games that did have realistic economies, because those aren't fun. FD did a very good job with the economy in E: D, my only complaint is that the prices fluctuate TOO much, but that's due to the fact that market data isn't shared, if it was, prices would be the same across the bubble and trading would be pointless. Mining would be the only profitable version of trading. Which is why there's no market data trading going on, so now you understand why such a stupid thing is overlooked by FD....they do know a bit more about this stuff than you do, go figure huh?

And you MIGHT want to look at that pdf once again...18 and under is 26% of the market, 50+ is 27% of the market, as I said, the 2nd highest consumer bracket 50+, not teenagers. YOU need to read what's being presented to you and stop making up your own versions of it. You've done that multiple times now, it's a bit annoying. I'm almost 50 and I'm able to keep my stuff straight, you should be able to as well since you are much younger..

I don't recall calling you a griefer, but yes, I do believe you to be one, your words have made that clear, and as I said, that has nothing to do with anything. You want this game to cater to certain things that it doesn't, and won't, per David Braben and FD et al. You want player control of the game, not going to happen, you want more PvP, not going to happen. You want storylines, which have been in the game since it was in gamma but you don't see them. You want a reason to do things, not going to get them, sandbox, there aren't reasons given TO you to do things, you either want to do them or you don't. See, this IS a sandbox game, and we've been given plenty of tools to use in this sandbox, and many people are enjoying the hell out of it. There's lots of people creating emergent content without shooting another player in the process, people writing novels of content without killing another player or controlling sections of the galaxy or anything like that. That isn't needed for emergent content, did you know that? You don't need to fight other players, you don't need to control anything, you just need to have a story and share it, THAT is what emergent content is. UAs, Barnacles...tons of emergent content came about from those, things FD gave us, amongst many others. Did you go looking for those lost colony ships yet? Did you even know that was a storyline I wonder... Did you go looking for UAs and barnacles? I did, lots of people did, and we've done lots of other things all based on stuff that FD has given us for storylines, as well as stuff from the writers of the E: D books. TONS of emergent content, and it had nothing to do with people shooting anyone they could find.

Conflict makes for good stories, but it doesn't have to be conflict with each other, and in a galaxy wide setting, it's often better to have that conflict be with an external source, and FD has been setting that up all along. You and your buddies in The Code and SDC, you keep trying to make out what you do is emergent content, but it's not, never has been.

There's a lot of stuff coming over the next few years, stuff that will make this game a lot more than it is now, but it's not the stuff you want, so it's pointless to you. I'm not just looking at the stars, I'm out there dancing among them, like so many others in the game are doing, enjoying what we have now and waiting for what's coming in the future, all laid out and known to us because FD has been clear what's going to come. It's not the stuff you demand and insist is required to make this game great, so, as I said, it WILL fail for you and those like you, you want another game. The only one I know of that has what you demand is EvE, sorry to say, as no other space genre game offers what you want except that one. IB doesn't, Evochron doesn't, NMS doesn't, SC doesn't...might be something, somewhere, that might, but I'm not aware of it, doesn't mean much, there's a lot of stuff in the works that I'm not familiar with. SC might do what you want, on a modded private server, but that's about it, since the main SC game doesn't. Permadeath really does put a damper in the PvP stuff, and CIG won't be letting players control much outside their own ships, for much the same reason David doesn't let that happen in E: D.

 

[xondk]

SC isn't a tech demo anymore, it's now an actual alpha, fairly good one at that, but if you don't know what alpha testing is like, avoid it! MOST of the systems they have talked about and hyped, not in the build yet, most are still in the design phase. Funny seeing the pew pew folks constantly complaining that they need to balance Arena Commander, which is something CIG keeps saying isn't a priority anymore, it was simply a proof of concept deal, and now all their work is on the Persistent Universe and Squadron 42(the single player game) and AC will get updated as they find the time. Star Marine, which was going to be their proof of concept FPS deal, has been placed on hold until after the PU is finished, they have the FPS in the PU, no reason to design and build a separate program JUST for that anymore. And the whining about THAT is never ending, same folks, pew pew players who still don't get that SC is not a pew pew game, it's like E: D in that respect. You CAN do PvP, it's allowed, but it's not the basis for the game and it's actually rather discouraged by the simple fact that SC has permadeath.

That is 'really' a matter of perspective, as right now you need a computer that can brute force its way through the network code issues, causing everyone to have low fps, though yes, arena commander works fine, but I see SC getting many many of the same issues that people complain about in Elite, because seemingly people ignore what CR explains what it is meant to be, so yeah. Add the whole people buying ships and then you end up matched against them with your starting ship, because you want to earn the stuff in game, makes it feel a bit pay to win, a worry I have with SC, we will see though, CR has addressed the worry in his talks, so I will see how it plays out.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a backer, and will likely play all three big space games, Elite: Dangerous, No man's sky, and Star Citizen, each of them have their own approach on stuff, but Elite still looks like the one that will be my fall back the game I will keep returning to, we will see how things go.

 

[Kewpa Eurus]

No it's not static.. Before you leap down my throat pointing out all the ways it "doesn't change" let me explain.

It's not static it's just HUGE. You can maybe move it a little locally but eventually the steamroller that is the galactic economy is going to roll over you and flatten any bumps you raised. When you have effectively an infinite number of markets within a few hours flight time of where you are, that can supply what you need, the sale price locally isn't going to rise that much no matter how much you need it. There will always be somebody willing to sell lower than the rest and trade margin for volume. That's where the traders will buy so you won't be paying that much of a higher price.

There are not enough players in the game to overcome that momentum on any major market so they don;t try. They look for the places where the system they can't influence has created local imbalances they can exploit. Or they go broke.

I get what you are saying and don't want to jump down your throat, lol. I'm trying to remain civil during my stay here, but seem to be attacked once I'm found to be part of a certain organization or branded a certain type of player. You admit to being a certain part of community here then EVERYONE will jump down your throat and your suggestions become preposterous.

I'm just saying that rather than accepting the fact that it is too large to change and let something like this remain static perhaps there are other option to approach it to make the market more vibrant, such as having CMDRs provide the supply to stations instead of stations auto refreshing. I'm not saying in any ways that my suggestions are perfect but rather would like to open up avenues of discussion to improve the game in which there are obvious problems or stagnation.

PvPer/Pirate or not. We love the game as much as you all do. We would like to see this game improve for everyone, not just the community that I subscribe to. Too often do I see people here taking the "Like it or leave it" attitude around here. They've always had vanilla ice cream and unwilling to try strawberry because vanilla is what they are used to. I would love to be playing this game at the end of it's 10 year plan, but the way I will be the pessimist and say it won't happen. Not because I don't love the game, but because someone else will do a better job within that time period.

 

[Boomer Kay]

I'll take my 1100 hours against whatever it is you claim to have put into this game.

I spent many enjoyable hours in this game.
If the fun ends and I feel I've done it all, I shall take a break and wait for the next patch.
I've honestly expected that point about 100 in game hours ago, it did not happen. Yea, I'm that casual... how can I watch myself in the mirror every morning. I used to have place 1-50 in the little online Tetris I played against my colleagues during nightshift.

I've yet to feel that grind some people keep complaining about.
I guess I'm doing so much wrong.
I guess I'm doing it all wrong. I play games, not live for them. More meaningful stuff we need. Righto.
Just keep your upkeeps to yourselves, it's the crappiest pseudo game mechanic ever invented, kkthxbye.

(But save those 2 billion you have in the bank, according to my calculation, the next larger ships will be about 2.4 bio .. each)

 

[Maxmilian Czhilli]

I'm sitting at 2 billion in assest, 1 billion which is liquidable

Ahh. The rich man's lament. Enough money to do anything and no motivation or ideas left.

In lots of games when you reach game end you can simply restart and play again maybe trying to do things differently. Oh and ED has that option too. It's called reset save. With all your experience you could try seeing how far you can get going ironman with permadeath and seeing if you can reach triple elite. Give yourself a challenge and make all the millions and billions meaningless if you die.

Or maybe you've played enough for now and need to put it down for a while until there's enough new updates and content for you to power through.

There are are lots of things you can do to improve your gaming experience that are more effective than these forum monathons (unless that how you get your kicks). Try doing things that are within your control, now, to improve the situation, rather than fruitless campaigning for the world to change to suit you.

I don't have much sympathy for the billionaires and triple elites who moan about this game. You've got more than your money's worth already.

 

[Kristov]

That is 'really' a matter of perspective, as right now you need a computer that can brute force its way through the network code issues, causing everyone to have low fps, though yes, arena commander works fine, but I see SC getting many many of the same issues that people complain about in Elite, because seemingly people ignore what CR explains what it is meant to be, so yeah. Add the whole people buying ships and then you end up matched against them with your starting ship, because you want to earn the stuff in game, makes it feel a bit pay to win, a worry I have with SC, we will see though, CR has addressed the worry in his talks, so I will see how it plays out.

Don't get me wrong, I'm a backer, and will likely play all three big space games, Elite: Dangerous, No man's sky, and Star Citizen, each of them have their own approach on stuff, but Elite still looks like the one that will be my fall back the game I will keep returning to, we will see how things go.

Actually, the server frame rate issues don't cause client frame rates to drop, it causes desync issues, rubber banding, unable to use items, weapons not firing, etc, due to the server running far slower than the clients and not picking up input during the frames it's not 'seeing'. All part of alpha testing, actually not too bad, seen MUCH worse, like in MWO...and in MWO it was due to the same issue, CryTek's craptacular netcode which has to be refactored to server auth instead of client auth...ugh...but it's getting much better every interation.

As for the pay to win...sorry, I'm gonna laugh at you right now Pay to win presupposes there's something to win, and that's not the case with SC, another sandbox game, no end game, no high level content, nothing to win. Combine that with permadeath, and PvP isn't going to be a big thing in the PU itself, people will avoid it if possible, loss of things you've earned...not just a rebuy, they have insurance just like E: D, but actual LOSS of those things, no rebuy, straight loss due to you being dead, end of character and all it's possessions....

Like I said, pew pew folks creating a lot of noise over the lack of balance in AC right now, something CIG has said isn't a priority because the PU and SQ42 are where all their work is going. Combine that with the fact that pew pew in the PU won't ever be a big deal due to permadeath...pay to win? Win what?

 

[Lord Momo]

Ahh. The rich man's lament. Enough money to do anything and no motivation or ideas left.

In lots of games when you reach game end you can simply restart and play again maybe trying to do things differently. Oh and ED has that option too. It's called reset save. With all your experience you could try seeing how far you can get going ironman with permadeath and seeing if you can reach triple elite. Give yourself a challenge and make all the millions and billions meaningless if you die.

Or maybe you've played enough for now and need to put it down for a while until there's enough new updates and content for you to power through.

There are are lots of things you can do to improve your gaming experience that are more effective than these forum monathons (unless that how you get your kicks). Try doing things that are within your control, now, to improve the situation, rather than fruitless campaigning for the world to change to suit you.

I don't have much sympathy for the billionaires and triple elites who moan about this game. You've got more than your money's worth already.

I don't think that that was his point, he wants more content to do after you get all that stuff, more options.

Personally I got my moneys worth and had a lot of fun, but I too wish that they would add some more stuff to do with those big ships once you get there because I don't want to restart I would prefer if there was some truly unique gameplay for large ships. But I have gotten my fair share of fun from this game and I have waited 2 years for it to get more in depth and I could wait several more, heck I don't know if I will ever pick it back up again, but I really hope that they add more stuff to make me want to come back in the future.

 

[Ginrikuzuma]

All snarky-Ness aside, I don't think anything went wrong. I point your attention to a critically acclaimed book, The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Universe.

Space," it says, "is big. Really big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mindbogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space, listen...

Now, I don't know about you, but I bought this game knowing full well what I was getting myself into: a 10 year project that encompasses 400 billion visitable star systems on a 1:1 ratio. Freelancer, Freespace, SC or EVE and so on don't have this kind of scope. NMS is the closest thing and it still not out.
While a lifeless universe isnt ideal, it has been a LONG dry spell for a space flight Sim that isn't point n click.

As Angry Joe once said, This is a Joyyyyy.... Sssstick....

Again, I like my game. It suits me. You don't like it? I'm sorry. There are other games out there.

this

nothing "went wrong".

We can talk about how ED goes wrong as the seasons pass and the extra content comes in as time passes.


The devs could say they built the skeleton for the game and are adding to it but I like to imagine it instead as an organism still in development.

Kickstarter was its conception
Alpha/Beta was the build up of stem cells
1.0 was the concise shape

the skeleton, muscle, nervous system, etc. will slowly be developed over the course of whatever amount of time.

(I don't like people still spouting the whole "10 years" line since I have yet to see a written statement or a video of them specifically saying 10 years. We know its going to take years and some claim they have said X years but none of the devs have explicitly said so and for a simple reason. If they deviate for x or y reason people are going to get mad. I will leave it at that however since we don't need to de-rail. )

Regardless again to say something has gone wrong when its not even half-way complete nor has it been abandoned. For the longest of time we have wanted space flight sims. Multiple companies are finally doing that and they are all taking different approaches and paths.

 

[Kewpa Eurus]

If people were traveling that far, that was silly, there's no need to travel that far unless it's a rare. But people don't tend to actually look around much, they hear that X is being sold at Y for Z and head there, never bothering to see if it's somewhere closer. Seen that plenty of times in CGs, people traveling 2 to 3 times as far as needed for goods that were right next door. And yes, local saturation happens, all the time, it's why trade routes constantly get changed, the markets do fluctuate according to supply and demand. Once people stop saturating, they settle right back down to their previous levels within a week. But most people don't bother to go back to them, they just move on to the next route they've found or heard about and keep repeating the process.

Oh, and DaveB isn't my dear leader, I've been pointing out the way the economy works in E: D for quite a while when people complain that it doesn't work the way it should like EvE does. EvE's economy isn't even close to realistic, ain't seen many games that did have realistic economies, because those aren't fun. FD did a very good job with the economy in E: D, my only complaint is that the prices fluctuate TOO much, but that's due to the fact that market data isn't shared, if it was, prices would be the same across the bubble and trading would be pointless. Mining would be the only profitable version of trading. Which is why there's no market data trading going on, so now you understand why such a stupid thing is overlooked by FD....they do know a bit more about this stuff than you do, go figure huh?

And you MIGHT want to look at that pdf once again...18 and under is 26% of the market, 50+ is 27% of the market, as I said, the 2nd highest consumer bracket 50+, not teenagers. YOU need to read what's being presented to you and stop making up your own versions of it. You've done that multiple times now, it's a bit annoying. I'm almost 50 and I'm able to keep my stuff straight, you should be able to as well since you are much younger..

I don't recall calling you a griefer, but yes, I do believe you to be one, your words have made that clear, and as I said, that has nothing to do with anything. You want this game to cater to certain things that it doesn't, and won't, per David Braben and FD et al. You want player control of the game, not going to happen, you want more PvP, not going to happen. You want storylines, which have been in the game since it was in gamma but you don't see them. You want a reason to do things, not going to get them, sandbox, there aren't reasons given TO you to do things, you either want to do them or you don't. See, this IS a sandbox game, and we've been given plenty of tools to use in this sandbox, and many people are enjoying the hell out of it. There's lots of people creating emergent content without shooting another player in the process, people writing novels of content without killing another player or controlling sections of the galaxy or anything like that. That isn't needed for emergent content, did you know that? You don't need to fight other players, you don't need to control anything, you just need to have a story and share it, THAT is what emergent content is. UAs, Barnacles...tons of emergent content came about from those, things FD gave us, amongst many others. Did you go looking for those lost colony ships yet? Did you even know that was a storyline I wonder... Did you go looking for UAs and barnacles? I did, lots of people did, and we've done lots of other things all based on stuff that FD has given us for storylines, as well as stuff from the writers of the E: D books. TONS of emergent content, and it had nothing to do with people shooting anyone they could find.

Conflict makes for good stories, but it doesn't have to be conflict with each other, and in a galaxy wide setting, it's often better to have that conflict be with an external source, and FD has been setting that up all along. You and your buddies in The Code and SDC, you keep trying to make out what you do is emergent content, but it's not, never has been.

There's a lot of stuff coming over the next few years, stuff that will make this game a lot more than it is now, but it's not the stuff you want, so it's pointless to you. I'm not just looking at the stars, I'm out there dancing among them, like so many others in the game are doing, enjoying what we have now and waiting for what's coming in the future, all laid out and known to us because FD has been clear what's going to come. It's not the stuff you demand and insist is required to make this game great, so, as I said, it WILL fail for you and those like you, you want another game. The only one I know of that has what you demand is EvE, sorry to say, as no other space genre game offers what you want except that one. IB doesn't, Evochron doesn't, NMS doesn't, SC doesn't...might be something, somewhere, that might, but I'm not aware of it, doesn't mean much, there's a lot of stuff in the works that I'm not familiar with. SC might do what you want, on a modded private server, but that's about it, since the main SC game doesn't. Permadeath really does put a damper in the PvP stuff, and CIG won't be letting players control much outside their own ships, for much the same reason David doesn't let that happen in E: D.

OK, so for 2015 50+ demographic beats the 18 below demographic by a whole 1 percent. Using some critical thinking, I would much rather put place my bet on the 18 and below demographic as they have 40 years more years of being a consumer as well as influencing their future children on what products to buy. It's one thing to be able to read simple data, but interpreting it and using it to your advantage is another.

You seem to feel that I want the game to cater to me and my own purposes and refuse to accept any of them as decent ideas simply because you have labeled me as part of the community that is hated around here. Sure there's emergent content out there, but again you want to stop at a certain point, according to your own personal needs and wants. You are being just as greedy as you feel I am. Me and my buddies have been thanked in the past by once strictly solo players for their experiences in Open, being positive. Just because you don't agree with it does not mean there's no place for it. I cannot say this enough but you seem to not want to listen. We don't want another Eve or SC. We want this game to improve to be better than the both. We excited about the new things coming out but or more hesitant to believe the hype, as Horizons was more than lack luster.

Just because you are pleased with what is happening does not mean there are improvements that could be made. Sorry to say but most of us transitioned to PvP because we've done everything else in the game and thoroughly. We've experienced all of what this game has to offer and at the end of the day it's not the game itself that saves us from leaving, but the human element.

Sure it doesn't have to be conflict with each other but why not. At the end of the day FD advertised and promoted that you can have conflict with each other. At the end of the day we are playing the game as advertised to us as well as using the in game tools to do so. FD allowed us to interdict other CMDRs, FD gave us hatch breakers, FD made our lasers damage other CMDRs ships. This is something you need to accept. You say FD doesn't want this or that, but the way they have developed the game and promoted disagrees with you. Plain and simple. You are using your personal tastes to try to counter what FD themselves have promoted and marketed.

Sorry you disagree, but people like you are really stuck in 1984 and want nothing more than to hamper what this game can be. Which is not SC or Eve, but something greater. No you are not reaching for the stars, you are accepting that there are a certain amount of stars and not wiling to fly further to find the hidden stars in the sky.

 

[frostypaw]

You seem to misunderstand that improve doesn't mean change.

Especially some of the UBER grindy mechanics being suggested - that players actually have to do the day jobs to get the products for the stations to sell???

There's enough 'job' in life already. Gaming shouldn't require more of it and almost all the suggested improvements just make it into a grind fest when currently you can do pretty much what you want from the get-go

 

[Asp Explorer]

CryTek's craptacular netcode

Kristov my friend, whilst I always enjoy your posts - I'd like to ask you to drop the use of "netcode". We both know such a thing doesn't exist and it is simply a nonsense word spouted by people who have absolutely no idea what is involved in network transactions