Just keep submitting that footage to FD.
Who has encountered a cheater using a hack?
- Thread starter Agony_Aunt
- Start date
Just keep submitting that footage to FD.
The video (of the encounter paraphrased above) that potato linked me to was about as clear-cut a demonstration of hacking as I could imagine.
Most won't be anywhere near so obvious, at least not without seeing a pattern develop over many encounters, but that just emphasizes the need for solid telemetry collection from all peers, so even subtle manipulation can be flagged.
Most won't be anywhere near so obvious, at least not without seeing a pattern develop over many encounters, but that just emphasizes the need for solid telemetry collection from all peers, so even subtle manipulation can be flagged.
I have encounted a lot of cheaters in Elite. But most people that are cheating are doing it in Solo and/or PG. So we never see those.
I am a PvPer. The cheating effects PvP the least IMO. Most of the cheaters are using it for BGS and/or Power Play ect.
There would be a lot more people cheating than we could imagine.
I am a PvPer. The cheating effects PvP the least IMO. Most of the cheaters are using it for BGS and/or Power Play ect.
There would be a lot more people cheating than we could imagine.
I've seen cheaters multiple times already, though I may spot one every 3-6 months. That doesn't mean there are not more as some don't cheat so obvious.
While its safe to presume most are being clever and cheating in PG/solo, i still think that the "epidemic" is not as bad as people think.
The only thing I've encountered that made me "wait is that supposed to happen" was the time I got interdicted at zero throttle but the red bar filled before it actually submitted, but I'd be more willing to put that down to some stupid "interdiction meter moves faster if there are more players in the instance" bug like the heat bug, thargons, srv damage, and all those other bugs where effects get multiplied by the number of people around.
tl;dr I can't tell if it was cheat, bug, or working as intended. Which is par for the course for open in this game at times, sadly.
tl;dr I can't tell if it was cheat, bug, or working as intended. Which is par for the course for open in this game at times, sadly.
Most people here and in the game are just players who want to have a good and relaxing and/or exciting time in a game they enjoy.
So we can say, most of us (our community) aren't cheaters.
That's why it isn't epidemic.
Speaking about me: I am interested in the cheats in a technical sense, but I am not a a cheater, I don't have more fun in the game if I would cheat, I would have less or no fun. Without danger and demanding tasks ED is boring (like any other game).
BUT however we enjoy the game and how much so ever we are, a SINGLE cheater is capable to spoil our enjoyment.
I don't say that every single cheater spoils every game session for everybody always. Still we can do whatever we like in the game without being bothered (maybe except for Power Play which is ruined, if massive bots are true). (1)
The problem is, that ED is typically timely demanding: you start a game and 1 or 2 hours are minimum to do anything of any progress. If there is risk that this time is wasted, in the sense of My-Fun-Was-Spoiled, because of cheaters, then, I would say, this is a very big threat for the health of a game: people are leaving, newcomers will stay away, sales are going down, press goes bad, the spiral of DOOM !
"Epidemic" is therefor relative: it doesn't need to be 50% (or whatever epedemic is) cheaters to ruin a game. It is enough if people are uncertain if whatever they have experienced was cheating or not. And this is currently the case, at least with many of those who are responding here.
Whatever FDev is really doing in the background, currently it is NOT ENOUGH for me, to be assured that everything is going fine with the problem of cheating in the future. For me the opposite is true, I believe Fdev does not see the problem, because of (1). I believe that FDev does not take into account that multiplayer games are different than single player games when it comes to cheating. I believe that FDev is currently concentrating on single player games like Planet Zoo and I believe that Fdev is seeing the decision of ED being a multiplayer game as a strategic mistake. For me the problem of cheating is at a state where general phrases are NOT ENOUGH.
First step to do/What I would like to see:
Add release path of frequent and small incremental updates on a more or less daily or weekly basis (mainly bug fixes and corresponding release notes).
This alone would defeat the current cheat engine based trainer as memory layout would change with every release (I know, not mandatory, but it could be forced!). But this would be only a side effect, more important:
It would be received by the community as progress and good communication.
Most people here and in the game are just players who want to have a good and relaxing and/or exciting time in a game they enjoy.
So we can say, most of us (our community) aren't cheaters.
That's why it isn't epidemic.
Speaking about me: I am interested in the cheats in a technical sense, but I am not a a cheater, I don't have more fun in the game if I would cheat, I would have less or no fun. Without danger and demanding tasks ED is boring (like any other game).
BUT however we enjoy the game and how much so ever we are, a SINGLE cheater is capable to spoil our enjoyment.
I don't say that every single cheater spoils every game session for everybody always. Still we can do whatever we like in the game without being bothered (maybe except for Power Play which is ruined, if massive bots are true). (1)
The problem is, that ED is typically timely demanding: you start a game and 1 or 2 hours are minimum to do anything of any progress. If there is risk that this time is wasted, in the sense of My-Fun-Was-Spoiled, because of cheaters, then, I would say, this is a very big threat for the health of a game: people are leaving, newcomers will stay away, sales are going down, press goes bad, the spiral of DOOM !
"Epidemic" is therefor relative: it doesn't need to be 50% (or whatever epedemic is) cheaters to ruin a game. It is enough if people are uncertain if whatever they have experienced was cheating or not. And this is currently the case, at least with many of those who are responding here.
Whatever FDev is really doing in the background, currently it is NOT ENOUGH for me, to be assured that everything is going fine with the problem of cheating in the future. For me the opposite is true, I believe Fdev does not see the problem, because of (1). I believe that FDev does not take into account that multiplayer games are different than single player games when it comes to cheating. I believe that FDev is currently concentrating on single player games like Planet Zoo and I believe that Fdev is seeing the decision of ED being a multiplayer game as a strategic mistake. For me the problem of cheating is at a state where general phrases are NOT ENOUGH.
First step to do/What I would like to see:
Add release path of frequent and small incremental updates on a more or less daily or weekly basis (mainly bug fixes and corresponding release notes).
This alone would defeat the current cheat engine based trainer as memory layout would change with every release (I know, not mandatory, but it could be forced!). But this would be only a side effect, more important:
It would be received by the community as progress and good communication.
It helps that ED isn't largely a competitive game. Of course, there are always those who will use cheats to give themselves an edge in competitive parts of the game, BGS/PP for example, probably not too many who use it in PvP as it makes it too obvious. Cheats can be much more prolific in games with higher levels of competition. Cheats are rife in some arena games for example. A few games/devs never succeed in beating the cheaters, and the products eventually die as non-cheaters drift away.
I suppose one saving grace of ED is, if FD can't beat the cheaters, we always have PG/solo where we can enjoy the game without direct exposure to the cheaters.
Except for Power Play and BGS
(putting Bots into the cheat category and stretching "direct exposure")
Nice writeup Rex, I agree completely that it's the uncertainty and paranoia that's epidemic at the moment.
FDev have a hell of a job ahead to do what they can to assuage that or risk players possibly leaving the game for good.
Personally, I still love the game, and I really hope FDev can come up with a solution before too many decide players to give it up and possible shorten the lifespan of a game that deserves better.
FDev have a hell of a job ahead to do what they can to assuage that or risk players possibly leaving the game for good.
Personally, I still love the game, and I really hope FDev can come up with a solution before too many decide players to give it up and possible shorten the lifespan of a game that deserves better.
Deleted member 38366
D
I remember I've been Interdicted by a cheater using a hack causing the Target to lose the Interdiction instantly.
Upon questioning the guy, he just wrote "Yeah, I am that good"
Since he and his Wingmate were Pirates and after some Cargo, luckily not as bad as it could have been.
Upon questioning the guy, he just wrote "Yeah, I am that good"
Since he and his Wingmate were Pirates and after some Cargo, luckily not as bad as it could have been.
Same thing with me. Ive never been ganked (except once at deciat, easy to escape), 99% of the people on my friends list i just saw in open.
I thought you two were friends.
The question should not be how many cheater there are, but instead how much damage can be done by cheaters. The answer to that is a lot even if they are playing in solo mode. This is especially true since version 3.3 of the game and the resulting changes to the BGS.
The problem can manifest itself in forms like:
1) Subtile (or otherwize) hacks which can effect the outcome of the PvP match and cause support calls for Frontier.
2) Hacks which unfairly influence Faction status and PowerPlay.
3) Data mining hacks which can kill the fun of first discovery for players playing fairly.
3) others
The subtle hacks are worse than the blatant ones who get caught because they can go on for a lot time and have a big effect.
The problem can manifest itself in forms like:
1) Subtile (or otherwize) hacks which can effect the outcome of the PvP match and cause support calls for Frontier.
2) Hacks which unfairly influence Faction status and PowerPlay.
3) Data mining hacks which can kill the fun of first discovery for players playing fairly.
3) others
The subtle hacks are worse than the blatant ones who get caught because they can go on for a lot time and have a big effect.
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Assuming your analysis about the inevitability of a witch hunt is true then the possible cheater's ED game life would become - let's just say - a lot more interesting very, very quickly. That being the case wouldn't the PVP'rs be in favor of posting said videos where their ED identity could be easily identified. I'm probably projecting here but if I were a PVP'r and was primarily in the game to experience the thrill of ship to ship combat with a human player I'd be broadcasting to the world - Come and get me SUCKER'S!
Alas - I am not a PVP'r (mainly because I'm old, my reflexes are shot and quite honestly the thrill of it no longer exists) and haven't been for a while and never in ED so my take on Agony_Aunt's analysis may be flawed and colored by my own PVP experience with PC gaming since 1979.
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Witch hunts would happen, but the thing you are missing is most cheaters don't care. They will keep doing what they are doing until FD finally ban them, then load up a new account. If FD stop the hack working, they will wait until the hack is fixed then continue.
the only people who care about witch hunts are the people who have a reputation to ruin (ie. people who participate in the community at large)
you don't have to worry about never being able to show your face in the community again if you were never part of the community in the first place
Hmmmm....
Actually my question was more about PVP'rs (cheaters or not) welcoming and not opposing Videos posted online and making them visible. I had not considered that they would become visible to FD and thus subject to ban.
Which begs the question if cheaters are so bad (I hate cheaters) why is it so very verboten to out 'em? Never have understood that.
Really - why can't they be outed?
If it turns out the poster lied, misconstrued, falsely accused, prompted revenge/vendetta then appropriate action can be taken against them.
Otherwise I really don't get it.