Why hasn't frontier ever responded to killing our SLF NPC's?

[Truesilver]

The game contains only two disproportionate loss spikes:

(1) Loss of high-ranked SLF pilot

(2) Loss of significant exploration data

Both bear not the least relationship to any other risk. Missions? Powerplay merits? Bounties? Cargo? Rebuy?

All trivial in comparison. Hours at most to replace.

In contrast, the two spikes above could set a player back weeks or months.

Neither loss has ever happened to me. As I've never (outside of Beta) been in PvP with an SLF or (lol) whilst carrying significant explo data, I've not even been at risk of either.

But there should be consistency.

On the reasonable assumption that Frontier are not going to increase rebuy (etc) twenty times over, they should now act to get these two spikes into line with the rest of the game's loss mechanics, via reduction.

 

[Dutchman141]

I don't agree with those who say that taking an npc along should have consequences, thus death on destruction of your ship.
An npc already has a lot of consequences, you lose rank increase in combat and a fully trained npc takes at least ten percent of all your earnings all the time, whether they're active or not.

Losing your npc on destruction while you survive is just plain stupid and highly illogical imho.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

The game contains only two disproportionate loss spikes:

(1) Loss of high-ranked SLF pilot

(2) Loss of significant exploration data

Both bear not the least relationship to any other risk. Missions? Powerplay merits? Bounties? Cargo? Rebuy?

All trivial in comparison. Hours at most to replace.

In contrast, the two spikes above could set a player back weeks or months.

Neither loss has ever happened to me. As I've never (outside of Beta) been in PvP with an SLF or (lol) whilst carrying significant explo data, I've not even been at risk of either.

But there should be consistency.

On the reasonable assumption that Frontier are not going to increase rebuy (etc) twenty times over, they should now act to get these two spikes into line with the rest of the game's loss mechanics, via reduction.

Or add some kind of gameplay. For exploration have it that you can get your data back if you go back to where your ship got destroyed and can pick up a data package containing your lost data (could be a personal mission in transactions panel).

As for the death of the NPC crew, to me that is just bad. It should have a credit consequence, not a permanant loss consequence. Also the NPC crew get paid far too much. Reduce the cost they get paid, but on ship destruction you need to pay them for medical bills/Escape pod recovery/Danger money, which would be higher depending on the rank of the NPC crew. If you don't pay the cash or you can't afford it, then they go on their seperate way and you never see them again. That seems a fairer system.

 

[Truesilver]

The following both seem really good ideas to me, +1.

For exploration have it that you can get your data back if you go back to where your ship got destroyed and can pick up a data package containing your lost data (could be a personal mission in transactions panel).

The above still looks a bit harsh if someone gets ganked on the other side of the galaxy but I may be totally wrong about that as I've never been more than 5k Ly from start and I hear that with big FSD's, light ships and jet cone highway stuff, travel can be pretty quick now.

As for the death of the NPC crew, to me that is just bad. It should have a credit consequence, not a permanant loss consequence. Also the NPC crew get paid far too much. Reduce the cost they get paid, but on ship destruction you need to pay them for medical bills/Escape pod recovery/Danger money, which would be higher depending on the rank of the NPC crew. If you don't pay the cash or you can't afford it, then they go on their seperate way and you never see them again.

I really like the way this would be easier on those who keep their ships intact, harder on those who let them get blown up, and involves a risk of permanent loss but one that can be guaranteed against by simple prudence.

 

[imaner76]

What if?

When you retrieve your SLF NPC the % that you pay them goes up by 0.5% or 1%? Most of us hired a Novice and trained that pilot up to keep the cost of payments down, what if that went up on death. With no cap? That way you'd kill your on SLF to stop paying them if you kept dying? LOL

Works from a narrative point as well, because the pilot would consider the flight with you a risk so want's more money! You could agree or not at the rebuy screen.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

The following both seem really good ideas to me, +1.

Thanks

The above still looks a bit harsh if someone gets ganked on the other side of the galaxy but I may be totally wrong about that as I've never been more than 5k Ly from start and I hear that with big FSD's, light ships and jet cone highway stuff, travel can be pretty quick now.

I have been at the recieving end. I was 200ly away from Sag A and decided to call it a night. I flew down to a planet to land (it just my routine), and didn't look at the gravity. Anyway one very quick decent and that was my keelback gone with all my data. It stung for a little bit, but wasn't the end of the world. I had seem some amazing sights in the game which others may not ever see. But if I had the chance to get my data back, I may have decided to go back out there and get it back, and by going by a different route I would have explored more areas. Maybe have a time limit, like a month until it expires.

I really like the way this would be easier on those who keep their ships intact, harder on those who let them get blown up, and involves a risk of permanent loss but one that can be guaranteed against by simple prudence.

Again, thanks.

 

[Iskariot]

Hello Frontier,

Instead of killing our NPC's when the ship is destroyed, can you just have them loose a level instead?

It is a change FDev will have to make eventually. It makes no sense the way it is done now.
Also currently more and more people tend to use pilots as disposables, especially when they realize how much having them costs them in the long run.
When you want to fly a crew-less ship for a while these pilots still leech your profits. We need to be able to put crew on hold when we don't use them.

 

[krylite]

NPC fighter crew helped me get to combat elite. They often nicked extra targets at high res or CZs kilometers away from my ship which added to bounty gain when destroyed by system authority or allied side. They may have taken some progression, but I often spent long sessions at rez areas and did many massacre or eliminate pirates missions anyways, so more eliminated pirate ships ranked dangerous to elite added up with the help of the npc fighter. When they get up to deadly they can be very helpful and can often knock out vipers on their own while the host ship is engaging a bigger opposition ship, or alternately take over the host ship with the cmdr in a fighter resulting in a tougher npc piloted host ship.

Imo, fighters and npc pilots were one of the best new features of Horizons, and interestingly was one of the least criticized or panned features on release, i.e. it was an excellent "competent" addon where most actually liked it or didn't have a major problem with it and it also works well with multicrew pc guest crew pilots.

Per OP question, unfortunately , to me it seems it's just not on the priority dev list , i.e. just need to be patient again. Maybe they'll get to it by the end of the Beyond season or later..

 

[dognosh]

We have an official response from FD : "We will reply to your question sometime soon © ™ 'pat. pending' "

 

[Lily from anim.o.v.e]

REMOVE ALL THE CONSEQUENCES

http://www.2oceansvibe.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/misc-all-the-things-l.png

Come on OP, the game is already 99% consequence free.

Do you really need to remove the LAST thing that might force people to think while fighting an NPC?

yes and so why does one of the most cosmetic features get lost? because in the end you hire these people by visuals since nothing else matters anyways.I wonder anywayswhat ahppened to the inital ideas fo co-pilots and them affectng ship stats? thats all gone and went into a boring "dude with picture that costs money and Ai scraps yourfighters/ships"?

 

[sollisb]

Let's face it, they're nothing but fodder.

But to get back to OP.

It's unrealistic that they die when the ship goes down. For some unknown reason, FDev made it that way. We have to live with it.

 

[Noctover]

Hello Frontier,

Instead of killing our NPC's when the ship is destroyed, can you just have them loose a level instead?

You die, you pay a small amount to get everything back in a game where credits are easy to come by.
You get interdicted in PVE; you cannot lose the minigame to escape.
You get interdicted in PVP; you can start the logout process and (legitimately and legally) be out of the game before the enemy ship scratches you. Or; you can hi-wake with ease.
You fight NPC's, you need to turn your monitor off to improve the difficulty slightly.

TL;DR...The game lacks challenge and very much lacks risk; game needs a LOT more to lose, this is a very small start... Keep the death of crew in the game please.

 

[Kaybe]

My own thread about this hit over 30 pages with no response. Vindicator Jones started his own later with a video. Nada.

Frontier doesn't care.

 

[RamirezKurita]

You die, you pay a small amount to get everything back in a game where credits are easy to come by.
You get interdicted in PVE; you cannot lose the minigame to escape.
You get interdicted in PVP; you can start the logout process and (legitimately and legally) be out of the game before the enemy ship scratches you. Or; you can hi-wake with ease.
You fight NPC's, you need to turn your monitor off to improve the difficulty slightly.

TL;DR...The game lacks challenge and very much lacks risk; game needs a LOT more to lose, this is a very small start... Keep the death of crew in the game please.

Many people would argue that the game lacks challenge, however the real issue that that the loss of crew is massively disproportionate compared to pretty much every single other loss in the game. Everything else doesn't matter and can be gotten back within a few hours of gameplay, meanwhile the loss of an Elite pilot is an order of magnitude worse. You could argue that everything does need more consequence, but it's not right for a single aspect to be punished so much more than all the others.

 

[Vasious]

Hello Frontier,

Instead of killing our NPC's when the ship is destroyed, can you just have them loose a level instead?

Is this one of those threads there if it isn't the answer you want, Frontier isn't listening and doesnt care at all about anything?

 

[EvoBeardy]

What if?

When you retrieve your SLF NPC the % that you pay them goes up by 0.5% or 1%? Most of us hired a Novice and trained that pilot up to keep the cost of payments down, what if that went up on death. With no cap? That way you'd kill your on SLF to stop paying them if you kept dying? LOL

Works from a narrative point as well, because the pilot would consider the flight with you a risk so want's more money! You could agree or not at the rebuy screen.

To be fair, with the amount of money the NPC crew attain from the moment we hire them, they should be

Spoiler

Princess Leia-ing

their way back to us....

FDev still need to make them have a set salary whilst inactive and have X% of profits made with them active when in your ship/crew only, the fact they get a set percentage of all profits is another thing that doesn't make much sense, and leads to many others simply hiring a high end and then firing before they cash in. This takes away any "immersion" (Yamiks' voice), and also detaches you from said NPCs even further. If all profits made whilst they're active had some sort of a tag, so when you cash in, the set percentage automatically goes to them (or into the ether if you cash in once they're dead and gone), this would stop the hire and fire method and solve many issues surrounding NPC crew systems as it stands, at least I think.

I think if you see the rebuy with them in tow, they should ask for a set percentage of their lifetime pay as a "re-hire" cost (20%?), and then their pay increased by 0.5-1%, maxing at 40-50%, and ONLY if FDev make their sharing of profits to be while they're out with you.
This way people that make tonnes of money are still paying the true value of their pilot buddy to them, as are those that don't make much.

 

[insanephoton]

Is this one of those threads there if it isn't the answer you want, Frontier isn't listening and doesnt care at all about anything?

TBH at this stage any answer from FD, even a polite refusal to change anything, would be seen as some kind of result.

 

[Frenotx]

To be fair, with the amount of money the NPC crew attain from the moment we hire them, they should be

Spoiler

Princess Leia-ing

their way back to us....

FDev still need to make them have a set salary whilst inactive and have X% of profits made with them active when in your ship/crew only, the fact they get a set percentage of all profits is another thing that doesn't make much sense, and leads to many others simply hiring a high end and then firing before they cash in. This takes away any "immersion" (Yamiks' voice), and also detaches you from said NPCs even further. If all profits made whilst they're active had some sort of a tag, so when you cash in, the set percentage automatically goes to them (or into the ether if you cash in once they're dead and gone), this would stop the hire and fire method and solve many issues surrounding NPC crew systems as it stands, at least I think.

I think if you see the rebuy with them in tow, they should ask for a set percentage of their lifetime pay as a "re-hire" cost (20%?), and then their pay increased by 0.5-1%, maxing at 40-50%, and ONLY if FDev make their sharing of profits to be while they're out with you.
This way people that make tonnes of money are still paying the true value of their pilot buddy to them, as are those that don't make much.

I would not like to see a permanent pay increase in each death. That would still be a disproportionate risk. Our ship rebuy doesn't escalate with every death, does it? A (large) flat fee (based on combat rank) makes the most sense to me. Hazard bonus.

 

[Vandaahl]

The only reason I stopped using my SLF is because I realised he was nicking half of my combat progression.

Yeah, as soon as I realized that, she was send back straight to the crew lounge.

 

[amadeus1171]

Is this one of those threads there if it isn't the answer you want, Frontier isn't listening and doesnt care at all about anything?

The problem is that FD hasn't said anything at all!