Why PVP is Dead or Dying. PVE is now KING!
- Thread starter Hatchepsut
- Start date
The biggest problem regarding PvP is the fact that all other players are affected by the whining of the PvP community. Last year, they wanted a change in station PvP rules, hence we are stuck with the cumbersome speeding/bounty system.
That was entirely brought in by people complaining about griefers lol, bounty got changed because people exploited it, don't really think either were from the PvP community whining
Here is hoping that we will see competitive Community Goals.....that might make for some intriguing PvP scenarios.
Tou blame the PvP community for that? That was to prevent griefers ramming randoms to death. It makes way more sense than before
The ones whining were all PvP (=Open) Players. Nobody else had a problem with it.
A griefer is a PvP player that has beaten the griefee in PvP. ;-)
Its a facepalm special
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
I lost a ship, in Open, to ramming (by a particularly notorious double-act) - I do not consider myself to be a PvP player - that tends to undermine the argument that all players in Open are necessarily PvP players.
Not every player whats to interact with other players, so separate game modes are very good design choice by FD - everybody can select preferred game mode.
PvP players (and other groups, too) whining gets really annoying sometimes...
But I guess this is never ending discussion, since some players thing, that everybody else must play game their way and any other playstyle is wrong..
There are always those PvP players that, for some reason, choose the wrong mode. Those would be unintentional PvPers, but PvPers nonetheless.
If you loose a ship in open to other players, that's by design. The rules change does not prevent that, as suicide attacks apparently happen quite frequently. Also, a player could ram and then combat log.
But due to the whining, all other players have been negatively impacted by the rules change, who now face an additional timesink or additional danger to loose their ships as a result of NPCs ramming them.
Quite funny: Frontier also changed the behaviour of NPCs to mimick the ramming attacks found in station PvP.
If you have a situation where people are being driven off by rock throwing lunatics, the solution is not to give them more stones to chuck.
Hmmm, maybe ED didn't do it, maybe the NPC's learnt it for themselves...
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Choosing the only game mode with an unlimited population is not a mistake - it's the only way to meet as many players as possible. In the absence of an Open-PvE mode (analogous to the existing PvP-enabled Open), Open itself is not a dedicated PvP mode - it's a mode where all players can play and is one of the two game modes where PvP *can* happen.
Due to the ramming escapades of a few unrepentant players, the rules regarding ramming have been implemented to somewhat mitigate station ramming - although there would seem to have been a slight resurgence in the phenomenon recently by some apparently disenchanted players.
It will be interesting to see if the ram-while-scanning bug is fixed (as, I think, we have been told it will be) in 2.1....
I respectfully disagree. Shoehorning players into playing a way they don't want to won't lead to adaptation, it will lead to abandonment. However, if your goal is to simply show me the door, it will succeed expertly.
So the cylon uprising has begun..
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
If the game had ever been intended to force players to participate in PvP then I would have to agree with you.
However, from the outset of the Kickstarter, the published game design information made it rather obvious that PvP was going to be an optional part of gameplay - and that is how every backer / player pledged into / bought the game - with three game modes and mode mobility as part of the game design.
Have a feeling that with 2.1 or soon later the griefer part of PvP will be regulated somehow - with a heavy GTA punishment for or something similar.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
I do hope that 2.1 includes some form of enhanced consequences for illegal PKing (as alluded to by Sandro in the "Yes PvP is unfair" thread, albeit with no timescale attached). The more in Open the "merrier"....
The key to greifing, and I've said this before numerous times, is simply to identify them in game and let the community regulate them.
We need a notoriety system that cannot be paid off like the current fine / bounty system where a wolf can spend a few bucks and go back into the flock as a sheep. A player who kills CLEAN players with any regularity needs to be seen as such to any who encounter them. Then the player can decide to either run or engage as they see fit. We'll have white hat players running the black hats to ground and traders can see at a glance who to avoid.
The only way to wipe out that stigma is a character reset, or a long term remediation process where the marked player needs to do ten good deeds for every negative one to erase the crimes of their past.
Currently, there are no consequences.
![[VR] Mad Mike](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/27/27910.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
to be honest i do not see a problem with a ship having a max of 1xSCB and 1xheat sink launcher..
I would also add, to stop forcing players to run back to reload ever few mins the heat sink launcher could carry more ammo in the hold which takes time to load into the launcher (like loading the tubes in a submarine) and allowing your capacitors to recharge your SCBs - both of these would essentially happen after a fight.
But then in the interests of openness I am not a fan pf PvP in ED outside of CQC so perhaps there are good reasons for it not working. PvE and PvP in ED as I see it at the moment are 2 totally separate games.
A PvP build (in the current meta) is terrible at PvE - stealth does not work against AI IME, and a PvE build is a poor choice in PvP.