For a point of reference The Gnosis has been allowed to jump into unexplored systems before - so fdev have nothing on principal against us getting to unexplored systems. I can see it working like ordinary navigation where you can choose a location on the galmap or sysmap. I like the extra gameplay of exploration, but I guess there may be alternate views - and if you need to refuel in each system them a blind jump becomes possibly terminal for your expensive carrier...
Will exploration change with the new fleet carriers?
- Thread starter Wobblin-Gobblin
- Start date
Subject topic is incorrect. Exploration is not to make longest jump - it is to deliver most accurate data to EDSM & put own name on map of coz.
You will be surprised how much missing in about 700 ly from bubble. Shows somebody name, then I count by fingers..and baam - scanner says 20 objects, in fact it is 18 on map...and of coz i'm 1st to upload to edsm again.
So big ships won't change much here. Best "explorer" moves with shortest possible range.
Deep - long - fast is for wanderers ...
You will be surprised how much missing in about 700 ly from bubble. Shows somebody name, then I count by fingers..and baam - scanner says 20 objects, in fact it is 18 on map...and of coz i'm 1st to upload to edsm again.
So big ships won't change much here. Best "explorer" moves with shortest possible range.
Deep - long - fast is for wanderers ...
I think fdev identified > 10 playstyles when this last came up (<cough> FSS) - some will agree with you (I mostly do), others not so much.
And even detailed area explorers probably want to get to 'their search area' fast. Or at least not very slow...
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Sure, but the Gnosis is a megaship that jumps once a week, so that's at least 6 months to get to the edge of the galaxy. That's very different to an FC that could potentially jump multiple times a day.
Also, the one time that Canonn tried to take it someplace that wasn't reachable by a regular ship FDev dropped a bunch of Thargoids on it.
Sure - just saying that they didn't say 'no, you can't jump to X because it is currently unreachable' they said 'yup, sure' (paraphrasing). Compare with permit locked systems where both for The Gnosis and FC the answer is a straight Nope.
Did you not hear of the glorious expedition Operation Cabin Fever? We went to two otherwise inaccessible systems successfully (HIP 4099 and IRAS 21565-3937). If with a modicum of intense boredom
More here https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/canonn-announces-operation-cabin-fever.507714/
Did you not hear of the glorious expedition Operation Cabin Fever? We went to two otherwise inaccessible systems successfully (HIP 4099 and IRAS 21565-3937). If with a modicum of intense boredom
More here https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/canonn-announces-operation-cabin-fever.507714/
That sounds 'exciting'
We'll see, I guess, but I just think it would be stupid to allow people to take a carrier to Beagle Point without actually flying a ship on the way.
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I do too but I'm concerned about how historically Frontier leans heavily on repetitive and padded gameplay. I just don't want to see any more gameplay that makes you do the same thing time and again once the novelty has worn off.
Damn ..that days I was taking courses "how to startup engine in winder"Sure - just saying that they didn't say 'no, you can't jump to X because it is currently unreachable' they said 'yup, sure' (paraphrasing). Compare with permit locked systems where both for The Gnosis and FC the answer is a straight Nope.
Did you not hear of the glorious expedition Operation Cabin Fever? We went to two otherwise inaccessible systems successfully (HIP 4099 and IRAS 21565-3937). If with a modicum of intense boredom
More here https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/canonn-announces-operation-cabin-fever.507714/
So had no idea about such a trip.
A typical exploration ship can actually jump 500ly in about 2 minutes (2 jumps) using a neutron highway (which a Carrier will presumably not be able to do). So even if Carriers can jump just as quickly, it wouldn't be a massive increase.
And having on-hand repairs and UC wouldn't be a huge change either, as ships can repair themselves pretty well and don't generally blow up before offloading carto data.
Though they would make regions with fewer neutron stars more accessible. It would be like having a truly galaxy-wide neutron network. However, there is the need to refuel occasionally, which is likely to take longer than the refuelling breaks that you need when using a neutron highway.
What I'm hoping is that they can carry enough fuel for many jumps. This would make them useful for "commuting" from the Bubble to a region you want to explore, and back again (though that might need refuelling).
And having on-hand repairs and UC wouldn't be a huge change either, as ships can repair themselves pretty well and don't generally blow up before offloading carto data.
Though they would make regions with fewer neutron stars more accessible. It would be like having a truly galaxy-wide neutron network. However, there is the need to refuel occasionally, which is likely to take longer than the refuelling breaks that you need when using a neutron highway.
What I'm hoping is that they can carry enough fuel for many jumps. This would make them useful for "commuting" from the Bubble to a region you want to explore, and back again (though that might need refuelling).
At last we'll be able to fix the paintwork on our exploration vessels. This alone makes a fleet carrier worth owning.
All they have to do to stop people using the carriers to get to systems that are currently outside the jump range of exploration ships is to make it so that the carrier owner must first fly to the destination system and turn on something like a Wing Beacon, which would cause the carrier to jump to his location. Maybe not too near his location though. Could be a bit disconcerting to suddenly have a dirty great ship pop out of nowhere, telefragging the summoning ship. Funny, though.
Just a humble thought that was going through my head while reading this thread:
This topic (FCs and exploring) brings up an interesting problem: What happens if the fleet carrier had only one jump (left) and we used it to travel to some remote star system unreachable by other means (probably one of the more interesting suspected uses for exploration FCs). And then... you don't find a suitable spot to mine FC - fuel there. Like you need to scoop methane from a gas giant, but the system doesn't have a gas giant. Something like that. You couldn't even send your fleet out to collect fuel elsewhere because the system is too remote - the remoteness was what brought you there in the first place. Your indestructible fleet carrier would be stranded there forever - and you, too, because you couldn't even suicidewinder back. The last place you docked was - you guessd it - the FC.
Either FD has to prevent this kind of dead ends from happening, or fleet carriers need to come with some sort of self destruct mechanism in case you run into a dead end (and mistakes happen quickly, i just say 'Fuel Rats'. No matter how unlikely the problem is to occur, somebody is going to experience it at some point if the chances are above 0%. And then FD/ the gameplay needs to have an answer for it). I mean any ship in the ED universe has a self destruct mechanism (so far), and it is used to get you out of such spots for a cost.
Now imagine what would be necessary to make sure FCs could never strand anywhere... or how you would feel if you had to blow your FC up (and by that also your fleet) because you made a mistake. To me these thoughts shine a new light on fleet carriers and their possible game meachanics.
This topic (FCs and exploring) brings up an interesting problem: What happens if the fleet carrier had only one jump (left) and we used it to travel to some remote star system unreachable by other means (probably one of the more interesting suspected uses for exploration FCs). And then... you don't find a suitable spot to mine FC - fuel there. Like you need to scoop methane from a gas giant, but the system doesn't have a gas giant. Something like that. You couldn't even send your fleet out to collect fuel elsewhere because the system is too remote - the remoteness was what brought you there in the first place. Your indestructible fleet carrier would be stranded there forever - and you, too, because you couldn't even suicidewinder back. The last place you docked was - you guessd it - the FC.
Either FD has to prevent this kind of dead ends from happening, or fleet carriers need to come with some sort of self destruct mechanism in case you run into a dead end (and mistakes happen quickly, i just say 'Fuel Rats'. No matter how unlikely the problem is to occur, somebody is going to experience it at some point if the chances are above 0%. And then FD/ the gameplay needs to have an answer for it). I mean any ship in the ED universe has a self destruct mechanism (so far), and it is used to get you out of such spots for a cost.
Now imagine what would be necessary to make sure FCs could never strand anywhere... or how you would feel if you had to blow your FC up (and by that also your fleet) because you made a mistake. To me these thoughts shine a new light on fleet carriers and their possible game meachanics.
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That could be one reason it might be a cargo item and not an engineering collectible. Then it can be cargo dropped and another ship might be able to bring it on board.
I was hoping it could be fueled by minable rocks. Then I can spend countless million on excess fuel!! 8)
I'm a little disapointed though if we can't mix exploration and mining etc. I think it's going to be one carrier with one job though. And not with changeable modules.
I'm kind of hoping we can carry a lot of stuff and the support ship simply flys out and mines on it's own and comes back after a while. Depending on how much it needs to collect that is. Or how much you tell it to. Maybe a recall function if you need to go somewhere.
I'm going to assume they work something like current giant ships in USS.
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I thought suicidewider was to reject rebuy on a cheap-o sidewinder and thus be sent back to starting system with just a loaned sidewinder. It didn’t sound like it involved losing everything else and people couldn’t suicide back from Colonia if they ended up at the last place they docked.
Anyway, any solution to that kind of stupid ought to involve losing the FC and the ships in it. It reminds me of saying “my character doesn’t have the items needed for the final quest and I overwrote all my saves after I started the quest. What do have as a solution for me doing this”?
Anyway, any solution to that kind of stupid ought to involve losing the FC and the ships in it. It reminds me of saying “my character doesn’t have the items needed for the final quest and I overwrote all my saves after I started the quest. What do have as a solution for me doing this”?
Figured this much out. This is how they do outfitting. It just takes them down instead of into a larger hole. You can tell by the image. That or the reason the stop of the vehicle is the only part with pads is becasue the bottom part is where it's fairied to for outfitting.
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While being at it, there's more to my idea: A scenario I call the hostage trolling tactic (TM), which would be easily possible if a FC could do several jumps in a row without refueling.
You dock your casual ship with some small or mediocre jumprange at my FC and log out. We know this will be possible because it was already stated that I can control who is allowed to dock at my ship and that it is persistent.
I just waited for someone to dock and now decide to jump to a remote system that is 100 or so lightyears away from its neighbors. Then I hop into my Jumpaconda, the only ship that I stored in my FC, jumponium out, head back to the bubble and have fun, while you in your casual ship are left stranded with literally no way back home exept for FD intervention or my good will to come and bring you (and my FC) back whenever I feel like it. I mean some gankers went to sag A* just to troll people. So this seems like an easy tactic in comparison to me.
The thing is: if you blow someone up they face the rebuy screen and possibly have to train a new crewmember, but they are not helplessly cut off from compelling gameplay. Vicious stuff. Makes me wonder how careful we should be with docking at fleet carriers that don't belong to people we know, especially if we consider to log off.
You dock your casual ship with some small or mediocre jumprange at my FC and log out. We know this will be possible because it was already stated that I can control who is allowed to dock at my ship and that it is persistent.
I just waited for someone to dock and now decide to jump to a remote system that is 100 or so lightyears away from its neighbors. Then I hop into my Jumpaconda, the only ship that I stored in my FC, jumponium out, head back to the bubble and have fun, while you in your casual ship are left stranded with literally no way back home exept for FD intervention or my good will to come and bring you (and my FC) back whenever I feel like it. I mean some gankers went to sag A* just to troll people. So this seems like an easy tactic in comparison to me.
The thing is: if you blow someone up they face the rebuy screen and possibly have to train a new crewmember, but they are not helplessly cut off from compelling gameplay. Vicious stuff. Makes me wonder how careful we should be with docking at fleet carriers that don't belong to people we know, especially if we consider to log off.
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