Many people are under the impression that players cannot trade with other players, and that there is no way to give another player credits. There is, it's just boring as hell. A friend got himself into a python, but was unable to afford the re-buy so I went out to give him some credits. How do you do this? Commodities and collector limpits. Jettison cargo for the other player to pick up and sell. Incredibly tedious and asinine that I can't just forward him some credits and be on my way...
Worst player to player trade system ever
- Thread starter Mordeth Kai
- Start date
Gold sellers.
Although, I did have a good system written down to avoid this.
It's in one of my suggestion, somewhere. Probably well over a year old now.
Although, I did have a good system written down to avoid this.
It's in one of my suggestion, somewhere. Probably well over a year old now.
clearly this does not prevent gold selling if there were an interest in it. Besides, keeping player trading out of the game because 'gold sellers' is like chopping your balls off to prevent pregnancy.
You mean I didn't have to chop them off?
Gold sellers will destroy any game if you give them an opening to do so. I have seen several games destroyed in this way, economies completely wrecked because players now have too much game cash because they can buy millions at a time. Greed sets in by those looking to get rich quick and charging silly prices for trinkets so rich players give them wads of gold and the rich players are so rich, they don't even miss it. Then you have Mr newbie who bought the game but doesn't have a never-ending supply of real money to buy gold and then has to struggle to get enough to play in game, he soon quits because it's an almost impossible grind to buy even the cheapest item.
Eve Online, EverQuest, World of Warcraft and many other well known titles have been decimated by gold sellers. Would you honestly like to see a Python price go up from 57 million credits to several billion and a rebuy cost of hundreds of millions?
Keeping easy player trading out was done on purpose. Not that hard to figure out why.
Lestat
Banned
By the time your friend got to the python he should of known about the re buy cost. So your friend lack judgement when he payed for having a python but had no funds for insurance.
I rather have it incredible tedious then have someone who has Billions in Credit buy another player buy a large ship that they do not earn also Invite Gold seller to do the same function.
And chopping your balls off prevents pregnancy. It works, but it's a draconian solution, there are better ways. Eliminating player trading to prevent 'gold sellers' is about as lazy as you can get.
It helps to understand how gold selling works. Gold sellers rarely get their currency by honest means, they usually either hack the game itself or hack peoples accounts to steal assets. Preventing these actions should be done regardless. The other thing needed is enough interest in the game to justify the time effort and risks associated with gold selling, and Elite simply doesn't have a large enough player base. Furthermore gold sellers thrive mostly in asian countries due to a difference in tolerance for microtransaction models and P2W, and generally stick to games that are microtransaction heavy because it means that
1: the players are used to spending real money for in game items
2: there is a market to undercut.
As it stands, if there was enough interest in gold selling in Elite it would already be happening, as demonstrated above. Hypothetically, if I were a gold seller, I could easily arrange to give credits to someone, it would simply take a bit of time to complete the transaction but in a couple hours a new player could have 100 mil or more. Would it be the most ideal way to do it? No, but it is entirely possible and yet it does not happen.
A condom might not be the most fool proof method of preventing pregnancy, and accidents can occur, but it is infinitely preferable to chopping your balls off. I.e. there are better ways....
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Except gold selling already does happen in Elite, so there goes your argument.
No, it proves my point, that the draconian measures solved nothing.
Here's a better solution, allow any entry in the chat to be selected and reported, with penalties for false flagging. That way a copy of the message gets saved and sent along with the account of the person posting it, making it easy for players to get the activity banned. A single entry getting multiple reports would get higher priority. As you just said, gold selling hasn't been prevented, so lets use a more constructive solution that doesn't involve draconian measures.
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You are saying if there are no gold sellers it proves your point, but if there are gold sellers it proves your point?
I'm not sure I agree with your line of reasoning.
Copy of what message? Gold sellers would just advertise out of game as they do now.
FWIW gold sellers do exist, one even had the sense to try advertising his services on the forum. It's just with ED they are few and far between, because of the difficulties involved.
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My point revolved around gold selling still being possible. If it's possible and it doesn't happen, then people are worried over nothing, if it's possible and it does happen then it shows the current measures are ineffective. To unhinge the argument you would have to prove that it isn't possible, not whether or not it occurs. They really need to start teaching logic in school.
My overarching point is twofold, that the measures are excessive, and that they fail. You chopped your balls off and she still got pregnant, worst possible scenario. Not only are we left without the joys of an important staple of online persistent world games, gold selling isn't prevented by it. It's insult to injury. That makes my point more valid, not less.
Edit: Also, on the subject of inflation, as long as all ships and modules in the game are still sold by NPC's the prices are fixed. What will get inflated is engineer materials and engineered modules. Since that can all be done the old fashioned, I don't see it as a problem with people paying with in game currency instead of time.
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No you don't, that it's rare is enough evidence that it's effective.
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Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Stopping player-to-player credit transactions also stops the game devolving into attacking any ship to extort credits out of the target's pilot.
Stopping sale of ships and modules stops players skipping the requirement to unlock certain ships and Engineers for themselves.
Stopping sale of ships and modules stops players skipping the requirement to unlock certain ships and Engineers for themselves.
Wait, "Its just boring as hell" an auction house or similar as other games have is exciting? say what? I think maybe boring is the wrong word....you are trying to find?
There is a solid reasoning behind it though namely that player to player trading is one of the most problematic issues in mmo's and similar, so yeah, it isn't as big an issue as you make it if you ask me, if you really want to pay someone you can.
Lestat
Banned
Why Give more ammo for gold sellers? So you can cater to a lazy player? We earn our ships. Lazy players that pay gold sellers did not earn their ships.
So your idea have Frontier go though thousands of reports so they can ban Gold sellers. I think their resource could be use elsewhere. Like adding more game content.
Right now it might happen but it going to be hard to do. If it a new player in a small ship with a small cargo hold. It would take HOUR for the gold seller to do. So is it worth time and effort worth it for gold sellers?
It might be excessive. But Frontier can use their time upgrading the game vs dealing with Gold seller and hack accounts.
Well you forget your first post. You wanted to give credit to a friend who made a stupid mistake and had no way to rebuy his ship.
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I for one enjoy the lack of a trade system and specially the lack of trading post/auction house.
Everyone flies what they earned in game and no gold sellers or leeching flippers/speculators to ruin the ingame economy.
Dedicated flippers love that, but they don't add anything to the game. Just makes a few players richer at the detriment of the ingame economy. Plus money or itens got thru' flipping might later be sold to someone else for real money.
Everyone flies what they earned in game and no gold sellers or leeching flippers/speculators to ruin the ingame economy.
Dedicated flippers love that, but they don't add anything to the game. Just makes a few players richer at the detriment of the ingame economy. Plus money or itens got thru' flipping might later be sold to someone else for real money.
Ok here's a scenario that doesn't even take gold selling into consideration.
Player A has played for some time and has more credits than he knows what to do with.
Player B (player A's friend) joins and doesn't want the grind to get a bigger ship.
Player A take pity and gives his friend an Anaconda, then gives him a few engineered mods to put on it. He gives Player B enough credits to rebuy if he looses it.
Player B has not played for more than 5 minutes and now has one of the top ranked ships. He now doesn't want to trade or do any of the "boring" stuff to earn credits himself and instead, becomes a griefer in the starter system, killing noobs in Sideys because it's "fun to hear them cry".
Well done to player A. Due to his charity, the new players in the starter system, trying hard to make an honest living and play the way the game is SUPPOSED to be played, can now enjoy his friend ganking them and laughing because he's now so uber in his engineered Conda without even spending a single day to work for it.
And that it what makes new players quit.
Player A has played for some time and has more credits than he knows what to do with.
Player B (player A's friend) joins and doesn't want the grind to get a bigger ship.
Player A take pity and gives his friend an Anaconda, then gives him a few engineered mods to put on it. He gives Player B enough credits to rebuy if he looses it.
Player B has not played for more than 5 minutes and now has one of the top ranked ships. He now doesn't want to trade or do any of the "boring" stuff to earn credits himself and instead, becomes a griefer in the starter system, killing noobs in Sideys because it's "fun to hear them cry".
Well done to player A. Due to his charity, the new players in the starter system, trying hard to make an honest living and play the way the game is SUPPOSED to be played, can now enjoy his friend ganking them and laughing because he's now so uber in his engineered Conda without even spending a single day to work for it.
And that it what makes new players quit.
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Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Replace "Player B" with "Player A's Alt Account" and the result is much the same....