Would You Explore More if Return Was Easier?

[who?]

I'd love the ability to transfer exploration data to another craft/pilot. They cash it in, you get the money (perhaps they get a commission, or else the pilots arrange that separately).

You could then have dedicated explorers touring where they like, and arranging rendezvous with data-mules to carry the data back to the bubble and cash it in. The explorers get to do what they love doing. The mules get money for ferrying data, plus some exploring of their own on the way. And there's a means & reason for some interaction between players. Win-Win-Win.

 

[John Stoutbeard]

Flying far and beyond, and by that it takes days to get out there and back, is the only true personal accomplishment left in exploration.
It's the only thing which makes it truly dangerous. Mess up once, and days of work may be wasted.
If you remove that it will be like flying in populated / civilized space. Which isn't very dangerous.

So no thank you.

 

[fluffa]

No, but I would if there were things out there

 

[Schmack]

Flying far and beyond, and by that it takes days to get out there and back, is the only true personal accomplishment left in exploration.
It's the only thing which makes it truly dangerous. Mess up once, and days of work may be wasted.
If you remove that it will be like flying in populated / civilized space. Which isn't very dangerous.

So no thank you.

That makes sense, however I don't mean it's one or the other. If you had the ability to jump 500 light-years would you choose what you're doing now instead?

Do you believe adding longer Lightyear ability would harm exploration?

 

[Achuta]

No, but I would if there were things out there

You never encountered a space dragon? They exist.

 

[Witcherman]

I don't mind how difficult it is, as others have already said, the challenge is part of exploring. My problem is that after 200 odd systems (I've done more than that), it's the same-old, same-old with nothing new.

I'd love to come into a system and find something more interesting than a few stars and planets that look exactly like the stars and planets that I've already seen. How about a secret pirate base? How about an ancient derelict space ship (alien maybe?), how about a really juicy mining location that gives me an extra monetary bonus for finding it and...would also spur the development of a mining outpost to take advantage of that new find (just like what happened in Alaska).

Anyway, just my two cents.

 

[Duckfather]

Nope. Insta-travel has ruined more MMO's than I can even bother to think about!

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

for better or for worse that part of it is what it is... do i want more interesting stuff out there and more interesting mechanics, absolutely! but the notion of magically increasing jump range is a disaster imo, infact i wish it was HARDER to go long distances not easier and it truly saddens me that we got the entire galaxy open to us day 1 without having to actually discover it outside of the bubble, and this kind of thing cant be fixed now imo..... (unless the thatgoids do something as i suggested once before to mess up our nav beakon system)

remember cargo weight in our ship is a small fraction of the total mass of our vessels therefore the differnce between a fully laden ship and a stripped out one should actually not be that great imo.

*maybe* 1 day in the future we get alien tech to create a wormhole to take us to 1 specific spot, to essentially give us a new area of space with new stuff and new aliens perhaps..... i dunno, but this should imo be a 1 off, and outside of using that 1 worm hole imo things should be as they are now.

Like the thread title says, if you could return to your system with stations and outposts easier, faster and such, would you be more inclined to set off on a 1000 Lightyear plus mission of exploration? What stops me from going that far is the fact that I have to turn around and come back. I would like to have a Lightyear jump in excess of 500 light years to get back. I would probably only jump a few light years on the way out so I can explore all of the systems.

I am wondering if that will ever happen. I don't understand the need to restrict jump range except for trading purposes. I would like to have a ship that will jump a long distance it would be fine if it does not carry cargo.

I realize some of you prefer the realism of the return trip. Some of you go out there for months. I would not mind being out a few weeks in fact as long as I was doing something new. I don't want to get stuck doing repetitive things just to get back.

I also understand the problem of fuel consumption. I disagree with it however just because the concept of faster than light travel requires about the same amount of fuel to get to speed regardless how far you go. That's why we can send satellites out of our solar system. Once you get up to speed the fuel should be used to stop you if anything.

So what say you? Longer Lightyear jumps with no cargo hold or is 35 light years enough? This isn't just another thread wanting more and more or having the ability to get to the end of the game faster. I don't want to make the Galaxy smaller, but realistically the large majority of it will never be visited by anyone.

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

Don't really know about easier as there isn't much to exploration as it stands.

Quick return home would kill the only challenging thing about exploration when you're deep on a long range mission, your mind wanders (as it's so damn boring) and you make a mistake .. It's not really exploration (honk - jump - honk - jump) more a mental challenge to see who can keep it together longest.

There needs to be more interaction with the game for exploration to be exciting for myself ..

 

[John Stoutbeard]

That makes sense, however I don't mean it's one or the other. If you had the ability to jump 500 light-years would you choose what you're doing now instead?

Do you believe adding longer Lightyear ability would harm exploration?

Unfortunately Yes, it would be reducing their personal accomplishment for those who have already done it, planning on doing or doing it sometime in the future.
I can see that now, altough I don't explore as much myself anymore. But allowing them to have this as a goal cannot be mixed by making it more available by shortening the time and risk it takes to get out there and back.

 

[Maun]

I would explore more if it wasn't do damn boring .. tried to set off on a big adventure 3 times and get maybe 100-200LY out and bored stiff

honk - jump - honk - jump

There needs to be more interaction with the game for exploration to be exciting for myself ..

As a lot of people have pointed out, if there was actually something to explore then I couldn't care how long it took to get back.

Looking at different colour snooker balls is not fun, there's very little to make you go "wow" when you jump into a system, they're generally a cut and paste of the last system.

There needs to be far more things to do while exploring, derelict ships, random stations, cargo hauls etc etc

 

[John Stoutbeard]

I would explore more if it wasn't do damn boring .. tried to set off on a big adventure 3 times and get maybe 100-200LY out and bored stiff

honk - jump - honk - jump

There needs to be more interaction with the game for exploration to be exciting for myself ..

Agree. It needs some more interaction / intelligence to perform. Right now it's just press button... wait. Jump. Repeat.
Improvements would change my own decision to use more time in exploration. Unfortunately, making it easier to return would not.

 

[CMDR Hagglebeard]

The solution isn't a larger jump drive, the solution is to have multiple CMDR slots.

 

[Schmack]

The solution isn't a larger jump drive, the solution is to have multiple CMDR slots.

I don't understand what that means.

 

[Surly_Badger]

Well that's a stawman. I'll let you figure that one out.

It's no more a strawman than your question was.

Seriously: would you complain that the game was a boring grind if you found out that all the aspects of it that made it worthwhile for other players had been removed for the convenience of the noisier players who complained?

What's a straw-man about that?

For people who prefer to explore, they will see nothing wrong with spending months jumping from system to system to scan planets. But let's say you found something you wanted to get back to, it would take you the same amount of time to get back there again and you already been that route. Why would you ever go back?

Someone who enjoys exploring for its own sake would do it, or wouldn't do it, depending on their motives.

I mean, you're talking to the guy who went 4,000ly - not gathering exploration data on the way - to deliver 31t of fuel to a stranded explorer, then turned around and went back. And I'd do it again and again for no other motives than that's how I roll.

I'm also a pretty serious explorer (just short of elite) and have been to Sag A* and back -- and other interesting places besides -- and I think the game-play as it stands is already too easy. But that's just me. One difference you may notice, though, is that I'm not starting threads asking if people would quit the game if game-play were more like the way I'd prefer it.

Having the ability to jump that range doesn't mean you must. You can still explore every single system you encounter. I just don't see why anyone would explore something no one is interested in seeing. That could be just a side note if you could get there or get back quicker. How many of you explorers never see the planets in the systems that you visit? How many of you turn do your advanced scan and jump again?

I don't see why I should have to walk back from the corner store after I've gone all the way to the corner store in the first place?! Why can't I just click my heels 3 times and go home. That would be ever so much better.

Actually, you can go all the way out and not have to come back: fly out there and hit the self-destruct button and you'll wake up in the last place you docked. Ta-da! Oh, wait, did you want the reward for going all the way out and all the way back? Sorry.

Let me tell you what I think. I don't think you've done very much exploring at all, or if you have, you haven't thought about it at all. Because, if you had, you'd have realized that you can explore like crazy in the areas around human space and find all kinds of stuff and it looks exactly like the stuff on the other side of the galaxy. The whole galaxy is the same; it's all the same stuff. The only value to being on the other side of the galaxy is that it's the other side of the galaxy. The only value to the trip at all is the trip itself. You've either: a) not done much exploring or b) never thought very hard about what you do. My money is on c) all of the above.

Edit: I posted that in orbit around a pretty black hole in SKAUDE sector that I discovered early on this year. I've gone back because it was a navigation-mark I could use. I'm now going to head for a blue giant nearby. I've been over this course 3 times now (out, back, then out again) and because of how navigation works, I have only encountered one system I have been in before, and that's the one I aimed for. Have you done any exploring?

 

[Bacalao]

There is a very worthwhile and important point hidden in the game-play, which may take a while to sink in: the systems 20ly away are not any different from the systems 100ly away. The vastness of space has absolutely no point at all. And that's the point.

More realistic game-play would be that we'd be compensated more highly for finding valuable stuff that was within range to practically exploit. If you found a planetoid of solid platinum 20,000ly away, it'd be worth less because of the travel-time to exploit it than a more or less average metallic ring 20ly away. An earth-like world within practical distance to terraform ought to be worth billions, whereas an earth-like world 20,000ly away is hardly worth a nod or a pat on the back. "Yeah, there's a zillion of them out there."

There is absolutely zero value to anyone (other than the curious boffins at universal cartographics) to know there's a black hole somewhere on the other side of the galaxy. Yeah, so what? We can tell by virtue of basic statistics that there are going to be. One explorer goes out there and confirms that the basic statistics are done and then what? It's not like someone's going to go 60,000ly to look at a black hole that is exactly the same as every other black hole about the same size.

This is assuming humanity would and/or should stay in one centralized location. It seems very valuable to me that distant systems should be mapped in detail and that finding an area 10k, 30k, 50k Ly from Sol on the other side of the galaxy with a cluster of earth-like or terraforming candidate worlds would be of extreme value for any species that didn't want to put all of it's eggs in one basket.

I really hope that at some point in the future of Elite we see more than just one little bubble of civilized space in one little corner of the galaxy. The recent outbreak CGs illustrate the danger of having a fairly concentrated set of systems in one corner of the galaxy. Knowing where the black holes, neutrons and dwarfs are would be highly valuable to any corporation looking at sending large carrier/construction vessels through that area.

I would like that when I discover, jump in and honk, a system (I am currently 25,000 Ly away in one of the neutron clusters) the little orange arc over the star in the galaxy map would change color (perhaps blue) so I could track which systems I had scanned at a glance, that way I could map a region of space completely before moving on. As it is, after doing about 60% of the systems in the immediate area it becomes very difficult to pinpoint which systems you haven't visited yet, so you jump 30 Ly away and do another little cluster of stars. Complete data sets (neighboring systems) seem like they would be more valuable than scanning every icy and rocky moon in a single system, regardless of distance from Sol, as it would give information about the viability of establishing another "bubble" and any dangers on the way.

 

[TruffleSnout]

I don't think I could explore more - faster return trip or otherwise.

I'm the kind of player that is in-system for ~a week, then i disappear for a month exploring. Even if I could jump back to the bubble in a single jump, I'd probably just head right back out after a week in bubble, because that's about all the civilization I can stand before I get the bug again.

 

[Quineloe]

Exploring completely and totally locks you into exploring. If you're more than 5k LY out, you won't be doing anything other than exploring today. 10k LY, it's two days to return. That's a pretty big dedication for those who want to do different things. Luckily, you can still claim firsties 1k LY out, so you can explore without completely committing your account to it.

And I hope FD stays away from multiple CMDR slots forever.

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

The solution isn't a larger jump drive, the solution is to have multiple CMDR slots.

I agree as that encourages people to explore more with a 2nd commander and when they wanted a change jump to back to their other one. Also, look at the DDF articles on exploration and we had a massive brainstorm with FD:

Initial pitch by FD

Revised pitch by FD

Now admittedly these were discussed prior to the change to in-game travel as originally FD wanted hot spots (points of interest) that you "found" and jumped to ... as that was basically "rooms in space" and the DDF unanimously rejected that idea FD came back with supercruise ... That may have broken a lot of the ideas for exploration, but there's still hope.

- - - Updated - - -

And I hope FD stays away from multiple CMDR slots forever.

I hope FD honour their stance with multiple commander slots .. it will help with so many things that the benefits outweigh the drawbacks.

 

[deMangler]

That makes sense, however I don't mean it's one or the other. If you had the ability to jump 500 light-years would you choose what you're doing now instead?

Do you believe adding longer Lightyear ability would harm exploration?

During Alpha I and a lot of people assumed that getting to the centre of the galaxy was not something that a player would do any time soon. There was talk of human space expanding and infrastructure requirements to facilitate long distance exploration that would come in later expansions and future-proof the game.
Looking back, this was naive, but the devs also seemed to be under this impression.
Then, after release, it is relatively trivial to get to the galactic centre. This is psychologically bad and is a mistake but there is no un-doing it now.
It does not mean that we will explore the total galaxy any time soon - there are still 400 billion stars, but it does mean that psychologically it seems unimportant as there is no real need to expand human space. Might as well just settle the millions of systems already nearby.
So, to get back to the point, I think that exploration has been the victim of a massive design mistake that cannot be undone, but making travel even easier would only make it worse.