DLC20 Discussion (maybe, but why not?)

[Marvinb]

I wasn’t actually aware NW monkeys are more represented than OW ones! That does make me less opposed to getting another one instead of another OW monkey, but I feel that with how few spots we have left my personal preference remains with an old world Colobus or Langur. I hope by some miracle we can end the game with both another OW and another NW monkey, but I only expect to get one, if even that.

Fully agree, this has been said many times before by others but it's unfortunate monkeys have missed out on nearly every DLC they could've featured in
Part of me wants to disagree on the take that they're equal right now, but that's probably because I see both the Capuchin and Saki as very usable compared to Africa and Asia's monkeys, which are either primarily ground-dwelling, and therefore not really the right kind of generic monkey (Mandrill, Hamadryas), or so uncommon it doesn't fit into any of the zoos I make (Proboscis). But setting aside my over-specific monkey nitpicks I'd say you're right about them being currently equal.

This has just made me realize even further the sheer number of primates the game is missing out on not all essential by any means, but a heck of a lot more essential than the Coyote or African Leopard (on that note it's a little sad we have more North American canines, all of which look relatively the same, than South American Monkeys)

I think the lack of more traditional monkeys for africa and asia isnt as obvious because the gibbons and lemurs kinda function as a bandaid solution. They arent the real deal, but you can use them in much of the same ways.
Whereas for south america if you wanted to build for a primates, arboreal animal in general really, you were stuck with only the capuchin for like 5 years

 

[RightWhale]

I think the lack of more traditional monkeys for africa and asia isnt as obvious because the gibbons and lemurs kinda function as a bandaid solution. They arent the real deal, but you can use them in much of the same ways.
Whereas for south america if you wanted to build for a primates, arboreal animal in general really, you were stuck with only the capuchin for like 5 years

That’s how I feel, atleast with the other continents you have options for other primates. South America only has the new world monkeys. With Africa you have the lemurs, mandrills, and the baboon. With Asia you have two gibbon species.

I got to be honest outside of the lack of new world monkeys, I haven’t really felt as strongly for monkeys as a whole due to that. We had at least something in game to fill some of those niches, and unfortunately South America was out of luck way too long.

 

[NachoB]

That’s how I feel, atleast with the other continents you have options for other primates. South America only has the new world monkeys. With Africa you have the lemurs, mandrills, and the baboon. With Asia you have two gibbon species.

I got to be honest outside of the lack of new world monkeys, I haven’t really felt as strongly for monkeys as a whole due to that. We had at least something in game to fill some of those niches, and unfortunately South America was out of luck way too long.

Asia also has a langur and a macaque.

 

[The_Riot22]

For reasons related to what I have seen in the real world, man I wish we had owls in game. Some birds would make perfect exhibit animals, and owls are one of them. In captivity they don’t move much, and can benefit from being a “living statue” like other exhibit animals.

Guilty pleasure idea, but imagine if Frontier could change the “Walk through exhibit” and turn it into the “large exhibit”. Basically some species could remove the path in the middle, and you could turn it into a large box. Then you can put a bird into it and boom you got a bird cage. Even better because the current WTE has null walls, so these “large exhibits” can be placed anywhere.

When they first added the walkthrough, my first thought was that this would be a perfect stepping stone to new exhibit sizes...unfortunately not to be.

 

[Spiderhawk]

I was hoping for medium to large sized exhibits that would be more appropriate to house animals that don’t warrant a habitat or are just too big for the current size or to at least make our current exhibit sizes bigger just cause.
I would have been all for loris, shrews, hedgehogs, squirrels, weasels etc.
nothing is certain with frontier anymore as they barely talk to us PC players for more then a sentence anymore. However I believe they have abandoned exhibits all together.

In regards to monkeys above. In my opinion, there’s no wrong monkey to add to the game. The African monkeys so far are uniquely different, heck the gelada and vervet monkeys would even be something special. Asia I believe needs at least one more. On that note, the new world monkeys are unique enough and any will be appreciated. In all honesty, feels like a lot of dlcs throw a curveball animal at us and in this case it was the saki. I don’t recall a lot of people requesting saki over any other new world monkey.

 

[BiologicalHorror]

I am hoping that the reason exhibits have been ignored lately is that they plan on doing something big with them like and overhaul or exhibit focused pack that introduces some birds or fish with in current restraints. But that is just me being really hopeful lol. I doubt anything like that is coming but I’m trying to manifest it.

 

[Marvinb]

I was hoping for medium to large sized exhibits that would be more appropriate to house animals that don’t warrant a habitat or are just too big for the current size or to at least make our current exhibit sizes bigger just cause.
I would have been all for loris, shrews, hedgehogs, squirrels, weasels etc.
nothing is certain with frontier anymore as they barely talk to us PC players for more then a sentence anymore. However I believe they have abandoned exhibits all together.

In regards to monkeys above. In my opinion, there’s no wrong monkey to add to the game. The African monkeys so far are uniquely different, heck the gelada and vervet monkeys would even be something special. Asia I believe needs at least one more. On that note, the new world monkeys are unique enough and any will be appreciated. In all honesty, feels like a lot of dlcs throw a curveball animal at us and in this case it was the saki. I don’t recall a lot of people requesting saki over any other new world monkey.

I think the main reason why they went with the saki is because that way you can dodge all the prehensile tail and brachiation shenanigans of the way more requested howlers and spider monkeys

 

[SanRazo]

I think the main reason why they went with the saki is because that way you can dodge all the prehensile tail and brachiation shenanigans of the way more requested howlers and spider monkeys

I have seen this argument and agree a little, but is the howler monkey really THAT hard? Capuchins got prehensile tails and don’t use them. And other animals like binturongs have an animation or two that do so… I don’t think it’s a huge barrier to entry. Just need to get chorus behaviors in there.

Now the Spider Monkey… that’s a different story

 

[Marvinb]

I have seen this argument and agree a little, but is the howler monkey really THAT hard? Capuchins got prehensile tails and don’t use them. And other animals like binturongs have an animation or two that do so… I don’t think it’s a huge barrier to entry. Just need to get chorus behaviors in there.

Now the Spider Monkey… that’s a different story

I dont think howlers would be impossible to implement in the game, but the saki is just why more straight forward.

And i can only speak for myself but i for sure prefer a well implemented saki over a so so howler or spider

 

[AndyZoos]

For reasons related to what I have seen in the real world, man I wish we had owls in game. Some birds would make perfect exhibit animals, and owls are one of them. In captivity they don’t move much, and can benefit from being a “living statue” like other exhibit animals.

Guilty pleasure idea, but imagine if Frontier could change the “Walk through exhibit” and turn it into the “large exhibit”. Basically some species could remove the path in the middle, and you could turn it into a large box. Then you can put a bird into it and boom you got a bird cage. Even better because the current WTE has null walls, so these “large exhibits” can be placed anywhere.

I've been advocating for this since they added the walk-through exhibits, TBH. I get the whole "you can build them as non-walkthrough by not adding paths" or whatever but... You still can't really build over the path in the exhibit or terraform it.

But yeah, this would be a really nice way to implement birds of prey such as owls or eagles! I would prefer a more 'freeform' approach but in the absence of that? I'll take it.

 

[SanRazo]

I’m surprised we haven’t gotten another langur yet. The probiscis monkey rig is ripe for being re-used

 

[Iben]

they did also say "make sure to sure to stayed tuned to our social for any updates" which they usually only say when news is expected soon.

Yeah that used to be the case but now they just say it every time basically, it's just a way of letting us know that the socials are where to look for info. AFAIR they also said it when they said we were going to get another one with Zookeepers

I also see no reason that later this year could not mean in the "summer" slot because simply put there is no other way to refer to that time period without displaying bias its not next month, its not this season, next season might work but seasonal boundaries are not consistent globally and short of giving a month or quarter later this year is a good enough description without alienating and confusing an entire half of the world by saying it will come in the summer when its not the summer for them.

This I really do disagree with because of two things.

First of, you are of course technically correct, but I'm going to be frank and say that isn't remotely a fair interpretation of "later this year". If I ask my colleague on Monday for something and they tell me it will be ready "later this week"; I can go and ask them about it Tuesday morning because it's technically "later that week" but anyone in the office would tell me that they obviously meant Thursday or Friday, it's kind of implied .

But secondly, Frontier is primarily a company based in and focused on "Western" markets. And they've demonstrated that in their marketing over, and over and over. Not only do they have Frontier Summer/Winter/Spring/Fall sales corresponding with their seasons in the UK, but even the DLCs for the biggest majority follow a similar pattern. It isn't at all surprising that the vast majority of their December DLCS use a lot of winter/cold/snow based visual language, if your primary market has winter in December. It's not something they actively seem to avoid; they lean into it even; so I simply do not agree that they wouldn't just say "Later this summer" to avoid confusion.

Frankly those are the same arguments people made last year when I still do think that their wording is just as clear as it was last time. "Later this year" has always meant "more towards the end of the year" to me than "in two to three months".

That said, I do agree with you that the release of JWE3 or a release of a PC2 DLC is going to influence how quickly we get the PZ DLC. Frontier always sells stuff during June/July/August, and their current situation doesn't really allow for skipping that. So yeah, I do think something is going to be sold during that timeframe. My money is on either JWE3 or a PC2 DLC. PC2 has one more update after the current roadmap to go to give people the fantasy theme; and unless an actual official source from Frontier says something about JWE3 being delayed I'm going to ignore the rumors (frankly, that balloon company theory implies that we know about all upcoming JW games and that it has to be JWE3) that it could be and assume they might still release it during the summer window.

I get what you mean about putting time between this and PZ's sequel; but I think their financial situation probably requires them to focus more on the money they can make now rather than the money they can potentially make in the future. I don't think the two DLCs of this year were even supposed to be there, but here we are anyway.

But honestly, to each their own. I'd love to be wrong because that means less of a wait; but I'm not going to have expectations for anything sooner than September at best.

 

[Aramar]

We've got a habitat reptile each year:

2019 Komodo dragon
2020 Dwarf caiman
2021 American alligator
2022 Spectacled caiman
2023 Asian water monitor
2024 African spurred tortoise

So I think it's very likely that we are getting another one this year. While I could see the perentie coming, I'm betting on an African crocodile, most likely the Nile crocodile. It would be cool to compare the new croc with the original model from 2019.

 

[Marvinb]

We've got a habitat reptile each year:

2019 Komodo dragon
2020 Dwarf caiman
2021 American alligator
2022 Spectacled caiman
2023 Asian water monitor
2024 African spurred tortoise

So I think it's very likely that we are getting another one this year. While I could see the perentie coming, I'm betting on an African crocodile, most likely the Nile crocodile. It would be cool to compare the new croc with the original model from 2019.

Perentie and nile croc are important in their own right, but im really hoping for a more unique one.
Rhinoceros iguana, red footed tortoise, arrau river turtle and argentine tegu would have been really great additions to the americas pack actually, imo we are still in great need of more animals to put into SA tropical houses. This pack really only had the saki and to a lesser extent the ocelot that fit this.

And especially if they keep to the no exhibit paths it would be nice if they pumped up the number of habitat reptiles to make up for it

 

[Mjmannella]

We've got a habitat reptile each year:

2019 Komodo dragon
2020 Dwarf caiman
2021 American alligator
2022 Spectacled caiman
2023 Asian water monitor
2024 African spurred tortoise

So I think it's very likely that we are getting another one this year. While I could see the perentie coming, I'm betting on an African crocodile, most likely the Nile crocodile. It would be cool to compare the new croc with the original model from 2019.

The fact we've only gotten 1 non-avian reptile a year is really saddening

 

[Milurian]

Yeah that used to be the case but now they just say it every time basically, it's just a way of letting us know that the socials are where to look for info. AFAIR they also said it when they said we were going to get another one with Zookeepers


This I really do disagree with because of two things.

First of, you are of course technically correct, but I'm going to be frank and say that isn't remotely a fair interpretation of "later this year". If I ask my colleague on Monday for something and they tell me it will be ready "later this week"; I can go and ask them about it Tuesday morning because it's technically "later that week" but anyone in the office would tell me that they obviously meant Thursday or Friday, it's kind of implied .

But secondly, Frontier is primarily a company based in and focused on "Western" markets. And they've demonstrated that in their marketing over, and over and over. Not only do they have Frontier Summer/Winter/Spring/Fall sales corresponding with their seasons in the UK, but even the DLCs for the biggest majority follow a similar pattern. It isn't at all surprising that the vast majority of their December DLCS use a lot of winter/cold/snow based visual language, if your primary market has winter in December. It's not something they actively seem to avoid; they lean into it even; so I simply do not agree that they wouldn't just say "Later this summer" to avoid confusion.

Frankly those are the same arguments people made last year when I still do think that their wording is just as clear as it was last time. "Later this year" has always meant "more towards the end of the year" to me than "in two to three months".

That said, I do agree with you that the release of JWE3 or a release of a PC2 DLC is going to influence how quickly we get the PZ DLC. Frontier always sells stuff during June/July/August, and their current situation doesn't really allow for skipping that. So yeah, I do think something is going to be sold during that timeframe. My money is on either JWE3 or a PC2 DLC. PC2 has one more update after the current roadmap to go to give people the fantasy theme; and unless an actual official source from Frontier says something about JWE3 being delayed I'm going to ignore the rumors (frankly, that balloon company theory implies that we know about all upcoming JW games and that it has to be JWE3) that it could be and assume they might still release it during the summer window.

I get what you mean about putting time between this and PZ's sequel; but I think their financial situation probably requires them to focus more on the money they can make now rather than the money they can potentially make in the future. I don't think the two DLCs of this year were even supposed to be there, but here we are anyway.

But honestly, to each their own. I'd love to be wrong because that means less of a wait; but I'm not going to have expectations for anything sooner than September at best.

My main point with the season thing is unlike just theming your packs or sales around the northern hemisphere seasons where the action has already occurred and cannot be interpreted as anything else making a statement the promises something based on a timeframe that is inconsistent with who is viewing is bad marketing because people will actively assume different timeframes. Otherwise I think your interpretation is plausible just not what I expect.

I do disagree that this period will be filled with JWE 3 since all but 1 of frontier cms games have released in November which to me would indicate that this is the planned timeframe and if deviations are to occur it will not be 6 months earlier. A planet coaster dlc is likely but I dont see this affecting an overall trend of planet zoo dlc since the release of the entire game only pushed the dlc around by a week or so and never meant to imply that I think that planet coaster release schedule influences planet zoos because I dont personally believe it will since jwe2 never did. That being said I do think the reason we even got dlc 19 and likely 20 was to support pc2 providing frontier with dlc income to bridge the gap between pc2 free updates and when the will start releasing paid content again.

Again if it wasn't for the timing of the console bundle I would agree with you that it would be a late dlc but to me the console timeframe points to the release time being next season because reaching parity on the 20th dlc at a consistent schedule for console players a year and a half out of from a potential sequel right as a new cms game is going to release and another one is starting to produce dlc seems like a calculated decision. Otherwise its going to end up being trying to squeeze JWE3, PZ2 dlc, PZ dlc and console bundles alongside 2 anniversaries all around novemeber which is a bad decision though given frontiers outlook not one im surprised by.

 

[PlanetSoyJak]

DLC confirmation?

 

[PlanetSoyJak]

Also I see no use in spending hours of your life on a Thread when we already probably know when its coming out.

 

[Mjmannella]

Well we know it's releasing within the next 7 months, we have nothing beyond that much info

 

[Spiderhawk]

My reptile zoo is one of my favorites and apart of me wants to fill it even further especially with more exhibits. I personally want there Perentie and il take other habitat reptiles but idk I’m not interested in Nile crocs or false gharials.
I definitely want Perenties, I can say yes to crocodile monitors, will take rhino iguanas (sow an indoor habitat with them sharing with tortoises).
Now in regards to crocodilian fans, do you want the Nile croc and false gharials as they would complete the croc family similar to how we just completed the ratites?