please don't confuse PvPers with griefers

[PillowTalk]

Some jerk killing you even if you have no bounty = Not a griefer.

Some jerk purposely flying into your weapons to make you wanted = griefer.

Some jerk interdicting you = Not a griefer

Some jerk doing the last 1% of damage to your target to steal your kill = Griefer

 

[Jordan Cobalt]

Some jerk doing the last 1% of damage to your target to steal your kill = Griefer

I don't think this is griefing, jerkish yes, but not griefing. It's more of a cutthroat bounty hunter imo.

I agree with the rest tho.

 

[EUBanana]

Are you anti pvpers going to be playing Star Citizen too, lol. You will die!

Not an anti pvper, but probably not going to play Star Citizen. Looks way too focused on guilds/corporations. Though I could be wrong. I mean Planetside 2 is supposedly as well but I lone wolfed on that for years no problem.

 

[obliterator]

It was implied with your condescending tone.

No it wasn't, don't put words in my mouth. Read my posts again, I shouldn't need to explain this.

You could always join one of the numerous pirate groups forming and fight amongst yourselves. But that's not what you folks really want is it? There's no fun in planned and coordinated fights, is there?

You really have some trouble reading don't you? As I said, the point is that in the current state of the game, those groups are LESS optimal than just wandering around aimlessly looking for a fight, as the matchmaking system is next to non-existent. That's not up to pvp players to solve a problem that pve players are complaining about, so instead of asking pvp players to play in a sub optimal way just to accommodate your needs, ask for better game mechanics instead.

 

[Tradesman]

Not an anti pvper, but probably not going to play Star Citizen. Looks way too focused on guilds/corporations. Though I could be wrong. I mean Planetside 2 is supposedly as well but I lone wolfed on that for years no problem.

No its a supposed to be a "do what you want" game too.
I wont be playing it I'm an Elitist.

 

[Sanguisaevum]

By Clicking OPEN mode you CONSENT to PLAYER INTERACTION (Including mindless PVP if the person interacting with you is that way inclined)

It is THAT SIMPLE.

 

[Jorlin]

By Clicking OPEN mode you CONSENT to PLAYER INTERACTION (Including mindless PVP)

It is THAT SIMPLE.

sad but true

"sad" because many people choose to play Solo or PvE-Group because of the fear of "mindless Playerkilling".

 

[BrewerGeorge]

A pirate shoots someone to enjoy his his own gain. A griefer shoots someone to enjoy their loss. No problem with the former in game (should be more risk of it hauling valuable stuff to anarchies), the latter are pathetic.

By Clicking OPEN mode you CONSENT to PLAYER INTERACTION (Including mindless PVP if the person interacting with you is that way inclined)

It is THAT SIMPLE.

Welcome to Page 1.

 

[Connatic]

You could always join one of the numerous pirate groups forming and fight amongst yourselves. But that's not what you folks really want is it? There's no fun in planned and coordinated fights, is there?

Pirates attack ships for their booty. Why would Pirates attack each other unless they were fighting over the loot a juicy trader dropped? Some of us just want there to be a Trader -> Pirate -> Bounty Hunter food chain involving other commanders. I just don't understand how anyone could be upset that it's a CMDR instead of an NPC doing the Pirating, especially when they join OPEN play.

If people insist on playing in OPEN and then complaining about any aggressive interaction with another CMDR, perhaps then Frontier could increase the Bounty for Murdering another CMDR, or adding a bounty for spamming multiple interdiction. At least then it will help make the "griefing" style of play more rare. Personally, I always just assumed OPEN play meant surprise Hard mode.

 

[obliterator]

Pirates attack ships for their booty. Why would Pirates attack each other unless they were fighting over the loot a juicy trader dropped? Some of us just want there to be a Trader -> Pirate -> Bounty Hunter food chain involving other commanders. I just don't understand how anyone could be upset that it's a CMDR instead of an NPC doing the Pirating, especially when they join OPEN play.

They're mostly talking about people who are just looking for a fight. And when you tell them that better tools to help those player find each other would solve the entire problem, they simply argue that you can form a group.. Which is obviously not the answer, as if that was even a remotely good mechanic for pvp, most people would already be using it.

 

[Helvellyn]

By Clicking OPEN mode you CONSENT to PLAYER INTERACTION (Including mindless PVP if the person interacting with you is that way inclined)

It is THAT SIMPLE.

If it eventually ends up with such players being constantly blasted by Elite bounty hunters in a few months' time I wonder if they'll be trotting out the same lines then.

Just because you can do a think does not mean you should, and that any not explicitly banned behaviour is acceptable behaviour.

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You really have some trouble reading don't you? As I said, the point is that in the current state of the game, those groups are LESS optimal than just wandering around aimlessly looking for a fight, as the matchmaking system is next to non-existent. That's not up to pvp players to solve a problem that pve players are complaining about, so instead of asking pvp players to play in a sub optimal way just to accommodate your needs, ask for better game mechanics instead.

You're asking the people happy with pirates but not keen on being shot up for someone's kicks to do just that. Sure, we need improved mechanisms, no argument there, but it's something everyone should be asking for.

 

[Adept]

What nonesense OP. People who get their jollies from attacking players in weaker ships just to get a PK are in effect exactly that. Griefers.

There is no in-world justification. They are not looking for cargo, or a mission reward. They just want the ego-trip of dominating another human player. The sort of PvPer who sees a _superior_ ship, and challenges thr other player to a duel I have no beef with. Anybody ganking sideys for fun in a viper is a bottomfeeding scumbag.

 

[Asp Explorer]

Anybody ganking sideys for fun in a viper is a bottomfeeding scumbag.

what about people in Sideys slaughtering clueless Viper pilots though?

 

[Connatic]

They're mostly talking about people who are just looking for a fight. And when you tell them that better tools to help those player find each other would solve the entire problem, they simply argue that you can form a group.. Which is obviously not the answer, as if that was even a remotely good mechanic for pvp, most people would already be using it.

Some of us don't want an Arena Dog-fight Simulator. We just want the PvP between Pirates, Traders, and Bounty Hunters to happen naturally once in a while like it does with NPCs. How about instead of trying to neuter OPEN play even more by trying to remove PvP, we just make certain crimes against other CMDRs more severe with higher bounties. I'm pretty sure most people against PvP aren't really against legit Pirates trying to make a buck, but the murderers who stomp Harmless players in their freshly respawned Sidewinders.

 

[Adept]

what about people in Sideys slaughtering clueless Viper pilots though?

Better, definitely

If they are jumped by vipers and teach them some manners, I call them heroes

 

[Zekerbox]

Yes, and this is not one of them. This is one of the ones where everyone is thrown in together (technical issues notwithstanding) and it's up to you to avoid the unfair fights.

The only things which are not ok in a game are the things which violate the rules.

It's interesting that you compare an even fight to a boxing match, but when the fight is unfair you try to "put this argument in the scope of how we as humans think about our interactions in real life" and say that in a game "I should follow normal societal moral codes and values". If, instead of making idiotic comparisons to muggings, you actually make the comparison, you would find that in our real life interactions with other people, we find hitting people in the face unacceptable, unless it is part of a game. Everything done in ED is part of a game too.

How is a comparison to a mugging idiotic? if that is what is happening to people who attack unprovoked? You calling analogy of a mugging scenario idiotic just proves my point about people doing what they want regardless of how it might effect other people. The term idiotic is an offensive way to debate someones point. Would you tell someone to their face that what they just said to you was idiotic? If you did would you be surprised if it offended them? Would you care if they overtly showed offense?

I think you missed my point. The point is just because you can do it and its not in violation of the rules doesn't make it right or morally ok. I drew a comparison to a mugging because that's what it is, just its called piracy in the game. Piracy and griefing are both forms of PvP as PvP only means Player versus Player. So if people who play PvP and decide to mug, gank, pirate, jack or whatever else they do to other players unprovoked then it is still PvP by definition. Therefore my only point to this is that the OP said not to associate PvPers with Griefers, but by definition they can be. Just like a boxer can be a criminal and a fighter can break the law. The same person that could be a boxer and fight in a ring can take advantage of someone. Just because that person is a "fighter" in the reputable definition of the term doesn't make all of their actions as a fighter justifiable. The point is just because people label themselves as PvPers doesn't mean they deserve respect or are automatically assumed to be innocent "PvPers".

 

[Adept]

Some of us don't want an Arena Dog-fight Simulator. We just want the PvP between Pirates, Traders, and Bounty Hunters to happen naturally once in a while like it does with NPCs. How about instead of trying to neuter OPEN play even more by trying to remove PvP, we just make certain crimes against other CMDRs more severe with higher bounties. I'm pretty sure most people against PvP aren't really against legit Pirates trying to make a buck, but the murderers who stomp Harmless players in their freshly respawned Sidewinders.

The consequences for murder should be more serious for ganking harmless newbies with superior ships. The Elite federation sanctions are a good in-universe tool to effect this.

 

[Connatic]

Just because that person is a "fighter" in the reputable definition of the term doesn't make all of their actions as a fighter justifiable.

It does when they are in the boxing ring...and that's what Elite: Dangerous is...it's the boxing ring. ;-D

 

[Araviel]

If it eventually ends up with such players being constantly blasted by Elite bounty hunters in a few months' time I wonder if they'll be trotting out the same lines then.

i am one of those bounty hunters, but that does not seem to matter,
i am still getting branded as a griefer just because i am pro pvp.

 

[Kitiara]

The consequences for murder should be more serious for ganking harmless newbies with superior ships. The Elite federation sanctions are a good in-universe tool to effect this.

Not at all. The penalty for murder should be equal no matter who you kill. And it should be extreme. Sure you CAN go and kill someone, but the bounty you accrue should be at least what the victim lost in the course of the attack.

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i am one of those bounty hunters, but that does not seem to matter,
i am still getting branded as a griefer just because i am pro pvp.

Targeting ships that have bounties on them is always fine. It's only where clean ships are targeted there is a problem. Want to be a criminal? Fine, but either pay off the bounties or deal with people like Araviel coming after you.