PVP is not Griefing

[CloneWarrior85]

Sell the cobra, buy eagle, buy dumbfires, go killing spree.

Right, so everyone has that cobra package huh?

Only less than a handful have the cobra package, and even less are into PvP.

And weren't the starting ships prices negated long ago to prevent this? Pretty sure I saw somewhere that it was.

We did had a bit talk about the cobra explorer giving out giant sums of cash, and if I remember well, it got fixed.

 

[Whiterose]

Being really old I am going to start calling myself a Greyfer.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Right, so everyone has that cobra package huh?

Only less than a handful have the cobra package, and even less are into PvP.

And weren't the starting ships prices negated long ago to prevent this? Pretty sure I saw somewhere that it was.

From the Kickstarter, there were 5,376 backers with access to that package. In total 6,798 have the possibility to start at Lave with a basic Cobra and 1,000 Cr (and the Eagle, of course).

The Backers' App which ran from the end of the Kickstarter to just before Alpha release probably added another 80% to these numbers - all players who became Alpha Backers in this period (or Premium Beta Backers for that matter) have access both of these packages too.

So, probably around 12,000 players have access to the Lave start with Cobra, 1,000 Cr. and Eagle.

 

[Skip Intro]

Being really old I am going to start calling myself a Greyfer.

I might need to make a new .sig for that!

 

[CMDR Bansidhe]

Even destroying an enemy vessel without a word spoken is not griefing in this game.

Consider this....

A pilot is going for the £10,000 cash prize to be Elite in all categories.

As far as I understand it Combat pilots rank up by killing ships - so this works for the prize.
Traders rank up by making profit, so a pilot can jump in a combat capable ship to reduce your profits in order to give himself a greater chance of getting Elite first here too. Fair strategy.
Same story for Explorers. If a rival explorer can pop your ship before you can get all that lovely exploration data home won't that set you back a bit and consequently improve his chances of getting the cash prize?

In this race it would seem there are two ways to get ahead. Overtake your rival or pull your rival behind you.

Sorry but this is attrition, it is a valid strategy.

 

[Skip Intro]

So, probably around 12,000 players have access to the Lave start with Cobra, 1,000 Cr. and Eagle.

Reports today say that the playerbase is >250,000, so about 5%?

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Even destroying an enemy vessel without a word spoken is not griefing in this game.

Consider this....

A pilot is going for the £10,000 cash prize to be Elite in all categories.

As far as I understand it Combat pilots rank up by killing ships - so this works for the prize.
Traders rank up by making profit, so a pilot can jump in a combat capable ship to reduce your profits in order to give himself a greater chance of getting Elite first here too.
Same story for Explorers.

In this race it would seem there are two ways to get ahead. Overtake you or pull you behind me.

Sorry but this is attrition, it is a valid strategy.

Murdering clean players do not add to elite rating......

 

[Unpleasant]

The amount of threads calling players who attack and or try to kill them "Griefers" is getting crazy. Players killing players is not griefing. Blocking a dock so that players can't enter or leave is. It's funny how its the players crying about one thing or another are always the ones who use terms like "kiddies" or "babies". A player killing you in a open world/universe pvp game is not griefing it's a game mechanic.

This game was literally designed for the player interaction some players are complaining about. Yes this is a pvp game. Yet it is the people who dont like it that are calling for design changes. While people playing in open to encounter other players for pvp are playing the open mode as it was intended to be. There are 2 modes one is more Elite and Dangerous. If you don't like it they made a Solo mode for you.

What do you feel is griefing?

 

[Jonny Quest]

From the Kickstarter, there were 5,376 backers with access to that package. In total 6,798 have the possibility to start at Lave with a basic Cobra and 1,000 Cr (and the Eagle, of course).

The Backers' App which ran from the end of the Kickstarter to just before Alpha release probably added another 80% to these numbers - all players who became Alpha Backers in this period (or Premium Beta Backers for that matter) have access both of these packages too.

So, probably around 12,000 players have access to the Lave start with Cobra, 1,000 Cr. and Eagle.

+ how many starting systems in area of 3-4 jumps in basic eagle/cobra from Lave? Genuinely curious.

 

[CMDR Bansidhe]

Killing clueless clean players do not add to elite rating......

Fair enough, the rest still stands.

 

[CMDRKNac]

How is that an exploit?

Where is the word exploit in my post!? Is bad design, and FD is at fault. Didn't say anything about exploits.

If you don't see how this is bad design I can't help you... Actions must have consequences and not cheap ways to avoid them. This has nothing to do with the counterpart being involved.

You assume too much with your post. Also incorrect information about starter packs.

Reports today say that the playerbase is >250,000, so about 5%?

Right, even if it was 0,1% it would be bad. That's a fallacious argument.

 

[Whiterose]

Interesting definition of Griefing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griefer

According to that all of us probably fit into at least one definition of a griefer.

 

[Robert Maynard]

+ how many starting systems in area of 3-4 jumps in basic eagle/cobra from Lave? Genuinely curious.

Only the "Any KS reward ship with 40,000 Cr at Founder's World" and the "Cobra (Basic) with 1,000 Cr. at Lave" (both with the Mercenary Pack Eagle, of course) have defined starting points. The other 5 starting ships have random start points.

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Interesting definition of Griefing: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griefer

According to that all of us probably fit into at least one definition of a griefer.

Indeed: "Any method of reversing another player's progress, such as destroying or modifying other players' creations in sandbox games like Minecraft and Terraria" - if ships and credits are considered to be part of a player's progress.

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Reports today say that the playerbase is >250,000, so about 5%?

Another report indicates 300,000 players - say between 4% and 5% then.

 

[Unpleasant]

Having 5+ people in a system, all using self destruct to get free sidewinders, sticking missiles on them and going out to suicide ram other player ships or spamming missiles if the situation allows it. Then using self destruct and doing it all over again might be allowed in the game mechanics, but I feel it's just a way to exploit the free ship feature in order to grief other players.

Thanks to the founders exploit and the billionsgate scandal, FD have been very vocal on their stance about exploiting any game mechanics in an unintended way. I'd say exploiting the free ships to grief other players is far worse than using an exploit for personal benefit, as you're using an exploit to ruin another players game.

I have no problem with legit pirates, rping to earn a crust. The situation above isn't pirating though.

 

[CMDR Bansidhe]

Having 5+ people in a system, all using self destruct to get free sidewinders, sticking missiles on them and going out to suicide ram other player ships or spamming missiles if the situation allows it. Then using self destruct and doing it all over again might be allowed in the game mechanics, but I feel it's just a way to exploit the free ship feature in order to grief other players.

Thanks to the founders exploit and the billionsgate scandal, FD have been very vocal on their stance about exploiting any game mechanics in an unintended way. I'd say exploiting the free ships to grief other players is far worse than using an exploit for personal benefit, as you're using an exploit to ruin another players game.

I have no problem with legit pirates, rping to earn a crust. The situation above isn't pirating though.

They are probably just trying to stop you getting to the £10K prize before them. It's fine.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Having 5+ people in a system, all using self destruct to get free sidewinders, sticking missiles on them and going out to suicide ram other player ships or spamming missiles if the situation allows it. Then using self destruct and doing it all over again might be allowed in the game mechanics, but I feel it's just a way to exploit the free ship feature in order to grief other players.

Wiping and re-starting the game with starting benefits would seem to fit into the "unexpected use of a game feature" category - Frontier should consider adding a minimum time between wipes and also a delay proportional to debt or bounty (as discussed in the DDF thread that predicted this exploit).

 

[CMDR Bansidhe]

Wiping and re-starting the game with starting benefits would seem to fit into the "unexpected use of a game feature" category - Frontier should consider adding a minimum time between wipes and also a delay proportional to debt or bounty (as discussed in the DDF thread that predicted this exploit).

Oh, "the devs should change the game to suit my playstyle argument". That's not really a new idea. It happens in every game I play. Doesn't stop it being any less sickening when it happens though.

Adapt or die.

 

[Skip Intro]

I have no problem with legit pirates, rping to earn a crust. The situation above isn't pirating though.

I don't think they're RP'ing as Pirates, to be honest. The only way to fix this is to restrict the number of free ships you get, perhaps so many per month per account?

 

[Robert Maynard]

Oh, "the devs should change the game to suit my playstyle argument". That's not really a new idea. It happens in every game I play. Doesn't stop it being any less sickening when it happens though.

Adapt or die.

Continually wiping a save is not a play-style - it's playing the system.

.... or simply play my game and let them play theirs. If there are players abusing the commander-wipe feature then I would expect that Frontier are already aware of it - who knows what they might do....

 

[Unpleasant]

I don't think they're RP'ing as Pirates, to be honest. The only way to fix this is to restrict the number of free ships you get, perhaps so many per month per account?

Or the free ship is only available if your credit level is below X amount.