I did not see a problem here. It encourages people to play together! What i mean is, no one would travel dangerous places alone anymore. You may have to ask some people where they travel and tag along or something. No lone trader anymore, they would have guards, share trading profits for the escort. I for one welcomes this interaction. If i don't want to be bothered i go Mobius or Solo. As for Open, i expect more interaction than just seeing other commanders on screen doing their thing.
The Wings discussion thread
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I play with a friend quite often, and only once had an issue being in the same instance.
I went back into supercruise and dropped back out again and I was with him.
I understand that it's not everyone's experience, but personally, I've not really had an issue.
The concept of Open Play is to create an element of player and player interaction, whether that is Player vs. Player or Player with Player. While we don't have all the information about Wings yet there are a couple of things that have already been said during newsletters. One of the things they have said is that they do not favor fleet based super cruise or player turn over controlling (aka like Eve where one player warps the whole group). Hence it won't be any easier/harder to fly as a group in super cruise than it is now. Its also been stated that there won't be any form of "follow" mechanic, the devs seemed to agree that this would be bad for the game.
What hopefully will be the case is that we will have better indicators and feedback in terms of where members of your groups are and ways to find them in space and fly to them through the interface.
The most important thing that Wings needs to bring are team driven cooperation. Shared bounties, shared missions/mission rewards, shared consequences and responsibilities, share faction increased, shared scans/maps hopefully, better instance grouping, better communication between players, information about each others status (perhaps a group panel that shows fellow group members shields/hull for example).
Now as far as the whole 4 on 1 (group advantage), these are things that belong in the game. They may not be fair, but you can't have your cake and eat it to. Either your playing an online game (open play) and you live with the benefits and drawbacks of it, or you play solo or group instance and avoid it. I think what a lot of players want to do is force some form of morality onto online play which I think is wrong. What we need are reasonable and logical mechanics in response. Players should have the means to be pirates and outlaws if they like. There are consequences for their actions already and they are good ones.
If there is one thing I would suggest is that we make it possible to send out distress calls that appear in super cruise drawing your attention to them. This way both victims have a way to call for help, bounty hunters can respond to help while pirates can use the mechanic to set traps (fake distress call). Most importantly though Distress Calls draw your attention to where players are, which I think is key as this allows as to find places of activity.
What hopefully will be the case is that we will have better indicators and feedback in terms of where members of your groups are and ways to find them in space and fly to them through the interface.
The most important thing that Wings needs to bring are team driven cooperation. Shared bounties, shared missions/mission rewards, shared consequences and responsibilities, share faction increased, shared scans/maps hopefully, better instance grouping, better communication between players, information about each others status (perhaps a group panel that shows fellow group members shields/hull for example).
Now as far as the whole 4 on 1 (group advantage), these are things that belong in the game. They may not be fair, but you can't have your cake and eat it to. Either your playing an online game (open play) and you live with the benefits and drawbacks of it, or you play solo or group instance and avoid it. I think what a lot of players want to do is force some form of morality onto online play which I think is wrong. What we need are reasonable and logical mechanics in response. Players should have the means to be pirates and outlaws if they like. There are consequences for their actions already and they are good ones.
If there is one thing I would suggest is that we make it possible to send out distress calls that appear in super cruise drawing your attention to them. This way both victims have a way to call for help, bounty hunters can respond to help while pirates can use the mechanic to set traps (fake distress call). Most importantly though Distress Calls draw your attention to where players are, which I think is key as this allows as to find places of activity.
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You shouldn't make assumptions. It makes for a closed mind.
The bounty system is there, I agree. However it isn't enforced if your ship is more capable than the responding security vessels. Watch the you tube of Lave and see how much effort it took to take down 1 player who had a massive bounty. He only died because he refused to leave and went down swinging. If he had moved systems when the heat from multiple CMDR's got too much he would never have been taken down as things stand. The AI ships never gave him any trouble at all.
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What should have happened is SecServ should have thrown everything at him. It was a high security system and they sent a few weak fighters. Where was the pair of Elite Anaconda to "escort him" to his doom?
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When wings are in place and a group of players decide to blockade a station in a High Security system I would want it to escalate until a Cap Ship dropped in and sent them packing. Now that is high security.
Coming from a tight sim group we cannot wait for this. As it is a mechanic open to all once implemented it is up to each one of the players to "rethink" the way they play to accommodate with the new mechanics.
And yes, nothing like doing all kinds of activities in a proper group and I am all up for the vicious unbalance that it will create. We don't worry. We embrace this. Elite was awesome back in the day. Now we have Elite with multiplayer, in a bit we will have Elite with proper "flying" squads. Can only smile.
Regarding Interdiction cooldown, the mechanics are not really that good given submitting is often the better choice ( and shouldn't be ) so I expect the devs to rework it. As we don't know the exact mechanics of the Wings we can only speculate but my guess is that each Wing will have a Leader that coordinates actions passively and the other 3 are chained into the Leader instances.
Er, yes we do, unless it's your first online game with PvP.
wings update mp/co op features??
im still waiting for the wings stuff the game is atm unless boring
we need some squad/team options, group bounties,group warp, co op missions, higher bounties
and mabe change the bad kill/bountie sys. where the last person/ai who hit the target became only the full bountie
this is totally crap...
the gameplay is more like a singel player game...
my friends and me are all in the same systems but there is no need to play toghter
because not there are not enough targets and no shared bounties
and this in a mmo?^^
u dont like teamplay dvs?
im still waiting for the wings stuff the game is atm unless boring
we need some squad/team options, group bounties,group warp, co op missions, higher bounties
and mabe change the bad kill/bountie sys. where the last person/ai who hit the target became only the full bountie
this is totally crap...
the gameplay is more like a singel player game...
my friends and me are all in the same systems but there is no need to play toghter
because not there are not enough targets and no shared bounties
and this in a mmo?^^
u dont like teamplay dvs?
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When its done.
k thx for the spam
A thought on wings
So, wings are about to be implemented in one of the next updates...
Im looking forward to it, but I guess this will have a very strong impact on PvP, too. If players are able to properly work together in wings, it will be easy for a couple of Vipers or the like to interdict players in large, expensive ships like Pythons or Anacondas and swiftly destroy them with little trouble.
Will there be any kind of mechanism to counter this, besides playing solo, or will the larger ships be doomed to rot in the hangar, because it's no longer safe to fly them? Currently players can cruise around in their pretty Pythons and Anacondas without having much to fear. Wings might, ans probably will change this entirely. Not sure, if I like the idea, of having to resort to solo or group mode, when I want to take an expensive ship out for a ride.
So, wings are about to be implemented in one of the next updates...
Im looking forward to it, but I guess this will have a very strong impact on PvP, too. If players are able to properly work together in wings, it will be easy for a couple of Vipers or the like to interdict players in large, expensive ships like Pythons or Anacondas and swiftly destroy them with little trouble.
Will there be any kind of mechanism to counter this, besides playing solo, or will the larger ships be doomed to rot in the hangar, because it's no longer safe to fly them? Currently players can cruise around in their pretty Pythons and Anacondas without having much to fear. Wings might, ans probably will change this entirely. Not sure, if I like the idea, of having to resort to solo or group mode, when I want to take an expensive ship out for a ride.
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Like it or not that is the whole point of it. My HOPE is that in hisec systems police will be given much bigger teeth, and punishments will be ramped up for pointless murder, and so this kind of thing will be pushed to anarchy systems where it (surely??)belongs......... and really if you think about it, anarchy systems are MEANT to be scary places that you probably would not want to go on your own, so the answer there is to go enmasse yourself.
It has the potential to be a gankers paradise, and a lone wolf players nightmare, but equally, imo it has the potential to be great!.
I must admit I am looking forward to being interdicted by more than 1 (AI) enemy
As much as an anarchy system is a place a clean person would go In a group and be a scary place a hi sec system should be equally scary for someone with a bounty and be a place they would try to sneak through most likely alone
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I'm not so sure that scenario will happen very often unless the vipers are AI.
I mean, I'm not likely to fly my viper as wing to a trade ship for 5 hours back and forth, that's even more tedious than trading itself and you'd get less profit than actually doing the trading yourself.
I would like to think that you may be able to pass on the big lumbering spacewhale to a different Wing once you have escorted it a certain distance.
I'd be ok with that, if there were such things, as secure systems. Let's face it... currently all systems are virtually anarchies in that respect. The police will likely not even arrive, before the battle is over and the offender jumped away. Although this is pretty realistic, since they have to supercruise to your location first, it makes the police forces useless, no matter how strong they are made. In order to be of any use, they would have to arrive at your location in a matter of seconds.
This. Nobody is able to permanently fly in a wing with other players. Most players will probably fly in wings with others only occasionaly, if at all.
Maybe one could hire a bunch of AI wingmen, but they would have to be really strong to be useful against players, otherwise they would just ignore them while destroying the other player's ship.
Yeah, that's a fair point. The original post didn't mention trading, but hiring player wings for a trade run sounds unlikely.
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