Scrap or redesign shield cell modules, they are too overpowered and trivialize PvP.

[StargazerJ]

They used to be much more dangerous.

The same logic that gave us shield cells turned the rather dangerous NPCs from the earlier Beta into the farmable cannon fodder we have now. I was really nervous going up against _sidewinders_ with twin railguns at one point. Those NPCs were killers. Likwise I was outflown by an NPC Cobra using FA-off and translational thrust masterfully when I was in my pimped out sidey. I was cheering all the while. Those are the sort of NPCs we need, not the farmable idiots flying around with no ahields we have now

+1
I was wondering if it was just me or if I had suddenly got brilliant at the game. Flying around in my Eagle now there is no challenge from any of the NPC Vipers, Cobras, Asps etc. I don't even need to use the shield cells as they rarely get a bead on me now. So NPCs have been nerfed dramatically? Shame. I hope they make Elite Dangerous again.

 

[tagos]

The "exploit" is having multiple units without incurring multiple sets of power draw by only having one unit enabled at a time - not switching on and off one unit (which would be very difficult in practice).

If I equip 2 SCB's they each draw power seperately. One bank draws 2% power, the lower one draws 1%. Together they draw 3%.

 

[bassman]

It should to me like people want to be able to burst anyone down in 20 seconds... tough. I like the drawn out fights, because thats a lot more like how it should be. These arent toy planes shooting at each other, they are futuristic space ships.

I've not seen any indication that this is what anyone wants. I think ships probably need to be a bit tougher relative to weapons generally and/or have some better last ditch defensive capability, I dont think cells are good way to do this as they distort so many other tactical tradeoffs (which I've already gone into in detail).

 

[tagos]

And SCB's are probably one of the worst possible ways to stop just that from happening, since they are irrelevant in the cases where burst damage actually will cause shield failure before the SCB's can kick in.
In the cases where we get long drawn-out fights, well... you know, long drawn-out fights happened before we had SCB's too, so I don't agree with any claims that SCB's have a use as a way to induce long, drawn-out fights, although that often is the result... if both sides have SCB's. If only one does, not so much.

And if you don't balance modules around PvP, what do you balance it around then?
Player vs NPC combat?

It's balanced fine. SCB's give traders a chance to survive. They give people attacked a chance to survive. They give players who play casually a chance to survive. All the tools are in the game for a skilled and clever pilot to laugh at any number of shield cells if they make the effort.

 

[StargazerJ]

Absolutely. Give me dangerous npc's stuffed with rail guns and shield cells any day.

+1
If we are going to keep shield cells (I really hope not) then we really need NPCs to display AI again with the emphasis on the 'I'. The immersion is broken with the cannon fodder that we seem to get getting now.

 

[Defacto]

It's balanced fine. SCB's give traders a chance to survive. They give people attacked a chance to survive. They give players who play casually a chance to survive. All the tools are in the game for a skilled and clever pilot to laugh at any number of shield cells if they make the effort.

Wait
Are you seriously saying, that without SCB's any trader, anyone attacked, or anyone who does not play ''proffessionally'' have no chance of surviving?

Before I continue to reply I would like you to make this clear so that we can avoid any confusion

 

[GeneralIdea1964]

Generally I say leave the weapons alone!
I've seen weapon systems changed by the constant moaning on bulletin boards like this in another game (Battlefield 3) and it basically destroyed the feel of the game.
The solution is always to use the best weapon for you.
If you are new to the game, Elite Dangerous at least gives you time to learn the game and to play. If you stay out of trouble for a bit with just legal trading and such and only get into a fight with smaller ships then you have a goods chance. Only time I get destroyed is when I overstretch the abilities of my ship and myself.
Cell banks are a cheap fix until you can afford better shields ... leave them be!

 

[bassman]

If I equip 2 SCB's they each draw power seperately. One bank draws 2% power, the lower one draws 1%. Together they draw 3%.

You can disable the one of them in the power management tab in which case you can use one bank while the other draws zero power, once one bank becomes spent you can swap. Admittedly to make it viable in combat you would have to use some macro command thing like voice attack.

 

[Defacto]

Generally I say leave the weapons alone!
I've seen weapon systems changed by the constant moaning on bulletin boards like this in another game (Battlefield 3) and it basically destroyed the feel of the game.
The solution is always to use the best weapon for you.
If you are new to the game, Elite Dangerous at least gives you time to learn the game and to play. If you stay out of trouble for a bit with just legal trading and such and only get into a fight with smaller ships then you have a goods chance. Only time I get destroyed is when I overstretch the abilities of my ship and myself.
Cell banks are a cheap fix until you can afford better shields ... leave them be!

I remember back when practically the only possible way to have any kind of competitiveness with the ''pros'' was fitting exactly the same ship as them (Viper with Quad cannons) and then engage sky-god mode and travel around in 500 m/s lines.
Ah, all this moaning, it ruined everything, didn't it?!

Cell banks are not a cheap fix until you can afford better shields, and I don't see how you could possibly even call them that.

 

[Perseus]

If we are going to keep shield cells (I really hope not) then we really need NPCs to display AI again with the emphasis on the 'I'. The immersion is broken with the cannon fodder that we seem to get getting now.

I've had two encounters today where the NPC used a shield cell. Saying that, you're absolutely right about the current difficulty factor.

 

[Commander Silex]

Let me add my voice to those saying one shield cell bank per ship ought to be enough of a balancing option at this point. There's no need to completely rework the entire system when a fine tune could do the job just as well.

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

I feel like people don't understand what the python actually costs. Please fit one out on this site http://www.edshipyard.com/ and take a look at the price tag at the bottom right and tell me why it shouldn't be able to handle a few fighters that cost a very small fraction of what it does.

Quite.

Python

• 5 Type 3 Class C Beam Lasers
• Utilities (Chaff / ECM / HSink / Pdefence)
• Mliitary grade armour
• 7A power plant
• 6A thrusters
• 5A FSD
• 4A life support
• 7A Power dist
• 6A Sensors
• 6A Shield Generator
• 2 * 6A Shield cells
• 5A fuel scoop

Probably don't need everything listed, nor if you could power that lot up simultaneously, however a price tag of 260m with a 12m insurance tag (95%)

 

[GeneralIdea1964]

It's balanced fine. SCB's give traders a chance to survive. They give people attacked a chance to survive. They give players who play casually a chance to survive. All the tools are in the game for a skilled and clever pilot to laugh at any number of shield cells if they make the effort.

Wait
Are you seriously saying, that without SCB's any trader, anyone attacked, or anyone who does not play ''proffessionally'' have no chance of surviving?

Before I continue to reply I would like you to make this clear so that we can avoid any confusion

The main advantage of an SCB is that if you get jumped, you have the chance to get back on level pegging before either running or returning fire.
BUT there is no need to change SCB's as they are, they work and are already neutered by having limited 'shots'
.
You don't want to be dying all the time, ED is not really that type of game.
If you go looking for trouble you'll find it, but go prepared, expect to have to take out SCB equipped ships. If you want to avoid trouble, fit SCB's so you get chance to run away.
Sounds simple enough to me

 

[Defacto]

The Python isn't even double the hull mass of the Cobra. Why is it so expensive? The Cobra is an assembly-line ship, the Python is Naval Patrol Cruiser!
If people don't think the Python is worth it, don't get one. Get a Cobra or Viper for your friends instead.

Credits aren't the only resource.

The main advantage of an SCB is that if you get jumped, you have the chance to get back on level pegging before either running or returning fire.
BUT there is no need to change SCB's as they are, they work and are already neutered by having limited 'shots'
.
You don't want to be dying all the time, ED is not really that type of game.
If you go looking for trouble you'll find it, but go prepared, expect to have to take out SCB equipped ships. If you want to avoid trouble, fit SCB's so you get chance to run away.
Sounds simple enough to me

Are you saying that SCB's nullify the advantage of ambushing an enemy, and that this is a good thing?

If I want to avoid trouble, I should avoid searching for trouble, not fitting SCB's. On the contrary, fitting SCB's is exactly what I want to do when seeking trouble.
Are you saying that you don't have a chance to run away without SCB's? That's not true.

 

[MaD^Mak]

I think people are underestimating the effect the higher power requirement tweak will have. It could well turn out to be impractical to carry more than 1 or 2 SCBs in most ships. I say let's just wait and see how things work out.

 

[GeneralIdea1964]

Quite.

Python

• 5 Type 3 Class C Beam Lasers
• Utilities (Chaff / ECM / HSink / Pdefence)
• Mliitary grade armour
• 7A power plant
• 6A thrusters
• 5A FSD
• 4A life support
• 7A Power dist
• 6A Sensors
• 6A Shield Generator
• 2 * 6A Shield cells
• 5A fuel scoop

Probably don't need everything listed, nor if you could power that lot up simultaneously, however a price tag of 260m with a 12m insurance tag (95%)

Just Curious, but has anyone got anything like this spec yet?

I need to remember to avoid you

 

[StargazerJ]

I like them how they are and most of us do no PVP so @ all PVP Players if you dont like it go away!

Thanks to some Player who realize they cant win and start to ram you i almost play solo now anyway

No Changes please!

If you play on Open then you PVP, or at least you have the potential to. That for me is what adds a great deal to the game, that extra danger of a human encounter. I don't think telling the human player attacking me to go away will work but I'll try next time Seriously though to avoid ramming I recommend using the thrusters as they have saved me from this a few times (easy on an X52 so sorry if your using K+mouse)

 

[Defacto]

I think people are underestimating the effect the higher power requirement tweak will have. It could well turn out to be impractical to carry more than 1 or 2 SCBs in most ships. I say let's just wait and see how things work out.

Especially if you want to carry Thermal weapons to strip shields, since these draw more power than kinetics.
This tweak could, as you say, have quite a large effect.

I hope that we will be able to test these changes before it being released.

 

[GeneralIdea1964]

Let me add my voice to those saying one shield cell bank per ship ought to be enough of a balancing option at this point. There's no need to completely rework the entire system when a fine tune could do the job just as well.

I think the balance works well, if you have lots of cell banks, you forego other functionality. Ships only have a limited number of slots.
How you use them is up to you.

 

[StargazerJ]

I am not for the removal

i am for leaving the situation as is, it is perfectly fine.

dont fix if aint broken

I think this is what many of us feel about the situation PRIOR to the introduction of cells.