Rebalance dumbfire missiles please
- Thread starter Bortas
- Start date
The only problem with dumfires is the rate of fire, it seems to be uncapped i.e. as fast as you can pull the trigger. If the fire rate was capped to say 2 per second then it would stop the lame instakill spamming but still make it a valuable tactical weapon. I say this as someone who routinely equips them myself.
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Dont forget there is huge player's base who play solo/time to time in open, so all your "nerf" things/ships because it is OP in PvP it make impact on Solo players, BTW all of you was force Dev to make wings, now all of you want nerf more, more till we have same situation what was have in past 15 years with other game's, in dark age of PC gaming ....
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So in many cases you simply use them as fixed guns, but without the damage bonus and without targeting your target. Yeah, sounds like an absolute dream fitting. And the best part, I need to untarget my target naturally always than when I am in a good firing position.
But ok, let say the biggest mistake was not to do so when the python had the viper directly in front and instead played disco globe and missed the viper with all his lasers which than used the last missiles to finish the python off.
1v1, a sufficiently skilled small ship pilot should be able to take a large ship that is poorly flown (e.g. holding position in an Anaconda's blind spot), but it should be a tough ask and an achievement worthy of note, otherwise it makes larger ships completely redundant. As it stands they have an i-win button, provided they are prepared to potentially sacrifice their ship, and given the cost of death is so trivial in a disposable ship like the Eagle, it is pretty much standard MO.
Seems to me that the biggest issue is dumbfire effectiveness against shields. If they became effectively useless against shields it would alter the balance significantly and make things far more interesting, especially when wings come in.
Although, as has been mentioned, a lot of this depends on the effectiveness of point defense against dumbfires once it's up and running.
Although, as has been mentioned, a lot of this depends on the effectiveness of point defense against dumbfires once it's up and running.
Agreed, its the high short term DPS thats the problem, that can be fixed without reducing the "fun factor" of the weapon by capping the fire rate to something sensible e.g. 2/sec.
Just one question .... do they still fire backwards ?? 
You mean as per the second paragraph of my post?
LOL another post by someone completely ignorant of the way mechanics and stats of weapons and ships have been continually altered for the year that ED has been available to play by us backers.
If were not for some the previous nerfs we would have (for example) vipers with a 400 top speed, the maneuverability of a sidewinder toting 4 cannons that could take down an anaconda in 5 shots. We would have gimbals with perfect aim at any rage, rails where a 2x setup can one shot eagles and sidewinders and 2-shot vipers and cobras.
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Unfortunately a lot of people can't see the bigger picture. Balancing a weapon doesn't just mean power v shields or whatever. Take into accound the cost of the weapon, the low ammo count and the lack of guidance and it's no longer an issue. Yes small ships can take out large ships if they gang up and use expensive one-shot weapons and get close enough. That's how it works.
You act like those credits are insignificant. Most PvPers are not trader, we don't trade and we certainly don't spend much time on PvE stuff. We earn credits the slow way, so 40k credits is a huge boon for most of us since we make virtually nothing in PvP because PvP doesn't pay.
Secondly, we are PvPers. We have a lot of experience flying our ships, some of us have been flying the same ship ever since we started the game be it a Eagle, Viper or Cobra. We have logged an insane amount of trigger time in these ships and know how to fly them as well as outfit them to our advantage. It is absolutely not absurd for us to take advantage of stupid traders who made most of their money playing solo mode and then decided to buy a Python and try PvP in open. Those pilots have NO trigger time in their ships and if they had even a slight clue they would outfit them with point defence or turrets to nullify the effects of missiles. Not to mention, if Python CMDR's would pay attention to heat signature they could equip a formidable ship while being able to run silent and also put 4 pips to shields when in combat which combined with shield cell reboost would make them invincible to DF missles. But, most Python owners (aside from myself) are extremely dumb and have very little experience in PvP. So, you should expect to be blown up by smaller ships.
So, dear PvP-god... with all your experience and skill in the game, please tell us dumb traders, how come, you don't know that point defence or turrets are completely useless against df-missiles?
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Pro Tip: They're only useless if the pilot using them is flying right at your rear within 2km. If you were interdicted then they are likely to be less useful, if you were the interdicting party then they are more than useful. So, were you trading or were you PvPing?
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Pro Tip: They're only useless if the pilot using them is flying right at your rear within 2km. If you were interdicted then they are likely to be less useful, if you were the interdicting party then they are more than useful. So, were you trading or were you PvPing?
Did you miss the memo that point defense can not hit df missiles because their hitbox is zero size? Bugs, bugs, bugs.
Point defence does not work against dumbfire
Dumbfires only really seem to work as ambush tactics. In the video the Python goes up and rubs noses with a Viper that has its hardpoints out, that's either inexperience or hubris. If someone comes up to you without opening comms with their hardpoints out it's an extremely aggressive stance. All you need to do is check their components to see what weapons they are carrying, if you see dumbfires you can safely guess their intention. The Python has a small enough hit profile when facing another ship to make it a smaller target to hit at any range, so the Viper would need to get lucky if he didn't get the ambush (I wonder how many times he had to fail at this tactic to get the video.)
If you equip DF missiles you are vulnerable to anyone who is aware of your prescence and a smaller target will be a nightmare to hit. I fought the missile Eagles in Lave, died the first time in my Viper as I'd never encountered DFs before and stayed at close range but each time after that they lost. The tactic is simple, boost, FA off, flip around, FA off (I'm using K&M, hard to actually aim with FA off) hit reverse thrust, fire at will whilst using some lateral thrust. They'll rely on luck to hit you as the range will make it hard to predict where you'll be when they fire the shot.
I agree with the other comments about giving the DFs a hitbox, I think that's fair. The sacrifices a pilot has to make to use missiles are enough to balance them as far as I'm concerned. You have limited durability, depend on ambush tactics, are completely vulnerable to smaller ships and limit your combat role to only one trick.
If you know you're fighting a Python in a Viper then DFs are a way to give you a decent fighting chance but if the Python is ready for you and competent then you're going to be in for a very tough battle and you'll probably run out of missiles before the shields go down.
If you equip DF missiles you are vulnerable to anyone who is aware of your prescence and a smaller target will be a nightmare to hit. I fought the missile Eagles in Lave, died the first time in my Viper as I'd never encountered DFs before and stayed at close range but each time after that they lost. The tactic is simple, boost, FA off, flip around, FA off (I'm using K&M, hard to actually aim with FA off) hit reverse thrust, fire at will whilst using some lateral thrust. They'll rely on luck to hit you as the range will make it hard to predict where you'll be when they fire the shot.
I agree with the other comments about giving the DFs a hitbox, I think that's fair. The sacrifices a pilot has to make to use missiles are enough to balance them as far as I'm concerned. You have limited durability, depend on ambush tactics, are completely vulnerable to smaller ships and limit your combat role to only one trick.
If you know you're fighting a Python in a Viper then DFs are a way to give you a decent fighting chance but if the Python is ready for you and competent then you're going to be in for a very tough battle and you'll probably run out of missiles before the shields go down.