Community Event / Creation Buckyball Run A*: What do you do when a mountain is there? Move it.

[TunaMage]

From the Dev Update today

Hi everyone,
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During the Powerplay beta we’ll also trial a new crime of ramming at speed within no fire zones. If travelling at over 100 m/s and you collide with another ship within the no fire zone then it will be considered a crime. There has been some vigorous debate on this so it will be interesting to hear peoples’ thoughts on this once it’s in place.
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This doesn't impact the Sag A* Race really, but for other Buckyball races, this could potentially add a massive edge to docking and taking off, sending Buckyball runs truly underground (where they belong )

 

[FoxTwo]

From the Dev Update today



This doesn't impact the Sag A* Race really, but for other Buckyball races, this could potentially add a massive edge to docking and taking off, sending Buckyball runs truly underground (where they belong )

The trouble is, how do you determine who is the "victim" and who is the "culprit"?

Let's say you're on a BBR run and you're just taking off. As per your usual routine, you hit boost the moment your landing gear retracts. You head towards the slot... and WHAM! You smashed into a sidewinder that popped up out of nowhere.

So who's the Rammer and who's the Rammee?

Another scenario - you're coming in hot... 300m/s entering the slot. Docking permission given, you have a pad number... as you're coming in, a T9 is lumbering out and takes up the whole slot.

Again, who's the victim and who's the culprit?

 

[Alec Turner]

The trouble is, how do you determine who is the "victim" and who is the "culprit"?

Let's say you're on a BBR run and you're just taking off. As per your usual routine, you hit boost the moment your landing gear retracts. You head towards the slot... and WHAM! You smashed into a sidewinder that popped up out of nowhere.

So who's the Rammer and who's the Rammee?

Another scenario - you're coming in hot... 300m/s entering the slot. Docking permission given, you have a pad number... as you're coming in, a T9 is lumbering out and takes up the whole slot.

Again, who's the victim and who's the culprit?

It's not clear from the original dev update post (haven't had time to read the comments yet) but one obvious way would be to call the faster of the two pilots the culprit.

 

[FoxTwo]

It's not clear from the original dev update post (haven't had time to read the comments yet) but one obvious way would be to call the faster of the two pilots the culprit.

Therein lies an inherent flaw.

The viper will ALWAYS be the culprit. It has the highest boost speed among all ships. Suppose me, in my Cobra, is boosting towards the entrance. Another commander, just taking off, is in a Viper. We both boost, and we smash into each other.

Viper's boosted speed is 450-480m/s. Cobra's around 430m/s.

So Viper jocks automatically get blamed for everything! (Although personally I find that amusingly funny)

 

[TunaMage]

I would guess short answer is you're both the culprit. Neither should be going over 100m/s

 

[Esvandiary]

Viper's boosted speed is 450-480m/s. Cobra's around 430m/s.

So Viper jocks automatically get blamed for everything! (Although personally I find that amusingly funny)

Interesting... When I hurriedly tried both at the end of BBR7 I found the Cobra's max boost to be much faster (although you couldn't actually maneuver worth a damn at anything like those speeds, so the Viper still ended up being the better choice).
My Cobra ended up boosting at about 465 I think, and my Viper only got to about 430. I think I might have left the shields on the Viper though since you could fit a very small class of them without much other penalty, so that might have affected my speed a little.

 

[ElectricZ]

This doesn't impact the Sag A* Race really, but for other Buckyball races, this could potentially add a massive edge to docking and taking off, sending Buckyball runs truly underground (where they belong )

Haha I was actually going to go into that thread and protest loudly that THIS IS IMPACTING MY ABILITY TO PLAY THE GAME HOW I WANT TO PLAY IT! NERF! NERRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRFFFFFF!!!! But personally, I'm glad to see this implemented. Starports should have some sort of speed limit, and there should be a penalty for causing destruction, be it intentional or not. Anybody who's ever been on a boat pulling into a harbor knows you can go full tilt until you reach the markers, then you have to slow down to keep wakes from forming and to watch for traffic. Anybody who hot dogs it through gets in big trouble.

FoxTwo's point about the flaw of blaming the faster of the two could be solved by blaming anybody going over 100/150. If both people are boosting, both people are to blame. Otherwise, it's just the pilot bombing through the slot who should take the legal hit.

The solution of course is not to hit anybody. It just slows you down.

 

[FoxTwo]

First, let me just say I do AGREE that a speed limit should be imposed. Just like IRL, in a parking lot, even without speed limit signs, people automatically know to go slow, around 10 to 20km/h (sorry, we're all metric here... Yanks will have to convert to miles )

Having said that, I predict during the initial days there will be cries of disgust from players about how they got fined for "no reason at all" just landing or taking off

 

[Ceska_Zbrojovka]

I predict during the initial days there will be cries of disgust from players about how they got fined for "no reason at all" just landing or taking off

Their tears will make for good Canopy Cleaning Fluid to get the Space Dust off.. and leave a Streak Free, Fog Resistant finish that last and lasts.

On another note..
Anyone know a good Painter?
I scooped a little too close to an 'A Class' star and scorched the Duco on the 'Hakudo Maru'
No rush, I'm still some 23500ly away meandering around the black like some cork bobbing on the ocean.

 

[drakhyr]

I would guess short answer is you're both the culprit. Neither should be going over 100m/s

The way I read it, that's exactly right - if you collide in a no-fire zone and are going over 100m/s, it's a crime. If both sides are travelling at over 100m/s, then both sides are committing a crime.

Like others, my immediate thought on reading that part of the dev update was "hmmm, could make Buckyball's a bit interesting...". Especially if you pick up a bounty on the first day of a race!

 

[Rankaze]

The way I read it, that's exactly right - if you collide in a no-fire zone and are going over 100m/s, it's a crime. If both sides are travelling at over 100m/s, then both sides are committing a crime.

Like others, my immediate thought on reading that part of the dev update was "hmmm, could make Buckyball's a bit interesting...". Especially if you pick up a bounty on the first day of a race!

Yeah, this change pretty much kills BBR for me. If it was a fine, I'd be OK with it. As a bounty? Nope.

Honestly, this change might kill this game for me. Having to fly 100m/s or slower to/from 5km out at every station? Most tedious thing ever.

 

[Alec Turner]

Yeah, this change pretty much kills BBR for me. If it was a fine, I'd be OK with it. As a bounty? Nope.

Honestly, this change might kill this game for me. Having to fly 100m/s or slower to/from 5km out at every station? Most tedious thing ever.

Note: you don't "have" to fly slow, you just have to not hit anyone while flying fast. Agreed, that might make the Buckyball problematic but it's not that difficult generally.

 

[FoxTwo]

This changes almost nothing for me actually. I usually don't hit anything on my way in or out of stations.

But assuming I do hit something and get a bounty.. what's to stop me going back into the station to pay it off? If the answer is "nothing" then there's practically no change in gameplay for me.

 

[Alec Turner]

This changes almost nothing for me actually. I usually don't hit anything on my way in or out of stations.

But assuming I do hit something and get a bounty.. what's to stop me going back into the station to pay it off? If the answer is "nothing" then there's practically no change in gameplay for me.

Alas the answer seems to be that you can't pay it off for seven days. If you're wanted in a system and try to dock does the station open fire on you? If so, one collision and that's the Buckyball over for you my friend!

 

[FoxTwo]

Man, BBR 8's gonna be interesting.... racers slamming on the brakes and going 100m/s docking and taking off

 

[ElectricZ]

Yeah, this change pretty much kills BBR for me. If it was a fine, I'd be OK with it. As a bounty? Nope.

Honestly, this change might kill this game for me. Having to fly 100m/s or slower to/from 5km out at every station? Most tedious thing ever.

Well I hope that's not the case, Rankaze, but the Buckyball shall go on. It is, after all, an illegal race. Anybody who has participated in 'em has already demonstrated a willingness to risk their ship in completely unnecessary fashion for absolutely zero reward. (Except a bumper sticker of course. Everybody loves bumper stickers.) Really, this should make no difference at all unless you make a habit of using other ships as speed brakes.

For me, it just ramps up the pucker factor that much more. But then no one ever accused me of being smart.

Game on!

 

[ElectricZ]

Alas the answer seems to be that you can't pay it off for seven days. If you're wanted in a system and try to dock does the station open fire on you? If so, one collision and that's the Buckyball over for you my friend!

Just saw this - yeah that could make it tough for repeat racers especially... But it doesn't necessary spell the end. What it means is that instead of pilots being free to repeatedly make a run over and over in a cheap hauler, say, until they clock that perfect time, there's a risk that they'll have to get it right the first time. It will be much more akin to an actual race where one mistake can knock you out of the competition.

Again, though, this only comes into play if you hit somebody. As long as there's no penalty for making dents in the station, I think most of us will be just fine.

I'd advise anybody who's really concerned about this to take a deep breath, relax, and keep the number of a good lawyer in your cockpit at all times.

 

[Azernak]

actually something i would like to point out, it depends on the type of crime they consider it. Like a docking infringement just gets you a fine you have 7 days to pay that BEFORE it becomes a bounty. So if this is more like a speeding ticket (fine) you have 7 days to pay it before becoming a bounty. But if it is an out right bounty then yes it will make racing harder, but again like Electricz said it is an illegal race, and some of us are willing to risk everything to make the run. Just as i have in my run to Sagittarius A.

I would also like to note that I haven't read all 30 pages of that thread, so if they said ramming is an automatic bounty I missed it. But according to the first few posts its only a crime which doesn't tell us much of anything.

 

[Raiko]

I love the change. If it's a fine then it's easy to just pay off - if it's a bounty then it just makes this more like the cannonball run, the cops should be after us!

At the speeds we dock, they'll never scan us anyway...

 

[Raiko]

Alas the answer seems to be that you can't pay it off for seven days. If you're wanted in a system and try to dock does the station open fire on you? If so, one collision and that's the Buckyball over for you my friend!

You can dock when you're wanted as long as they don't scan you successfully.

Scans stop working when you get through the slot. Also while bounty hunting I've found that my scans of NPC pirates are delayed (the scan timer stops moving) when they use chaff. This surprised me, because the devs had previously said that chaff doesn't affect scans.