Is piracy a viable option?

[Kawboy]

I've seen a number of posts inquiring about piracy. Generally they fall into the "If I"m a pirate can I...." or "What if I do <THIS> to another player" categories. This leads me to think that a significant number are planning to go this route and I'm curious as to the motivation there, and why so many think this is a viable solution. I've little doubt that we will all do it occasionally, but as a career I can't see it happening.

My opinion... Pirates attempting to prey on other players will carry a criminal rating, a bounty on their heads and can only enter 'civilized' systems with great difficulty. So, you're hunted by law enforcement.. some of the best players in the game will be head hunting for you and you'll be forced to remain in systems where technology and upgrades are difficult to find. Not to mention that the person you're attacking is quite likely to leave you stranded in a space station trying to borrow enough credits to replace that ship that's now a derelict floating in space.

If I understand the 'instances' correctly, there will only be ~19 other people you can interact with at any given time, which would make it very unlikely that you will even FIND someone to attack, making profit difficult at best.

Attacking NPC's would be an option, but I'm guessing that will get pretty boring fairly quickly, especially when you're limited to where you can cash in your loot and not have to spend most of it paying off fines.

Am I missing something here? I just don't see it as a good career move...

 

[Keeval]

You might want to have a read of this:

http://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=6343

This is the topic of Piracy in the design discussion archive, it should help explain how this should work.

Edit: As for how fulfilling or lucrative it will be, we will hopefully find out when the player to player combat testing starts and we can try some of this stuff out. But FD are hoping that this will be a viable career and I'm sure they will help remove any blocks to this, whilst keeping things balanced and fair for other players.

 

[JKF]

If I understand the 'instances' correctly, there will only be ~19 other people you can interact with at any given time, which would make it very unlikely that you will even FIND someone to attack, making profit difficult at best.

That is the clincher. There's going to need to be a hell of an incentive to get traders to join sessions where there be pirates.

Meet pirate, block pirate, pirate starves

 

[Cosmo Bozo]

That is the clincher. There's going to need to be a hell of an incentive to get traders to join sessions where there be pirates.

Meet pirate, block pirate, pirate starves

Making NPC pirates more dangerous than player pirates would do it

 

[Memnoch]

Or simply make the bounties on offender and fugitives heads big enough that they won't be left alone for 5 minutes.

 

[Kawboy]

You might want to have a read of this:

http://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?t=6343

This is the topic of Piracy in the design discussion archive, it should help explain how this should work.

Edit: As for how fulfilling or lucrative it will be, we will hopefully find out when the player to player combat testing starts and we can try some of this stuff out. But FD are hoping that this will be a viable career and I'm sure they will help remove any blocks to this, whilst keeping things balanced and fair for other players.

Interesting read... That's going to be tough to find a balance for the risk/reward.. I feel for the developers on that one. Still.. "No pirate's life for me"!

 

[Memnoch]

I wonder if some pirates will cotton on to the idea that they could simply "appear" to be conducting an assault but not actually fire a shot, leading the trader to perhaps open fire first, in effect making them the attacking party and the poor pirate the helpless victim...who can then proceed to attack with impunity from the law!

There would have to be some kind of minimum number of hits for this to take effect, not a single pot-shot.

 

[Captain N]

If you look at the original Kickstarter page, the very first thing it says is:

"Take a ship and 100 credits to make money legally or illegally - trade, bounty-hunt, pirate, assassinate your way across the galaxy."

It seems clear that piracy is meant to be a viable career option.

Of course, there are two things to say about this.

Firstly, being a pirate does not necessarily imply PVP piracy. There will be NPC traffic throughout colonised space a player could pirate to all their heart's content without having to ever engage in PVP.

Secondly, the ED universe may not be quite as "civilised" as you think. While there will undoubtedly be consequences to living a life of crime, a good portion of the galaxy is going to be quite lawless and it's not like the authorities will be some kind of a godlike punishing force that immediately strikes you down if you so much as think about doing something wrong.

 

[Kawboy]

I wonder if some pirates will cotton on to the idea that they could simply "appear" to be conducting an assault but not actually fire a shot, leading the trader to perhaps open fire first, in effect making them the attacking party and the poor pirate the helpless victim...who can then proceed to attack with impunity from the law!

There would have to be some kind of minimum number of hits for this to take effect, not a single pot-shot.

Couple of shots across the bow.. then wait for them to shoot back and hit you.. making THEM the "bad guy".. that's an interesting tactic, but wouldn't that be more effective as a bounty hunter? I don't know how quickly criminal ratings go into effect...

 

[Seonid]

I wonder if some pirates will cotton on to the idea that they could simply "appear" to be conducting an assault but not actually fire a shot, leading the trader to perhaps open fire first, in effect making them the attacking party and the poor pirate the helpless victim

Can't see that working, at least against a player trader.

 

[Memnoch]

Couple of shots across the bow.. then wait for them to shoot back and hit you.. making THEM the "bad guy".. that's an interesting tactic, but wouldn't that be more effective as a bounty hunter? I don't know how quickly criminal ratings go into effect...

If you were a bounty hunter, and your quarry already has a bounty on their heads from previous illegal activity then you should be free to shoot first as the law is on your side. If however you simply "suspected" that this player was a pirate as you remember their name, or the ships name, this could be a viable tactic into goading them into attacking you!

Can't see that working, at least against a player trader.

I would see it more likely for a player than an AI, unless FD have written some Artificial Gullibility(TM) routines into it.

 

[SlimExpert]

Witnesses

I thought I read that crime needed to be witnessed, therefore if you eliminate all witnesses, you are not a criminal? Did I misunderstand that?

Also, I guess if you only commit piracy in the Empire, you are only a criminal in those systems?

SlimExpert

 

[Memnoch]

I'm not sure that would work as you would be free to attack people with impunity in deep space as long as you killed everyone. It would be exploitable and make piracy a less hazardous existence. It would be realistic perhaps but not fun from a gameplay point of view. Gameplay wins in this case I think, or I hope at least.

 

[fireFly1000]

If I understand the 'instances' correctly, there will only be ~19 other people you can interact with at any given time, which would make it very unlikely that you will even FIND someone to attack, making profit difficult at best.

As I understood you will join a session after you hyperjump to one region (don't know how large this region might be, maybe a star system).
So if there are other people in that region you are bound to end up in the same session as them. Unless of course there are too many and a new session is created for you.

 

[Kawboy]

As I understood you will join a session after you hyperjump to one region (don't know how large this region might be, maybe a star system).
So if there are other people in that region you are bound to end up in the same session as them. Unless of course there are too many and a new session is created for you.

I'm pretty sure that I read the number of people in an instance is 20. Don't know if that is the actual number for the final release, but that's the number they were using. If you jump into an area where there are already 20 people, a new instance is created for you. So you're still at the ~19 people to interact with.. and visibility of another ship is in 10's of kilometers. VERY hard to find a ship even if we're talking just planetary distances, unless you're hanging around an iconic object such as a space station.. which puts you right back in the 'criminal' activity area...

 

[Ian Doncaster]

I would see it more likely for a player than an AI, unless FD have written some Artificial Gullibility(TM) routines into it.

I don't know... AIs which only notice you're shooting at them when you finally get a shot to connect are often missing opportunities to strike back.

As I recall Frontier said a while back that:
- weapons need to be visibly armed to be fired (as now shown in the Alpha)
- going around with weapons armed will be itself considered a hostile act which could invite retaliation.

So perhaps both AI and player will be able to demand that a "neutral" ship not apparently in combat shuts down its weapon systems to avoid being considered "hostile".

 

[insanephoton]

I'm pretty sure that I read the number of people in an instance is 20. Don't know if that is the actual number for the final release, but that's the number they were using. If you jump into an area where there are already 20 people, a new instance is created for you. So you're still at the ~19 people to interact with.. and visibility of another ship is in 10's of kilometers. VERY hard to find a ship even if we're talking just planetary distances, unless you're hanging around an iconic object such as a space station.. which puts you right back in the 'criminal' activity area...

I seem to recall the number 32 being mentioned. Some people complained that it was too few, but 32 has always been the aim with a possibility of more if technical considerations allow it.

With smaller ships the visibility is not going to be that great, not sure you'd see a Federation fighter at 10km even and Anaconda might be hard to spot. If you watch any of the Alpha videos of the Supply Strike mission, the target ships jump in about 5km away.

 

[Anthony Jones]

I've seen a number of posts inquiring about piracy. Generally they fall into the "If I"m a pirate can I...." or "What if I do <THIS>" categories. This leads me to think that a significant number are planning to go this route and I'm curious as to the motivation there, and why so many think this is a viable solution. I've little doubt that we will all do it occasionally, but as a career I can't see it happening.

Am I missing something here? I just don't see it as a good career move...

I think it can be a very viable job if done well, but is frowned upon by most civilised people.
If you are going to do it I would make sure you are a kingpin and not the guy getting his hands dirty!!

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/11/02/world/africa/horn-of-africa-piracy-loot/



Anthony

 

[Aewarin Jameson]

Can't see that working, at least against a player trader.

Oh I dunno ... after I have mercilessly slaughtered a few people I think you would believe me when I say "drop your cargo or die" especially if the bounty on my head was rather large

 

[Asp Explorer]

Oh I dunno ... after I have mercilessly slaughtered a few people I think you would believe me when I say "drop your cargo or die" especially if the bounty on my head was rather large

But what are you (pirates in general) going to do if all your hapless quarry can dump is a few Barry Mannilow records and a leaky container of Thargoid Slime?

Not sure you'd want any of that on your ship, not without nose and ear plugs.