East India Company buys out Zemina Torval's shares and withdraws financial support. [RP & Non-RP]

[Snarfbuckle]

Loving Power play

The problem with powerplay is that it has POTENTIAL but is sloppily made.

-You non-empire faction can take over an empire owned system and dictate laws without the empire getting off. Also, empire faction are still owning it, yet PP allows you "control over it"???
-Imagine USA asserting influence over Moscow and changing its laws while Russia is still owning it.
-We need to integrate normal system influence takeover and owner change to our major faction before PP can take place
-Having people working to make a system ACTUALLY change allegiance before PP takeover can be applied

 

[Badben]

Honestly, I just don't understand this sort of thing. Why make a big public display out of focusing on other elements of gameplay? It's a bit like a trader announcing that he/she is tired of trading and moving into bounty hunting. I get that you, and your group, don't like PowerPlay. That's fine; you're entitled to your opinion. But do you seriously need to start another thread on the subject. Really?

Personally, I'm enjoying it. I don't spend every hour of every day on it, and won't be able to achieve much in the way of rank, but I think it adds more personality to Elite.

Do whatever you want in-game, but please don't contribute to the "me too" negativity around PowerPlay and other bandwagon topics. It's not productive, and frankly tiresome. It also puts off new/prospective players to the game who see more superfluous negativity on this forum than was the case in the early stages. We need more players. We need more positivity. We need less rehashing of the same old topic, week after week after week.

Fully agree with this

 

[LiquidCatnip]

Just wish I'd had the recorders running

Offer proof next time. I've removed 2 members for combat logging before. It's in our rules (publicly available on the Reddit FAQ). We take a hardline stance on it.

So officially I call bull on your claims.

I could just as easily say "Hey I know you... you were that guy that hacked to kill a bunch of CMDRs with one shot pulse lasers and your shields didn't go down then you high jumped 10000 ly to Sagittarius A and said you were logging off to pleasure yourself to videos of animals. I can't prove it... but I KNOW WHAT I SAW!"

 

[andyraptor]

Yeah - it's a video game and whilst I've contributed to Torval and had my fun delivering 8000+ tons in last minute thursday 5 AM ops just to make the other side pay, it's just not worth it in the long run.

I'm still pledged because it would be stupid not to take the 50 mill without having to do anything until next thursday.

As a matter of fact I stopped investing last week - I just accumulated too many merits before that and my decicion obviously doesn't have anything to do with EICs (which I'm not affiliated with other than reading their reddit threads).

Judging from your last statement, you must be Greek, so be Leonidas and give me something to defend when I return (or not).

Ironic really.... if you care to check the PP screen .... everything is progressing as normal with forify/prep/control

nobody seems to be missing EIC and "The 300" are not needed

 

[Jesters09]

What's happened here with PP is, ED have managed to split up all of the united groups into smaller entities.

Where there used to be good unification and cause between groups, ie, Feds V's Empire V's Indies, now we are all more or less at civil war with each other.

Feds killing Feds and Imperials killing Imperials just doesn't sit right with me.
Don't get me wrong, I've done a bit of supply disruption and arms delivering, but the whole faction against itself . . . I don't like it.

Elite was sold to us as being the story of one pilot and his ship, see if you can influence the universe by blazing your own trail.
Has this failed, forcing FD to introduce new game mechanics to turn factions against themselves?
I understand the power struggle, the Emperor is dead, I get that, but as a true Imperial, I will not kill other Imperials.

I crave the day when we unite our 3 powers again and go to war for real.

I also don't agree with the wall of expansion, we should be able to expand as far as we can.
I think it would have been far better/interesting for FD to let us expand populated space as much as we could, now that would be a worth while challenge.

 

[William J Smith]

What's happened here with PP is, ED have managed to split up all of the united groups into smaller entities.

Where there used to be good unification and cause between groups, ie, Feds V's Empire V's Indies, now we are all more or less at civil war with each other.

Feds killing Feds and Imperials killing Imperials just doesn't sit right with me.
Don't get me wrong, I've done a bit of supply disruption and arms delivering, but the whole faction against itself . . . I don't like it.

Elite was sold to us as being the story of one pilot and his ship, see if you can influence the universe by blazing your own trail.
Has this failed, forcing FD to introduce new game mechanics to turn factions against themselves?
I understand the power struggle, the Emperor is dead, I get that, but as a true Imperial, I will not kill other Imperials.

I crave the day when we unite our 3 powers again and go to war for real.

I also don't agree with the wall of expansion, we should be able to expand as far as we can.
I think it would have been far better/interesting for FD to let us expand populated space as much as we could, now that would be a worth while challenge.

+1 rep for this.... even if you are an impy who deserves to be splattered across deep space somewhere

Bill

PS I'd also settle for shooting your drive out and making you do a sundive ..... you can tell I'm no lover of the empire cant you

 

[CMDR M Kozak]

Ironic really.... if you care to check the PP screen .... everything is progressing as normal with forify/prep/control

nobody seems to be missing EIC and "The 300" are not needed

Well.. you nailed it ;-) And I guess thats also why they chose such a theatrical departure with crying women and all.

They are not needed. For any group that wants to be competetive, that must be a blow. To be redundant.

 

[Cadoc]

Well.. you nailed it ;-) And I guess thats also why they chose such a theatrical departure with crying women and all.

They are not needed. For any group that wants to be competetive, that must be a blow. To be redundant.

I would say it's entirely too soon to make such assumptions. The figures at the end of this cycle should give us some indication, but we won't know the true impact of EIC leaving Torval until another cycle or two. In my opinion this ends the possibility of Torval ending up in top 3 for the long term, but we'll see if the trend holds.

 

[PavelKCZ]

Well.. you nailed it ;-) And I guess thats also why they chose such a theatrical departure with crying women and all.

They are not needed. For any group that wants to be competetive, that must be a blow. To be redundant.

Those groups/guilds/clans are like plaque in almost every MMO which will allow it. Lineage 2 and similar games are full of similar types. They are not playing for fun from the game, they are playing because they want "to own" part of the game.

Basically, it is nothing more than organised griefing. We will see more of similar rants in the future, because luckily ED does not support this kind of behaviour.

 

[LeetNoob]

Wait...which way is east in this game?

 

[Jesters09]

+1 rep for this.... even if you are an impy who deserves to be splattered across deep space somewhere

Bill

PS I'd also settle for shooting your drive out and making you do a sundive ..... you can tell I'm no lover of the empire cant you

You hide it well Sir, but you won't find me in space, stupid PP has turned me into a coward solo/private player.

But I will rep you right back for the quality and sincerity of your insult. o7

 

[Mack Winston]

Don't be silly... it's just a bunch of joystick jockeys who tried to influence a online game and lost... because nobody cared or listened

Next ...... issue a TLDR statement on Reddit and the Forum... christ..... you would think it was the Middle east crisis !!!!


don't hold your breath..... they will be back ....and Catnip and his credit hoes will jump on another PP faction and try the same... watch and see

I'm afraid you don't have a clue about the EIC - how the leadership works, what we do, or anything if you say that.

I'm an ordinary EIC member, not the leadership. Let me give you an idea of how we approached PowerPlay.

Before PP dropped, we had a *big* meeting of EIC commanders - there were probably 100 or so on the Teamspeak channel we were using. This is quite a feat considering our members are spread over every time zone - we have members all over Europe, all over North America, Australia, New Zealand etc. It's not just a matter of merely getting our membership together, it's getting them together when half of them might have to do it at very unsocial hours. Yet most of today's EIC membership was in the meeting.

Our direction was this: being in the Torval PP faction was a condition of continued membership. We did this knowing that not everyone would like it, but thinking of the long game: we didn't want internal conflict if we could avoid it and we wanted to pull in the same direction. We had a big purge (so inactive people could be removed from the roster) and started PP with a solid group. Quickly it was found that PowerPlay wasn't as fun as we hoped but instead of abandoning it at week 2, we stuck with it because after all, as it developed there could be some interesting emergent game play and to re-open the issue later if necessary. We poured EVERYTHING into trying to make PowerPlay work - we really committed. So much so we took a power with only 3% of the player base to being number 2 by cycle 3, and it took a combined effort of an unholy alliance of some Imperial powers AND Federation powers to push us out of this spot (the combined effort of groups probably having 60% of the PP pledges...to push out a power with only 3% of the players). So the idea of withdrawing from PP has been on the cards for some time now, even so we committed for long enough to really make sure that it wasn't going to work. This was not a rash on the spur of the moment decision. This was not a decision to try to attention seek. This was a decision taken because PowerPlay is causing us as a group great harm - the mechanics of PowerPlay just aren't working out and there is not much emergent gameplay and people are not playing E : D any more. (I did have a few really great interactions with the Kumo Crew while smug...er trading - I actually turned it into a short story which I posted on Reddit - but this has been few and far between - it feels like the "glory days" of BD+03 and Lugh and the other really awesome operations are some distant past). I've seen our TeamSpeak channel go from regularly having 15 people on when I usually play to sometimes having only two or three. We just can't sustain this as a group - other groups have already disbanded and we could see the writing on the wall.

- - - Updated - - -

Ironic really.... if you care to check the PP screen .... everything is progressing as normal with forify/prep/control

nobody seems to be missing EIC and "The 300" are not needed

You won't see a change till the next cycle. Most people are going to complete this cycle to collect the salary before withdrawing.

 

[stummies]

... Why make a big public display out of focusing on other elements of gameplay?

It brings attention to something that the OP felt is broken (which I agree).

It's a bit like a trader announcing that he/she is tired of trading and moving into bounty hunting.

No, it's like the trader announcing that he/she is tried of trading because it's broken... not simply because he/she no longer wants to.

I get that you, and your group, don't like PowerPlay. That's fine; you're entitled to your opinion. But do you seriously need to start another thread on the subject. Really?

Yes, because week after week nothing is being addressed. Much better than ANOTHER post like yours that offers nothing constructive.

Personally, I'm enjoying it. I don't spend every hour of every day on it, and won't be able to achieve much in the way of rank, but I think it adds more personality to Elite.

You are in the minority.

Do whatever you want in-game, but please don't contribute to the "me too" negativity around PowerPlay and other bandwagon topics. It's not productive, and frankly tiresome. It also puts off new/prospective players to the game who see more superfluous negativity on this forum than was the case in the early stages. We need more players. We need more positivity. We need less rehashing of the same old topic, week after week after week.

Negativity is only a problem when it's senseless, in this case there is clear concern and valid points on why people are negative about PowerPlay. You're essentially telling people to be silent to keep things "positive", why not instead address the problems instead of ignoring them. We do need more players and positivity... and I'd rather get there through actual positive changes rather than forced semantics because you want things to sound positive.

 

[PavelKCZ]

I'm afraid you don't have a clue about the EIC - how the leadership works, what we do, or anything if you say that.

I'm an ordinary EIC member, not the leadership. Let me give you an idea of how we approached PowerPlay.

Before PP dropped, we had a *big* meeting of EIC commanders - there were probably 100 or so on the Teamspeak channel we were using. This is quite a feat considering our members are spread over every time zone - we have members all over Europe, all over North America, Australia, New Zealand etc. It's not just a matter of merely getting our membership together, it's getting them together when half of them might have to do it at very unsocial hours. Yet most of today's EIC membership was in the meeting.

Let me do a wild (but I think just a bit qualified, based on my past MMO game development bussiness carreer) guess. You did not organised here in ED, right ? You came from outside (possibly EVE) with certain ambitions and purpose, right ?

 

[Cadoc]

I have to say, the outright hostility and rude attitude some players have towards player groups is a little off-putting. EIC in particular have been fine members of the community from the start, enriching the community, helping to build lore and breathing a bit of life into Elite. They've worked with other player groups and independent Commanders on stuff like the Silk Road and they, along with others, gave the galaxy a semblance of political life before Powerplay launched. The way Liquid and some other EIC members are being treated in this thread is downright unfair.

 

[Alex988]

but I think just a bit qualified, based on my past MMO game development bussiness carreer)

Then you should know in most mmos it's the player groups creating content/conflicts/improving the community. You will never hear about EIC in the gaming media (unless ED provides content for groups) like you hear about alliances in EVE. No one cares about Cmdr Pavel but a fight between 1000 players is another thing.


eve has 5201 systems ED has like 400bn , why can't we have some room for player controlled space like this:
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Verite/influence.png

"buhuhuh it's eve." EVE is successful since ages ,ccp must do something very well.

 

[Mohrgan]

Then you should know in most mmos it's the player groups creating content/conflicts/improving the community. You will never hear about EIC in the gaming media (unless ED provides content for groups) like you hear about alliances in EVE. No one cares about Cmdr Pavel but a fight between 1000 players is another thing.


eve has 5201 systems ED has like 400bn , why can't we have some room for player controlled space like this:
http://dl.eve-files.com/media/corp/Verite/influence.png

"buhuhuh it's eve." EVE is successful since ages ,ccp must do something very well.

This game was developed, largely, to avoid just that activity. I've read material from FD saying that they are strictly against players owning anything other than ships. I applaud that attitude. Elite was never intended to follow any other games path.

In my many years in gaming I have not noticed player groups creating content, only conflicts. If you allow 'ownership' you have to accept all of the conflict that causes. I see FD avoiding a source of discontent and drama by keeping it in the cockpit.

 

[PavelKCZ]

Then you should know in most mmos it's the player groups creating content/conflicts/improving the community.

This is not entirely correct. Actually, this "gang" phenomennon is common knowledge between MMOs developers since 1995 (or something like that, since Ultima Online beginning) and it is not always welcomed (at least in Europe, South Corean MMOs are a bit different). A can make a sure bet that exactly this was a big part of decisions the FD made in the past and made ED exactly like it is now. The game where "gangs" have only really limited space how to spoil the whole game.

Actually, there are some serious studies (both IT/game bussines based and sociological/socio-anthropogical etc.) about this phenomenon. In the EU, there even are several grants for MMO game companies for compensation for decline of normal players in exchange that those "gangs" can play and they are not banned. Mainly under titles like "Fight against children criminality", "Help for social weak parts of population" etc. It is based on simple fact that it is better to let those mentally not so ballanced peoples with mostly mediocre family background play and molest virtual players than let them organise in real street gangs in real life. IMHO it is waste of money and stupid political agenda, because was majority of those peoples are too weak and too coward to be members of RL street gangs, but you know, EU is politically correct and there is a lot of money, so grants are not a problem...

 

[PavelKCZ]

BTW, this "gang" behavior is the main reason, why in last let's say 4-5 years, the majority of new MMO games (or new updates of older MMO games) have PvP either disabled outside special areas or strictly user selectable. And why almost all MMO developers implemented methods how to make the "owning" of game or part of game impossible. Examples are newer versions of WoW, GW2, Firefall and more and more.
Simply, let the gangsters to own part of game and molest normal players is bad for bussiness. Especially in today prevalent Free to Play or Pay once to Play world.

 

[Alex988]

This is not entirely correct. Actually, this "gang" phenomennon is common knowledge between MMOs developers since 1995 (or something like that, since Ultima Online beginning) and it is not always welcomed (at least in Europe, South Corean MMOs are a bit different). A can make a sure bet that exactly this was a big part of decisions the FD made in the past and made ED exactly like it is now. The game where "gangs" have only really limited space how to spoil the whole game.

Actually, there are some serious studies (both IT/game bussines based and sociological/socio-anthropogical etc.) about this phenomenon. In the EU, there even are several grants for MMO game companies for compensation for decline of normal players in exchange that those "gangs" can play and they are not banned. Mainly under titles like "Fight against children criminality", "Help for social weak parts of population" etc. It is based on simple fact that it is better to let those mentally not so ballanced peoples with mostly mediocre family background play and molest virtual players than let them organise in real street gangs in real life. IMHO it is waste of money and stupid political agenda, because was majority of those peoples are too weak and too coward to be members of RL street gangs, but you know, EU is politically correct and there is a lot of money, so grants are not a problem...

what? so EIC are literally goons. I knew it! good god you have no clue at all.