The SCB (Shield Cell Bank) Thread

I don't see an issue with this either.


Yeah. And you know what the most common weapon the attackers were packing?

Multi-cannons.

Check.

I have, there is a load of lasers on the go. You even see them when the Python pilot turns to face the attackers.
The Python was getting hit with weapons designed to take out shields, from up to 5 attackers - a sustained barrage and his shields stayed up thanks to loads of SCBs
I counted 6 used by the way, though not sure how many were doubled up - but there was at least 6 SCBs used from what you can see / hear in that video.

(Oh and should that link go dead for some odd reason or the video get taken down, I've saved a copy of it myself - will upload to my channel if needed)

BTW, you do know Multis have always been the best projectile to take down shields?
So even if it had been just Multis (which it wasn't) - then his shields should still have come down with 5 attackers, much faster than 30 seconds.
And you should not be able to ignore multiple attackers for over 3 minutes regardless of what equipment is fitted
 
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I have, there is a load of lasers on the go. You even see them when the Python pilot turns to face the attackers.
The Python was getting hit with weapons designed to take out shields, from up to 5 attackers - a sustained barrage and his shields stayed up thanks to loads of SCBs
I counted 6 used by the way, though not sure how many were doubled up - but there was at least 6 SCBs used from what you can see / hear in that video.

(Oh and should that link go dead for some odd reason or the video get taken down, I've saved a copy of it myself - will upload to my channel if needed)

BTW, you do know Multis have always been the best projectile to take down shields?
So even if it had been just Multis (which it wasn't) - then his shields should still have come down with 5 attackers, much faster than 30 seconds.
And you should not be able to ignore multiple attackers for over 3 minutes regardless of what equipment is fitted
Multi's are the best to take down shields??? Right, you know not of which you speak. IMO.
 
This waffle proves you have never been the large ship in any PvP, 30 mins LOL 30 seconds is the reality. Or should I say was the reality now it is just what your shields hold at the start of the fight. Large PVP is over.

Multi's are the best to take down shields??? Right, you know not of which you speak. IMO.

So apart from the melodrama and attacking the person not the argument, you're ignoring the proof that 1 person can tank 5 ships for a lot longer than they should be able.
And you tell me I do not know what I'm talking about ?


2:25 First person starts attacking the Python (gets Ignored).
2:36 Second person joins in (also gets ignored).
3:02 Third person now attacking the Python.
3:08 Fourth person joins the fray. (Python has stayed on it's target the whole time and is using SCBs like eating smarties).
4:00 Fifth person starts shooting the Python (Python turns on more SCBs)
4:34 Pythons shields finally drop after a few SCBs being used.
5:33 Python jumps out at 61% hull

Why not comment on that ^^ ??

Oh right, you have no defence of the broken toys being abused by those wanting the easy mode game play.
SCBs should not be the backbone of PvP, period.
 
I have, there is a load of lasers on the go. You even see them when the Python pilot turns to face the attackers.
The Python was getting hit with weapons designed to take out shields, from up to 5 attackers - a sustained barrage and his shields stayed up thanks to loads of SCBs
I counted 6 used by the way, though not sure how many were doubled up - but there was at least 6 SCBs used from what you can see / hear in that video.

(Oh and should that link go dead for some odd reason or the video get taken down, I've saved a copy of it myself - will upload to my channel if needed)

BTW, you do know Multis have always been the best projectile to take down shields?
So even if it had been just Multis (which it wasn't) - then his shields should still have come down with 5 attackers, much faster than 30 seconds.
And you should not be able to ignore multiple attackers for over 3 minutes regardless of what equipment is fitted
The python was getting hit with multi-cannons and pulses. These are not weapons that destroy shields quickly. I saw two beams used for a small amount of time while the shields were up, but used more often when the shields were down.

And you call that a sustained barrage? Please. That was not a sustained barrage from five attackers. Do not try to sway those who haven't watched the video with your delusions.

Multicannonss are terrible weapons for taking out shields, especially at the distances and speeds in that fight. They do less damage than cannons and they have a large spread. Not to mention that pythons have the smallest profile available to ships of that class from that angle.

Let's actually look at the video and see what really happens:
2:22 - first attacker opens up with multicannons at maximum range.
-----This attacker can't stay on target because chaff is deployed soon after.

2:36 - a second attacker joins in, for a few seconds.
-----They both stop attacking for the next fifteen.

2:55-3:00 - two more attackers pop in (totalling four) and the python takes some serious hurt, losing two rings in ten seconds.
-----Chaff is dropped and SCBs are hit, keeping the shields barely functional.

3:24 - beams finally enter the picture as all but two attackers break off.
-----SCBs bring the python's shields back up to two rings.

3:41 - third and fourth attacker rejoins with multicannons.
----SCBs used again to bring the python back to 3 rings, pips to shields.

3:53 - python begins its 180, picking up the fifth attacker.
----Loses a ring in seconds, deploys chaff, and hits the last SCBs of the bank, switching to its last set.

4:24 - python completes its 180, chaff ends with python at full shields.
-----Five attackers fully reengage.

4:33 - python has lost its shields.
-----It took five attackers nine seconds to punch through a pair of SCBs and an entire python shield.

So no, it did not take five attackers thirty seconds to break a python. It took them nine seconds to break 2439.5Mj worth of shield.
Approximate figure. Three boosters plus a non-prismatic 6A generator for a python gets 635, and the class 5 and 6 SCBs output 390. Four pips to shields increases the shield value to 238%, totalling 2495.5Mjs worth of durability.
And with terrible weapon choices too. 250Mj/s is terrible for five attackers.

You are still in check. By the way, someone saying that you don't know what you're talking about isn't attacking the poster so much as it's attacking the methods you're using, especially when it's made very clear by the post in question that you do indeed have no idea what you're talking about.
 
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Hello Frontier Team

I love the changes on the Shield cells, previously they were much too strong.

Please do not undo these changes!
Now it makes finally fun to fly.

Thanks for your great job!
Max
 
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Hello Frontier Team

I love the changes on the plate cells, previously they were much too strong.

Please do not undo these changes!
Now it makes finally fun to fly.

Thanks for your great job!
Max

cant-tell-if-serious.jpg
 
I just can't see how it's a fair change for large ships in combat.

It's like buying a Ferrari, only to find out that it has a 1ltr engine in it, but still costs the same.
 
I hope they do stay as they are in 1.5. It will be a phenomenal demonstration of how mindlessly stupid the whole thing is. FD caving to the whims of a minority that scream unfair every single time they hit something they find hard to beat. FD have caved every time the children scream, I nearly choked to death reading a post by someone at FD stating that they don't listen too mush to the forum nerf squad!!!!!!!! Really???? It must be some massive coincidence that every nerf request gets granted then, eh?
Do the real bugs get fixed? Nooooooo, do the weapons get more variety? Noooooo. Do nerf demands get implemented every single patch?? Yes and sometimes get introduced between patches.

Keep it as it is in 1.5 Beta, force it on every one and make them eat it up. They got the cake they got to eat it.
Oh my, where have all the large ships gone? Why do players simply run when they used to stand and fight? Why are more and more people combat logging? Why cant I find large targets to pew pew?

- - - Updated - - -

I just can't see how it's a fair change for large ships in combat.

It's like buying a Ferrari, only to find out that it has a 1ltr engine in it, but still costs the same.
Go on the beta forum, these same whiners are actually asking FD, ready for this, are you sitting down?, they are actually asking FD NOT TO NERF THE SMALL SHIELD CELLS SO THAT THEY CAN STILL USE THEM ON THEIR OWN SMALL SHIPS. They got the nerf for the big ships and they want to keep on as before with the small cells for their own use!!!!!

You can't make this up.
 
Let's look at the reality of the situation: Large ships have an extremely difficult time in heavy combat if not well protected.
Until there is more reason to actually field large ships, they will die off - a large ship doesn't bring a lot more to a fight other than durability and firepower.
However, this firepower is no longer in balance with their durability. A focused large ship will be nearly completely disarmed by their SCB use.

The way to address this is not by hitting SCBs themselves I think - large ships need to have more enabled to them. Fielding fighters is an example.

Here's an idea: have a missile laden anaconda in a wing of FASs. That's gonna be a potent fighting force.
 
Let's look at the reality of the situation: Large ships have an extremely difficult time in heavy combat if not well protected.
Until there is more reason to actually field large ships, they will die off - a large ship doesn't bring a lot more to a fight other than durability and firepower.
However, this firepower is no longer in balance with their durability. A focused large ship will be nearly completely disarmed by their SCB use.

The way to address this is not by hitting SCBs themselves I think - large ships need to have more enabled to them. Fielding fighters is an example.

Here's an idea: have a missile laden anaconda in a wing of FASs. That's gonna be a potent fighting force.

Here is a test fight for example what the nerfers and crybabies did to Shields overall. FD - RECONSIDER THIS.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lVwVBUD5fM8 Full shields+8boosters vs a 66% armor corvette. Should this be viable?
We are pounding eachother all the time.
 
If you have a problem with the new SCB changes, that means you got compliance with SCB stacking and forgot to learn the basics and to how survive in the game. Learn new tactics to adapt and overcome that is all YOU at the end.
Hint: Hull reinforcement is actually viable game play now. The bigger the ship the better Armour you have.
 
Aha - so this is a problem with me not the game being broken by listening to a couple of whiny commanders. Thank you for the info.
I hate the reinforcements - they make you jump slow, bulky. It should be balanced half/half. I choose to tank shields - it's ok. You choose to tank armor - it's ok.
Now we are forced to tank armor. What is the use of a shield gen then? Did you consider that?
 
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Aha - so this is a problem with me not the game being broken by listening to a couple of whiny commanders. Thank you for the info.
I hate the reinforcements - they make you jump slow, bulky. It should be balanced half/half. I choose to tank shields - it's ok. You choose to tank armor - it's ok.
Now we are forced to tank armor. What is the use of a shield gen then? Did you consider that?
You could still use it in combat if you want but it comes with drawbacks, i suggest to adapt and overcome then.
 
Re-posted from the thread in the beta forums.

I would like to add to this discussion in the most constructive way I can.

First off I want to stress that from my point of view both camps on the extremes of this debate need to open their eyes a little and be more realistic.

Those that say, "Oh the change is fine!" no...just no. The change is not fine. The heat damage to modules is not insignificant, and variety of game-play should be stressed not diminished with nerfs. SCB's did already have a hard counter in the form of aggressive teamwork in multi-wing battles. Anyone that argues otherwise probably has minimal experience in this setting, even less so being at the receiving end of one of those coordinated attacks. I’ve always felt that this is a realistic approach to the small ship vs. large ship conflict scenario; force in numbers can mean as much as a single large unit. There is a giant penalty involved in the loss of large ships in the form of rebuy, with this change as it stands, you can say goodbye to seeing any of your big buddies flying alongside you in large PvP scenarios. If anything that should be seen as a negative return on the change and a gameplay limiting danger button.

On the other side of the debate, large ship pilots, let’s be fair and honest with ourselves. The change is going to happen one way or another, and in small engagements the SCB meta is static and one-sided. There is a plus side to the change, in that if implemented correctly, a new level of tactical gameplay will be required of us. Decisions to replace overall strength in shield with heat management options, and their intrinsically limited nature, will give us another reason to be proud of our ability to persevere in combat. This element of gameplay has a chance, should FD go about its balancing in a responsible manner, of giving us almost more than we can handle as single pilots of large craft. Please keep this in mind when we think to the future of multi-crew ship combat.

My position on the matter, if you hadn’t gathered this already, is somewhere in the middle. I enjoy the idea of having to make more difficult choices in when and how I deploy my SCB’s. As such I think that single SCB’s need to suffer from diminishing heat penalty returns, and instead focus the penalties on the use of sequenced banks. I feel that multiple SCB’s should still be possible but should REQUIRE the use of heat-sink deployment. On that note the effectiveness of sinks would need to be adjusted as well. That tackles the problem from two sides. It increases the tactical toll and complexity of flying a large vessel, while effectively weakening the pilot should a reliance of SCB’s continue. However should a pilot master the use of the new mechanic he can continue to serve in his/her intended roll in large scale PvP, and act as a damage anchor in the intended zone of engagement. It should be noted that his usefulness in PvE would continue to benefit in the same way.
 
Re-posted from the thread in the beta forums.

I would like to add to this discussion in the most constructive way I can.

First off I want to stress that from my point of view both camps on the extremes of this debate need to open their eyes a little and be more realistic.

Those that say, "Oh the change is fine!" no...just no. The change is not fine. The heat damage to modules is not insignificant, and variety of game-play should be stressed not diminished with nerfs. SCB's did already have a hard counter in the form of aggressive teamwork in multi-wing battles. Anyone that argues otherwise probably has minimal experience in this setting, even less so being at the receiving end of one of those coordinated attacks. I’ve always felt that this is a realistic approach to the small ship vs. large ship conflict scenario; force in numbers can mean as much as a single large unit. There is a giant penalty involved in the loss of large ships in the form of rebuy, with this change as it stands, you can say goodbye to seeing any of your big buddies flying alongside you in large PvP scenarios. If anything that should be seen as a negative return on the change and a gameplay limiting danger button.

On the other side of the debate, large ship pilots, let’s be fair and honest with ourselves. The change is going to happen one way or another, and in small engagements the SCB meta is static and one-sided. There is a plus side to the change, in that if implemented correctly, a new level of tactical gameplay will be required of us. Decisions to replace overall strength in shield with heat management options, and their intrinsically limited nature, will give us another reason to be proud of our ability to persevere in combat. This element of gameplay has a chance, should FD go about its balancing in a responsible manner, of giving us almost more than we can handle as single pilots of large craft. Please keep this in mind when we think to the future of multi-crew ship combat.

My position on the matter, if you hadn’t gathered this already, is somewhere in the middle. I enjoy the idea of having to make more difficult choices in when and how I deploy my SCB’s. As such I think that single SCB’s need to suffer from diminishing heat penalty returns, and instead focus the penalties on the use of sequenced banks. I feel that multiple SCB’s should still be possible but should REQUIRE the use of heat-sink deployment. On that note the effectiveness of sinks would need to be adjusted as well. That tackles the problem from two sides. It increases the tactical toll and complexity of flying a large vessel, while effectively weakening the pilot should a reliance of SCB’s continue. However should a pilot master the use of the new mechanic he can continue to serve in his/her intended roll in large scale PvP, and act as a damage anchor in the intended zone of engagement. It should be noted that his usefulness in PvE would continue to benefit in the same way.
there you again with the PvP large scale battle. Did it crossed your mind for once that not many MANY Cdmr participate in your all out war? you guys only a small number get over it.,
 
Aha - so this is a problem with me not the game being broken by listening to a couple of whiny commanders. Thank you for the info.
I hate the reinforcements - they make you jump slow, bulky. It should be balanced half/half. I choose to tank shields - it's ok. You choose to tank armor - it's ok.
Now we are forced to tank armor. What is the use of a shield gen then? Did you consider that?
As I have said before, your power module has a random chance of exploding once hit. It does not need to be at 0% to do this. So tank up with Armour and even drop the shield entirely but you will not get around that random chance of blowing up mid fight. Second, your canopy is as vulnerable as ever regardless of armour.
 
there you again with the PvP large scale battle. Did it crossed your mind for once that not many MANY Cdmr participate in your all out war? you guys only a small number get over it.,


I lead one of those player groups, and I beg to differ on the whole, "we're a small part of the equation" argument. We're a very visible and active part of the ED community (all player groups that is), and it's our group endeavors that in many cases are part of the creation of emergent game-play to which any sandbox title owes its success. My argument from the beginning is one of moderation and happy medium, but your response is rash, biased, and grammatically painful to read. Not only were you just supremely unhelpful and disrespectful, your hostility shows that you subconsciously think your on the losing end of your own argument.
 
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