iirc, last time you were asking about War, which is 15% for victory condition. Civil War (two factions native to the system are fighting) has a different victory condition, only 5%. Election happens with 2 similar government types, whether they are native to the system or not. DaveC spells it out nicely above.
A Guide to Minor Factions and the Background Sim
- Thread starter Walt Kerman
- Start date
When you are fighting a War, you have until 28 days to have the 15% difference. Is it possible that it ends BEFORE 28 days without any winning factions ? As it seems it happened to us. Is it a known bug with BGS ? Or is it possible that an external intervention in our system trigger the end of this war status ?
I would also like clarification on exactly when or what type of conditions an outsider faction (in this case our faction) can be considered one of the local factions. This is the second war that we've fought in the system and we're still considered an invading faction - hence the 15% required victory margin. Shouldn't it not be a Civil War the second time ?
Yes, conflicts have been observed finishing before their maximum time frame without a clear victor. Whether that's a bug or due to other activities bringing the conflict to an end I don't know. For instance, it's possible to bring other states to an end prior to their maximum length by doing other activities. It may be possible to achieve the same with conflicts, but so far I'm unaware of anyone achieving this in a repeatable fashion.
A faction that originates in another system is always considered "an outsider" as far as we've seen so far. This may of course change with 2.1, but until then assume that a faction that expanded or was displaced to the current system is foreign and thus a War candidate. You will only get civil wars if you're in the system of origin for both participating factions. The one scenario that may be different, is if both factions have expanded into System B from System A; both factions involved are native to System A. In which case there's a slim possibility that because they're both from System A, they might go to civil war in System B - but I doubt it. We were hoping to test that scenario at some point, but haven't got around to it yet.
Thank you for the clear answer. It helps a lot.
Can someone able to clarify these statements at all, as they seem to contradict one-another.
When we put our minor fraction into the game we chose the largest station assuming we would not have control of the system if we chose one of smaller ones. This apparently is not the case. The issue is the other two big stations in the system are far superior trading stations and so bring in large amounts of money for the other large fraction (the previous system owners).
So we are trying to get our influence over 60% to try and take one of these two stations. But that second quote above implies this will not happen?
Also does the station you take, and hand in a mission in have an effect? Right now we are doing missions for our fractions from one of the stations we need to take over, hoping it had it's own hidden influence.
How did you chose the "largest" station?
What made you think it was the "largest"?
If you get your influence above 60% you'll go in to conflict for the ruling station. If you want to capture the other stations you'll have to equalise influence with their owning faction. Missions affect influence of the faction you're doing the mission for, the station is irrelevant in this case.
In truth, no they don't, but it is complex, I grant you!
Perhaps the second paragraph would be better-served if the word 'sit' was replaced with 'stay'... which is what it's explaining, really. If you stay at the 60% you've reached in order get into a war/election with the ruling station's faction, you will not get the other stations... you will almost certainly have to move influence levels again, to match them and fight with them, too.The 'get over 60%' rule only works for causing a conflict with the ruling station's faction. In order to conflict with any other station's faction, you have to match them, or nearly so.
Complex answer, potentially. Broadly speaking, doing missions for Faction X, regardless of which station or outpost or even planetary base you're handing that mission in or doing it for, primarily affects Faction X's influence, not the station! There are subtle variations to this (most likely when the mission involves an action that also has an effect on the station-controlling faction's influence, such as murder, smuggling, etc) but basically, missions improve (or damage, if failed/abandoned/flipped - to varying degrees) the mission-giving faction's influence.
However, this might not be what you want! It may be prudent to actually harm your own faction's influence, in some cases. For example... your faction, Faction X, has 66% influence and controls the major station already, let's say. But on the rise to power, you missed a potential fight with another faction, Faction Z, and thus don't control their station, which is still having a significant effect on trade in the system. You want to get control of that secondary station, and Faction Z's influence is currently 34% - in order to fight Faction Z and possibly win the station, you will have to either increase Faction Z's influence or decrease your own Faction X's influence - or quite possibly BOTH those things, until you and Faction Z end up in a battle or election - probably around the 50% mark, in this case (halfway between both factions' original starting point). In practice, it probably won't happen spot on 50% - it'll be somewhere within a few percent of that area.
Bear in mind that negatively influencing your own faction's influence downwards, can be tough (you don't generally want to end up wanted in your own system - it can complicate matters immensely, for example). Sometimes it's better to focus (and have your team focus) on positively affecting the rival faction (Faction Z) and letting your own faction's influence 'drift down' under its own steam. You'll need to ensure none of your team is positively affecting your stations: no trading (in or out), no missions for your faction anywhere in that system. Eventually, Faction Z will start coming up, Faction X will start to go down, and when they meet in the middle, be ready for either an election or a war/civil war, and be prepared to fight to win it! Election fights are via trade and non-combat missions only (boost your team), war/civil war fights are through combat in a combat zone (fight for your side) and possibly through combat-related missions for your faction (though I am unconvinced about that, personally, but only because I've never encountered any in that situation yet - they may well exist).
Hope this helps!
The system contains two outposts, two Ocellus stations and an Orbis orbiting a Earthlike. So we went for the Orbis orbiting the Earthlike, figuring that was the 'controlling station'.
So we already have control of the system. However it is a very uphill battle to maintain control as all the trade is pushing up the previous incumbent. Right now we have around 52% influence with the other major party at around 35%.
From what I am reading in this thread, continuing to support our fraction to the point that it takes over one of the two Ocullus stations is actually impossible, and the only way to take them is to lost standing till we go into a civil war...
...which is bonkers.
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It does, thank you.
So given we already are the ruling faction, getting 60+ will do nothing. We need to do the bonkers civil war method.
Ok so now understand the mechanics... but those mechanics are nonsensical.
This is one of the reasons I created the thread. I knew people would come to the same conclusion.
"The 'get over 60%' rule only works for causing a conflict with the ruling station's faction. In order to conflict with any other station's faction, you have to match them, or nearly so."
So this is true?! Goddamn, can you just confirm that again for me Walt?! I thought the OP states that getting over 60% or equalising influence starts a conflict. Nothing about it having to be the opposing controlling station if going the 60% route?
So this is true?! Goddamn, can you just confirm that again for me Walt?! I thought the OP states that getting over 60% or equalising influence starts a conflict. Nothing about it having to be the opposing controlling station if going the 60% route?
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dynamicbob
Banned
Isnt it now a 70% thereshold and the maximal LY expansion for a minor faction in the guide says 30ly ( fdev have confirmed a while back it is infact 50ly) if references are needed i can post the link.
Yeah, i'm meaning to take control of other stations in the same system DynBob. If we control the ruling station, is the only way to take other stations to equalise influence rather than go over 60% again?
Yes, you must equalise influence.
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Sometimes you have to go down to come back up.
this was highlighted in a Dev thread about how to handle new player groups coming in as minor factions.
Maybe point was made that it's actually better to start low and capture each station on the way up rather than start ruling and have to mange all the ups and downs.
this was highlighted in a Dev thread about how to handle new player groups coming in as minor factions.
Maybe point was made that it's actually better to start low and capture each station on the way up rather than start ruling and have to mange all the ups and downs.
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Yeah well, our minor faction was doing exactly that, as we were initially only given like 8% influence as a starting point. After taking one station and then starting a war with the next, the patch dropped and it was all taken away. They then 'remedied' this by bumping our influence up to 60%, which was kinda a joke tbh.
If it makes you feel any better, Michael has agreed that it is something he'd like to change. I think we'd all like a better way to challenge for non-controlling stations.
Sounds like you can let the natural trade at the other stations boost the 2nd faction up to match your faction and cause a conflict. 52% vs 35% isn't that big a gap to close. Just watch closely for the pending conflict so you can boost your faction back up before the conflict starts.
Interesting. So once you enter that pending state, the war is inevitable, but you can effect the outcome before it starts?
How do you when this pre-war state is entered?
Yes, once the conflict is pending, it will go active after the pending period (3 days) no matter what you do to the influence. You absolutely can determine the outcome before the conflict even begins. The conflict will still run for its minimum duration, but the outcome will be assured.
To know when the conflict is pending, it should be a pretty noticeable equalization of influence after a tick. Once you see that, check the right hand status panel while you are in the system to view the pending states for each faction. The pending states won't show up in the system map, you actually need to go there.
Hi
I seem to remember a warning about pushing that 60% too far! Is there any danger?
I seem to remember a warning about pushing that 60% too far! Is there any danger?
