I can claim exactly the same as you. Show me one direct effect PvP has on PP. Just because players care about the outcome, doesn't turn PP into a PvP feature. The entire mechanism of PP can and does turn without any input from PvP. Widening the definition of PvP to construct some PvP facet of PP is done entirely so that the PvP'ers have an rallying cry. PP as a PvP feature is a reach at best.
(info) First bonus for playing in OPEN under consideration for PP
- Thread starter Abil Midena
- Start date
- Status
I can claim exactly the same as you. Show me one direct effect PvP has on PP. Just because players care about the outcome, doesn't turn PP into a PvP feature. The entire mechanism of PP can and does turn without any input from PvP. Widening the definition of PvP to construct some PvP facet of PP is done entirely so that the PvP'ers have an rallying cry. PP as a PvP feature is a reach at best.
You guys are making me choke on my coffee. Thanks.
[video=youtube;NnP5iDKwuwk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnP5iDKwuwk[/video]
CG's are a special event, not part of the normal game mechanics, and their failure in the past already shows there's no advantage to be had by playing in another mode, so there's no need for anything to be done regarding them.
PP is different, it's a constant game mechanic, it's the only one that's entirely player driven, the only player vs player mechanic in the game, going into solo or group give advantages, the very fact that people who state this are told 'well just play in solo/group!' shows this, we're all aware of it, but the proper answer is NOT go to solo/group, it's remove the advantage solo/group have so that all 3 modes are actually equal. Sandro suggests a mod to the PP effects of Open players, which is one way to do it, numbers will need to be juggled a bit to get it right but it's the best answer to allowing PP across all 3 modes.
There is no connection to the PP mechanic and a marketing theory that uses the phrase 'competitive scope'. It's just another attempt at obfuscating the reality of PP. The competition within PP is done by satisfying PvE activities that combine to return a result. No PvP is required. Just good old grinding.
I dont think its hard (nothing is in elite
) I just think it would be okay to see open as a hard (or hard(er) or less easy) mode for powerplay due to the increased risk as all the PvP I have been in was in some way linked to powerplay.
Sure NPC are in powerplay but sins its about war and the BGS so going solo runs over the CMDRs playing in open in a massive way and systems can change faction by hiding in solo
Because the feature itself is advertised as a competitive feature and all actions have opposition value to other players' actions.
PvP is driving the mechanic of PP.
There's no widening of any definition, player versus player, players in opposition and competition with one another. Those that do not care about the result are unintentional 5cers, which are people Sandror is trying to tone down because it is destructive to PP as a whole.
How much time have you spend in PP, what credentials do you have? Do you have a full understanding of how PP works?
Last edited:
Windows 10 does much, much worse
All I am trying to demonstrate is that there is some form of semi-detecting deliberate combat logging - but it's not a good one, has all sorts of potential repercussions, and would ultimately be a waste of time anyway.
Just multihome, script a partial re-route to second router, disable first NIC, watch instances burn
Last edited:
Not if I don't complete activities that hurt my chosen Super Power. Do you want to try and connect playing in a Private Group to be part of the definition of a 5th Column? A 5c agent has to actually damage (on purpose) their Power, just playing in Solo cannot reach that level.
If you don't complete activities to hurt your power, then you're playing PP, and you care about the result.
Those that complete activities without a thought about their power are unintentional 5cers.
You can't have it both ways. Either you care about the result or you don't, and if you don't, Sandro's trying to tone you down, if you do, you're a PvPer, supporting your power against other players trying to undermine it.
Last edited:
I'd like to iterate my suggestion:
Solo and Private group can make as much coin as they do now - as if playing offline. As many claim they wanted in the first place.
Only open can affect the BGS an Poweplay mechanics.
No change in earnings or anything. Want to get rich in Solo, be my guest. Want to interact with the BGS, open yourself to the risks of open mode.
Simple solution. Even a workable solution. PP and BGS manipulations are supposed to be player driven afterall...
Solo and Private group can make as much coin as they do now - as if playing offline. As many claim they wanted in the first place.
Only open can affect the BGS an Poweplay mechanics.
No change in earnings or anything. Want to get rich in Solo, be my guest. Want to interact with the BGS, open yourself to the risks of open mode.
Simple solution. Even a workable solution. PP and BGS manipulations are supposed to be player driven afterall...
Windows 10 does much, much worse
All I am trying to demonstrate is that there is some form of semi-detecting deliberate combat logging - but it's not a good one, has all sorts of potential repercussions, and would ultimately be a waste of time anyway.
Just multihome, script a partial re-route to second router, disable first NIC, watch instances burn
And the quick, easy, legal methods are all quick and easy to get around by the average 1d10t user with a little help from any one of a few thousand websites, so pretty pointless.
Yup, that's 1 advantage indeed.
> That was my mistake, as I said to Grape, I forgot all about the Powers scoreboard. I don't have any interest in PP, so my working knowledge of PP has become rusty
There is no player scoreboard though, right? Want to make sure I'm not missing something. > This is where I get lost. Is Open all playing for one power, and Group/Solo playing in one opposing power? Are there not players in each mode playing for various powers? Does it not all work out in the end? After all it's the Powers scoreboard and not the players, right?
> I'm completely on-board for this personally. The more we can move Solo to Offline mode is a win in my book. If I was the King of Elite there would be separate PvP/PvE galaxies and Offline
Sole Hunter
Banned
about time !
First off, I don;t owe you some set of credentials to enter a debate. You can leave dismissing me off your list.
Show me one feature of PP where PvP has any impact. The PvP connection you want to make is completely constructed as a way to prop up open. You can only change the scoreboard by completing PvE tasks. There is no PP activity that is directly benefited by PvP. There just isn't. Your assertions can't magically make it so. The PP mechanic is NPC Power v. NPC Power. It's numbers v. numbers.
Yup, that's 1 advantage indeed.
> That was my mistake, as I said to Grape, I forgot all about the Powers scoreboard. I don't have any interest in PP, so my working knowledge of PP has become rusty
> This is where I get lost. Is Open all playing for one power, and Group/Solo playing in one opposing power? Are there not players in each mode playing for various powers? Does it not all work out in the end? After all it's the Powers scoreboard and not the players, right?
> I'm completely on-board for this personally. The more we can move Solo to Offline mode is a win in my book. If I was the King of Elite there would be separate PvP/PvE galaxies and Offline
1st point, no personal scoreboards, PP isn't about your personal score, it's about the Power's score, which is determined only by player actions.
2nd point, few of the big PP groups in Open can compete against the groups in Solo/Group, I mean, literally, they can't compete, everyone moves to Solo/Group literally for that reason, Solo/Group give that much of an advantage.
3rd point, that's my choice in the matter, PP should be Open only, everything else is fine across all modes since they are PvE mechanics and the NPCs are involved. Don't agree on the offline or PvE/PvP bit, this was never meant to be a single player offline game nor a multiplayer PvE only game, ever. David never offered those ideas up, he presented an online multiplayer only game, that's it, and that's what I bought, not a single player, offline or PvE game.
More pros? That's an interesting assertion. We should make a chart and compare notes! [praise]
I dont think its hard (nothing is in elite
I just think it would be okay to see open as a hard (or hard(er) or less easy) mode for powerplay due to the increased risk as all the PvP I have been in was in some way linked to powerplay.
Sure NPC are in powerplay but sins its about war and the BGS so going solo runs over the CMDRs playing in open in a massive way and systems can change faction by hiding in solo
Isn't that what the modes are for though, choice? There are pros and cons to each mode, we should evaluate those pros and cons and choose wisely, no?
I wonder, even if something is changed so that open is favored over solo and group modes.
Would it really make the PVE oriented player or the lone wolf go to open ?
I dont know the player count in each mode but i would guess they are close to equal in size.
And not sure this way is a good one.
Would it really make the PVE oriented player or the lone wolf go to open ?
I dont know the player count in each mode but i would guess they are close to equal in size.
And not sure this way is a good one.
Last edited:
Wrong, the pro's and con's of mode selection should have to do with interacting with other players ONLY, not on how we directly impact the game world, especially not how we impact the only player vs player mechanic designed into the game world.
Solo/Group gives an advantage, 'play in Solo/Group then!' is totally not the right answer.
Then I expect you to demonstrate basic mastery over PP mechanics, if you fail to do that, I will call you out on it, simple as that.
Uh... every feature? Fortifying is only necessary due to optimizing CC and counter enemy undermining. Undermining is necessary to keep other power in check and divert opposition power's manpower. Expansion is for the sake of territory control which infringes on the availability of territory of other powers. The question is where does PvP not have an impact on PP?
The way you're using PvP is only the narrow facet of PK, which is a part of PvP. PvP means player to player opposition and competition, it doesn't have to take solely the form of face to face ship conflict. PvE activities are the means to PvP in the big picture of PP, I don't see why you're actively denying the obvious connection.
- Status