Endless donuts/loops in AI combat, even harmless-ranked AI's. New combat standard?

AluminumAlloy

AluminumAlloy
I'm not sure if this is a new standard for minimal/low-difficulty NPC's during combat, but I was doing bounty hunting today and encountered multiple harmless, mostly harmless and novice NPC's in Adders and Sidewinders that weren't really equipped for combat, judging by scanning their hard-points and other ship mounts. Sounded like easy cash for me, so I blasted out some laser beams on their ships, until out of the blue it seemed that all of them went insta-Elite and managed to get behind my ship in less than seconds.

I almost got blown up by these low-skilled ships, no matter which one I encountered, it was like once they were behind me they were behind me for eternity. Despite doing all the tricks in the universe to switch in Flight Assist Off and do the quickest flips, I couldn't see one pixel of their ship appearing on my screen; they were stuck behind me and according to my radar, the red triangles wound't move off one little bit as if we were both attached to a hard stick. Generally i'm quite good in combat against highly-skilled NPC's but ever since the new update came in it seems that there's literally no chance for me to make them move a single inch away from my tail with even the dumbest NPC's?
 
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W4rSkuLL

W4rSkuLL
It could be a "talented" NPC which is masked with harmless. Its really much better, well maybe not. But it could explain why a Harmless is so good. Or you are just a bad pilot chewing over to much at one time. Well, whatever :p
 

Flimley

Flimley
There are some strange things happening. And very different accounts given. I'm finding shields are not what they used to be, unless it's my imagination.
Flimley.
 

Bomba Luigi

Bomba Luigi
Adders and sides got to use the little advantage they have, standing in front of your lasers wouldn't be a good Idea after all. dunno what ship you used, but with a bit of FAoff and thruster/reverse voodoo they can't stay out of weapon sight for too long in my expierence.
 

thorn-

thorn-
NPC Vultures are nice and twisty... very fun to fight.

I've seen NPCs do the continuous pitch loops as their only combat technique. Seen lots of CMDRs do it, too.

The trick to getting out of a loop battle is to STOP LOOPING. Arc out of it.
 
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Abomination

A
Flimley said:
There are some strange things happening. And very different accounts given. I'm finding shields are not what they used to be, unless it's my imagination.
Flimley.
Click to expand...
No it's not just your imagination.
These new npc's are real devils allright.
Could be mass hysteria, hallucination, delusions, toxication or a combination of these five though.
(I know I've got all of them right now [wacky])
 

jgm

jgm
GluttonyFang said:
God forbid there's actual dog fighting now rather than reverse throttle tanking...
Click to expand...

Actually reverse throttle tanking is about the best way of dealing with the smaller ships if you're in a 'conda or similar. Once you've found the holes in the new AI it isn't significantly scarier than the old one, at least 1v1. 1v2 or 1v3 with the right opponents there is no choice but to run.
 

carniak

C
There are a few things I've noticed with the new combat AI and the gearing on the AI ships, especially in combat zones.

First, it is folly to attempt most combat zones with anything other than a purpose built combat ship. This means that very few multipurpose ships (i.e. Cobra's) are suited for combat.

Second, if you are stuck in a turn battle with another combat ship, it may be a better idea to switch targets to something slower. Let the other combat ships take care of the ones on your tail, while you focus on dodging and using hit-run tactics against larger ships.
 

joshman72nd

joshman72nd
boost in striaght line flight assist off then start turning..... also if your in a fat ship python, conda, corvett, cutter then pack turrets on all hard points class two and one.... energy preferred since they tend to miss when you or ai start a turn.
 

jgm

jgm
joshman72nd said:
boost in striaght line flight assist off then start turning..... also if your in a fat ship python, conda, corvett, cutter then pack turrets on all hard points class two and one.... energy preferred since they tend to miss when you or ai start a turn.
Click to expand...

Also, be aware of where your turrets are. If you're in a conda, for example your class 1 hardpoints are on the underneath of the ship so pitch down after boosting away, as that gives your turrets more time to lock on to their target and get some shots off.
 

Sylow

Sylow
GluttonyFang said:
God forbid there's actual dog fighting now rather than reverse throttle tanking...
Click to expand...

Uh, what? I use an iCourier and since the patch i started using reverse. Never needed that before, but now it seems to be essential.

To clarify: flight assist off and turning around, so you effectively fly reverse, i see as much as reverse fighting as just applying reverse speed. It results in the same situation, two ships facing each other, trading fire. No dogfighting in my eyes.
 
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GluttonyFang

GluttonyFang
Sylow said:
Uh, what? I use an iCourier and since the patch i started using reverse. Never needed that before, but now it seems to be essential.

To clarify: flight assist off and turning around, so you effectively fly reverse, i see as much as reverse fighting as just applying reverse speed. It results in the same situation, two ships facing each other, trading fire. No dogfighting in my eyes.
Click to expand...

What I mean by reverse throttle is keeping flight assist on and keep reversing in a relative straight line.
 

ShimEnki

ShimEnki
AluminumAlloy said:
I'm not sure if this is a new standard for minimal/low-difficulty NPC's during combat, but I was doing bounty hunting today and encountered multiple harmless, mostly harmless and novice NPC's in Adders and Sidewinders that weren't really equipped for combat, judging by scanning their hard-points and other ship mounts. Sounded like easy cash for me, so I blasted out some laser beams on their ships, until out of the blue it seemed that all of them went insta-Elite and managed to get behind my ship in less than seconds.

I almost got blown up by these low-skilled ships, no matter which one I encountered, it was like once they were behind me they were behind me for eternity. Despite doing all the tricks in the universe to switch in Flight Assist Off and do the quickest flips, I couldn't see one pixel of their ship appearing on my screen; they were stuck behind me and according to my radar, the red triangles wound't move off one little bit as if we were both attached to a hard stick. Generally i'm quite good in combat against highly-skilled NPC's but ever since the new update came in it seems that there's literally no chance for me to make them move a single inch away from my tail with even the dumbest NPC's?
Click to expand...

They are using crazy cheat coding now and everyone now knows it.
 

Windscreen Smudge

W
Let me guess, you were flying a fat Large class ship and expecting to have the same turn rate as a ship 1/10th your size that isn't carrying any useless weight?

Yeah, that's going to be a problem for ya.

I'm so glad 2.1 hit the player base like a half-brick between the eyes. People are actually going to have to learn how to play the game now.
 

joshman72nd

joshman72nd
Windscreen Smudge said:
Let me guess, you were flying a fat Large class ship and expecting to have the same turn rate as a ship 1/10th your size that isn't carrying any useless weight?

Yeah, that's going to be a problem for ya.

I'm so glad 2.1 hit the player base like a half-brick between the eyes. People are actually going to have to learn how to play the game now.
Click to expand...


ya however im pretty sure it also has something to do with the smallest ships in the game are able to take class 4 weapons to the face when shields are down and come out saying https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kx-S1BEMh0s skip to 30 seconds in.
 

Karl Marx

Karl Marx
GluttonyFang said:
God forbid there's actual dog fighting now rather than reverse throttle tanking...
Click to expand...

That's exactly what we have now actually. Reverse throttle tanking, because they can circle you so damned fast that the only option you really have in a ship of FDL or higher class is to reverse that throttle and start doing the same thing to the NPC, while being pounded in the face the entire time.

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Windscreen Smudge said:
Let me guess, you were flying a fat Large class ship and expecting to have the same turn rate as a ship 1/10th your size that isn't carrying any useless weight?

Yeah, that's going to be a problem for ya.

I'm so glad 2.1 hit the player base like a half-brick between the eyes. People are actually going to have to learn how to play the game now.
Click to expand...

Oh get off your arrogant high chair, buddy. The AI is broken. Period. If it can do things better than the vast majority of the player-base while being more efficient, responsive, and accurate while also having better weapons, thrusters, and other equipment, it's broken. Take your "git gud" nonsense and shove it.
 
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Karl Marx

Karl Marx
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