Don't we WANT to support the devs RIGHT NOW?

[OriginalBadBoy]

It's not removing support for A bad decision, it's removing support for THE LATEST bad decision, and more so for the arrogance of either dead silence from FDev in the face of mounting outrage or concern or at best coming out to say they're refusing to consider the outrage and concerns. Not to mention interviews where they say things like they "don't care" that 80% of the playerbase disagree with them.

This isn't something new, this is something that's been around since day 1.

If - as you seem to think - they are doing a great job and making good calls - the number of customer purchases will support you and the people upset and leaving won't matter. If it DOES matter, it was definitively the wrong call. Remember also, it's cheaper to keep existing customers than to get new ones, and even more expensive to get old customers to come back.

Your assuming a large proportion of the player base are in uproar over this. I see no evidence of that. You are talking about a very vocal minority of people that are adamant that FD have ruined 'their game' and losing their **** over it. These types of 'sky is falling' posts are pathetic, immature and in all honesty not surprising one bit for a gaming forum.

Do any of us have the game WE wanted .. Nope .. that includes me. Am I going to get myself into such an uncontrollable emotional state over that I cant think straight anymore, declaring that I am no longer supporting FD over this? Nope ... Because in the end thats not going to help.

ED is not perfect, far from it, but its still an Elite game regardless and a decent one at that.

I would love to see how many hours some of these people have put into the game from day 1 who thinks its so bad. I can guarantee with the majority of people its at least in the hundreds if not thousands with some.

 

[MadDogMurdock]

Quite. I would very much like more logic and consistency. However that doesn't always bear out in great mechanics. As they say, preaching to converted. I have lost count of the numbers of times religious or emotional debates rage on and I'm thinking 'logic would sort this but neither camp will accept it', so here we are.

It's a fine line between realism, and redundancy.

A fine line indeed, and when in doubt the deciding factor should be whether it fits with the 'ethos'.
It's no coincidence that some of the most heavily criticized elements of ED are the ones that seem to contradict it.

Powerplay being a turn-based strategy game.
Engineers seemingly having no idea how their mods will turn out.
Ship Transfers happening instantly.

Even remote Telepresence for fighters is a bit jarring with the 'space pilot' ethos.

I'm more concerned that the decision to 'skip' gameplay now sets a precedent and that will be the default option instead of improving it.

 

[Geist]

David Braben gave a lovely speech about the importance Science and Realism, so I felt charmed to buy some paint jobs and ship kits. The very next moment Sandro announced teleportation and a wonky overwrite of the broken jump range imbalance. To be 100% honest, I felt a bit cheated, and even lied to. I worked my tail off for two solid weeks to engineer every mod on my FDL to get it to 20 LY. Now that grind is irrelevant. My FDL is built for a galaxy that doesn't exist anymore.

This game requires a lot of time already. How can I trust investing and pouring my free hours and weeks in the game if they keep changing the rules?

This is sort of how I feel about the situation. And the reason I feel so strongly is because this is by far my favourite game - I have been playing since beta and despite the coming changes don't plan to quit, but my enjoyment is affected by the changes that happen. The type of changes that happen, I sort of expected during the beta phase but it really feels like that goal posts keep changing. I understand that attracting new players is important but making what feel like heavy handed gameplay changes is in my opinion a little unfair to those who have supported the game for so long.

But yes I do support the Devs in that I am grateful for the hard work they put in.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

I knew StarWars Galaxies NGE would come up at some point ... I was thinking about that earlier today.

This is nothing like that situation ... absolutely nothing.

mechwarrior online however i think is a valid comparison..... albeit FD have not sunk quite so low yet (tho the way things are now, if i had to bet my own cash i am not sure i would like to be against 3rd person view coming at some point).

a bit of language warning - the worst bleeped out - but this is kind of how i felt when i 1st learned about teleportation, esp when extrapolated to what it may mean for 2.3 and beyond.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7E1E1Wc0s8o

 

[lysan]

Criticism, if constructive,
is support.

There are tons of constructive posts, giving alternatives,
again it feels like we are being tutored to be "silent stupid,
you don't know what you ask for".
That might apply on some "features",
but we as the players are a part of the game,
we need to be happy with it.

*We just don't know game development
internal joke

 

[Vasious]

David Braben gave a lovely speech about the importance Science and Realism, so I felt charmed to buy some paint jobs and ship kits. The very next moment Sandro announced teleportation and a wonky overwrite of the broken jump range imbalance. To be 100% honest, I felt a bit cheated, and even lied to. I worked my tail off for two solid weeks to engineer every mod on my FDL to get it to 20 LY. Now that grind is irrelevant. My FDL is built for a galaxy that doesn't exist anymore.

This game requires a lot of time already. How can I trust investing and pouring my free hours and weeks in the game if they keep changing the rules?

You can only Transfer ships to other shipyard.
So if where you are going doesn't have a ship yard, say like the Pleiades, you will be flying that 20 Light Year FSD fitted FDL and it wont feel like at waste of time then

 

[Sandmann]

The best way to support a game is buying a game and bringing new players.

Just do sometimes a gifts to Your friends.

http://i.imgur.com/QU0Kf6F.png

More players, more money, less irracional decisions (like insta transfer) to bring casuals.

Hmm no. I'm not going to recommend a game I no longer support or want to play.

And that's the thing, they're not only endangering further purchases from 80% of their existing customers, they're also losing the recommendations they'd make to their friends. Word of mouth is known as the most powerful form of advertisement, they're standing to gain MORE negative word of mouth and lose the support of a large portion of their greatest fans.

 

[Vasious]

Then buy an ED skin ... actions always trump words.

Will when the SRV ones are in store

 

[Sandmann]

We haven't even got all details about the updates yet. How people can complain so much is beyond me.

There's only one detail we're complaining about - the same one Sandro said he didn't care that we were complaining about. Bad planning AND arrogance.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Your assuming a large proportion of the player base are in uproar over this. I see no evidence of that. You are talking about a very vocal minority of people that are adamant that FD have ruined 'their game' and losing their **** over it. These types of 'sky is falling' posts are pathetic, immature and in all honesty not surprising one bit for a gaming forum.

Do any of us have the game WE wanted .. Nope .. that includes me. Am I going to get myself into such an uncontrollable emotional state over that I cant think straight anymore, declaring that I am no longer supporting FD over this? Nope ... Because in the end thats not going to help.

ED is not perfect, far from it, but its still an Elite game regardless and a decent one at that.

I would love to see how many hours some of these people have put into the game from day 1 who thinks its so bad. I can guarantee with the majority of people its at least in the hundreds if not thousands with some.

As a shareholder tho OBB it is fair to say you are hardly objective on this.. I have hesitated on mentioning this in the past but seeing as you are happy to call the naysayers pathetic i think a bit of a reality check on your own part is needed as well...

simplifying the game in the interests of accessibility is exactly what devs will do if they want their game to be mainstream and bring in loads of sales.. and this is fine so long as it does not go against what the CEO is selling..... so i guess as a shareholder big sales, even if at the expense of the "heart / soul of the game" for want of a better term, is probably in your interests so just keep in mind when calling those who feel the core of the game is about to be broken pathetic or childish, perhaps you are not the most impartial to judge that this is not the case and we are wrong..

please dont take this the wrong way, i am not trying to be offensive. there is nowt wrong with being a shareholder and i wish you luck!.

 

[CMDR Aengus]

Want control?
Want a say?
Want to influence future direction?
Push for a subscription model.
Problem solved.
Otherwise, it's all just candy floss and capitalism.

 

[Cosmos]

David Braben gave a lovely speech about the importance Science and Realism, so I felt charmed to buy some paint jobs and ship kits. The very next moment Sandro announced teleportation and a wonky overwrite of the broken jump range imbalance. To be 100% honest, I felt a bit cheated, and even lied to. I worked my tail off for two solid weeks to engineer every mod on my FDL to get it to 20 LY. Now that grind is irrelevant. My FDL is built for a galaxy that doesn't exist anymore.

This game requires a lot of time already. How can I trust investing and pouring my free hours and weeks in the game if they keep changing the rules?

Sometimes I really wonder whats going on within Frontier. They get somethings super awesome and then go and undermine it with really poor choices. This insta teleport nonesense is just balmy, but hey if they want to ruin their game I suppose thats up to them. Its painful to watch at times.

 

[OriginalBadBoy]

but this is kind of how i felt when i 1st learned about teleportation, esp when extrapolated to what it may mean for 2.3 and beyond.

I assume you are talking about multicrew and player teleportation? You do realise for that part of the game to work effectively player teleportation will have to be a thing. I cant see how ts going to work any other way, so you should get used to the idea. Besides it wont be teleportation anyway, once you have finished doing your multicrew stuff you will get dumped back to where you came from. Its not going to affect me as multicrew isnt something I will be using anyway. But yeah get used to the idea as it will be a thing. And I am sure again there will be 'uproar' on the forums over that as well, from people who will probably never use it, or worse from people that will.

 

[Kigre]

I must not have gone to school... whats C&P?

 

[Sandmann]

Oh please ...

I mean seriously get off your high horse, its pathetic.

We were sold a bunch of promises, and we're getting something different. For a lot of us this is about bringing back something that we care about. It's not "being on a high horse" to be upset about large changes of direction, arrogance, and broken promises.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

Your assuming a large proportion of the player base are in uproar over this. I see no evidence of that. You are talking about a very vocal minority of people that are adamant that FD have ruined 'their game' and losing their **** over it. These types of 'sky is falling' posts are pathetic, immature and in all honesty not surprising one bit for a gaming forum.

If you "see no evidence of this" then you're seriously not looking... eyes wide shut.

Oh and seriously? Insulting people for disagreeing with you doesn't make you any less wrong, it just makes you rude and unable to form a coherent argument,.

 

[OriginalBadBoy]

As a shareholder tho OBB it is fair to say you are hardly objective on this...

I am more objective than most people here thats for sure ....

I make no apologies for being a shareholder (only a very small one btw), and I have been just as critical about FD as anyone else has in the past. I even sent a PM to Sandro when the ship transfer was first announced asking him if he really thought that was a good idea.

Im not calling naysayers pathetic, I am calling those who go the extra mile with the whole 'sky is falling' routine. Nothing wrong with having an opinion , but if this is what FD have decided to do then people should accept that and move past it. If I didnt agree with everything that FD have done so far to that level of vitrol hatred that you see here sometimes I would have never have backed the game in the first place.

Its about having a reasonable, level headiness about these sorts of things rather than getting so emotionally invested that people cant think straight.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

I assume you are talking about multicrew and player teleportation? You do realise for that part of the game to work effectively player teleportation will have to be a thing. I cant see how ts going to work any other way, so you should get used to the idea. Besides it wont be teleportation anyway, once you have finished doing your multicrew stuff you will get dumped back to where you came from. Its not going to affect me as multicrew isnt something I will be using anyway. But yeah get used to the idea as it will be a thing. And I am sure again there will be 'uproar' on the forums over that as well, from people who will probably never use it, or worse from people that will.

it doesnt have to be tho.... if another ship is in the same area then you COULD have your cmdr in your mates ship... if not then your CMDR stays where they are and you contol an npc crew member and level that member up for your mate(but get no cash for your CMDR as (s)he is not there....... job done, no loss in integrity, AND adds cool mechanics for everyone not just multicrew players (npc crew)

i have not given up the hope, esp now 2.2 fighter crew are actually a thing - that this is how they will go.

I make no apologies for being a shareholder (only a very small one btw),

and neither should you! I considered it myself back in the day and essentially decided i could not risk it as i was only just paying the bills at the time. As i said I mean no offence was just pointing out that, much like if an English footie fan puts a bet on Germany to win the world cup, they may be slightly torn in an England/Germany Final

 

[OriginalBadBoy]

If you "see no evidence of this" then you're seriously not looking... eyes wide shut.
.

Read the post , no evidence of a large proportion of the player base.

Regarding the rest that wasn't aimed at you personally, so don't take it as such. I have always found your posts to at least be reasonable and well thought out, sadly not everyone is like that.

 

[VR jefranklin18]

As critical (whiney) as I have been and still am of the game, the fact is it's still unfinished. Substantially so. For me, the parts of the game that I've always wanted to see are still to come, be that in the near future (passengers) or an unknown point in the future (landing on inhabited planets). Do I enjoy things like Powerplay, Engineers, Wings, landing on various rocks etc? Nope. They're wholly uninteresting to what I want from the game and so the playability remains essentially unchanged from way back. I only ever wanted Frontier updated to today's sound and graphics, and ED seems to be getting there, just not in the order I want.

I think the devs deserve our support, that they've earned it even if they haven't provided the things I want yet. The more time passes, the more I'm confident they will... eventually.

Fully agree with you, +1'd

I am also pretty much of the same opinion:

• I have winged up a couple of times with the one person in my social circle that has ED (interestingly never had any problems despite many claiming "it is still broken"
• I have not touched PowerPlay at all - it looks interesting, and my above-mentioned friend is a keen player of it. He is also a former Eve player, so maybe there is something about PowerPlay that appeals to that group?
• Played with engineers in beta and it didn't seem as bad as the hate it seems to generate. I understand the thought process behind the "random number generation" as when over-tuning a vehicle, there can be an element of luck. I think the moving bars during the tuning process does draw attention to this random element, and it may have been better to have avoided these completely.

I do however do enjoy planetary landings (even though I have lost far too many ships due crashing on a high G planet). But, I would not have ED without any of those above features (or indeed the upcoming ship insta-transfer). Why? Because that is the game that Frontier want to deliver, and while I do not agree with all their decisions, I will support them and the game as it is the game that has evolved from the 1984 version.

 

[OriginalBadBoy]

it doesnt have to be tho.... if another ship is in the same area then you COULD have your cmdr in your mates ship... if not then your CMDR stays where they are and you contol an npc crew member and level that member up for your mate(but get no cash for your CMDR as (s)he is not there....... job done, no loss in integrity, AND adds cool mechanics for everyone not just multicrew players (npc crew)

i have not given up the hope, esp now 2.2 fighter crew are actually a thing - that this is how they will go.

Yeah fine .. That could be a way of explaining it as well ... Of course the issue with that is the player you would want to join would have to have crew compartments for that to work , which would limit the ships you could do it with.

See thats the point, you have come upo with an alternative solution that might work , whereas others will just lose it and think that FD are catering to the casuals.