The Star Citizen Thread v5

[Skizomeuh]

The confrontation between humans and vanduul-aliens is stylised through a visually clear distinction of technology and lifeworlds, and the backgroundstory (that mostly focuses on military and political organization a lot).

Basically Starship Troopers without the satire and self-awareness. I won't be surprised if CR and pal didn't perceive the subversive sub-text of this movie.

 

[Stigbob]

<snippy snip>Horrible.

What would you suggest to fix these game-breaking problems.

 

[Vasea Azure]

As I said I played PTU 2.6 a bit yesterday but couldnt get through configuring all the ship controls so I cant really comment on flight model. In PTU all ships are available at the moment so if anyone tested some of them please leave your comment.

 

[McGlashan]

I would wait until there's more to the game than shooting at anonymous spaceships before worrying about the connotations of the alien race that's not actually inside them yet. There will be plenty of material to work with once the quality Roberts storyline and cutscenes start being implemented, don't you worry.

 

[Necronaught]

Warming up the point of implicit racism and western centeredness in Star Citizen. I just checked out the trailer for this new purchaseable virtual item that looks like a flying bone: https://imperium.news/star-citizen-community-frustration-boils-embarrassing-livestream/ The trailer ends with one of those iconographic images of a primitive standing on a rock holding a torch-like thing in his/her hand which made me think.

The confrontation between humans and vanduul-aliens is stylised through a visually clear distinction of technology and lifeworlds, and the backgroundstory (that mostly focuses on military and political organization a lot). Think about it:

humans
x white dudes
x technical, cool high-tech look, symmetrical
x civilized, calculated violence, socially and technologically advanced
x peaceful (strive for peace), war is legitimate when threatened, diplomacy favoured
x large scale political organization
x mostly attractive people

vanduul
x animal-like/non-human
x organically looking technologies, asymmetrical (asymmetry seems to suggest a more 'natural' and chaotic look)
x uncivilized, brutal, primitive, culture-less
x aggressive, brutal, diplomacy rejected
x clustered political organization (political negotations practically impossible): "There is little to no communication between the different roaming clans. Each fleet operates as its own society with its own independent set of rules, laws and customs as decreed by that clan’s chieftain. As such, it is probably impossible to make peace or establish diplomatic relations with the Vanduul as a whole since there is no cohesive civilization." (http://starcitizen.wikia.com/wiki/Vanduul)
x ugly, aggressive looking aliens


The depiction of the Vanduul consists of a best-of-primitive-alien-stereotypes. They have these traditional weapons resembling spears or other 'primitive weapons' (they represent their cultural backwardness), similar to the Klingons in Star Trek. Their techology does look very organic, definitely distinct from the high-tech look of the human technology. So it does transport a closer connection to nature on a visual level and also incorporates stylistic elements that remind of feathers, skin and bone-structures.

Their political system is unable to ngeotiate peace on a bigger scale, it is basically said to be not compatible with the implicitly advanced system of the humans. In other words, war against them is inevitable and justified, because you can't talk with these guys (even more so because they attacked first). You have to show them the hard way how to live peaceful together (white mans burden anyone?).

It doesn't require a lot of imagination to see cornerstones of colonial depictions of non-western cultures here. It is made very obvious were the 'inspiration' comes from when you look at this textpiece from their wiki that makes a direct reference to anthropological studies of the 20th century, often strongly connected to colonial rule: "From a purely anthropological perspective, the Vanduul behave like classic hunter-gatherers."

I know about all this pseudo-deep background of the story being an analogy to the fall of rome etc, but seriously, that is not only a completely unimaginative setting, but also an offensive one in my view that transports and transports colonial-racist stereotypes against so-called non-western cultures. If there should be a game one day it will probably be a horrible continuation of this stuff, clear traces could already be seen in the Wing Commander games and probably mirrors Chris Roberts mindset to favour arranging stereotypes to tell a story. And the most easily accessible and popular stereotypes are on the base of gender and race, so he just bakes a story out of that. Horrible.

Basing in game assets on a culture is not racism. Have you ever heard of imitation is the highest form of flattery?

Merry Christmas may the lord bless you and yours this season Happy Hanukkah as well, since it coincides with Christmas this year. Going out to the Jewish massive.

 

[Dooguk]

It doesn't require a lot of imagination..............

Chris Roberts is the correct answer. [up]

 

[metatheurgist]

I remember someone in an earlier Star Citizen thread saying that FD were CHEATING by only announcing releases when they knew they could meet the deadline !

Well, FD obviously don't under....

 

[Tuub t Tute]

Well, FD obviously don't under....

deliver...

 

[Neo-ST]

Just wonderful, puts me in a mind to start celebrating how much money we've given the local supermarket this year woohoo!!

My pic is a bit different to your one though.

https://i.imgur.com/rqDepA1.png

LOL...
Owned

 

[ianw]

Spoiler

Warming up the point of implicit racism and western centeredness in Star Citizen. I just checked out the trailer for this new purchaseable virtual item that looks like a flying bone: https://imperium.news/star-citizen-community-frustration-boils-embarrassing-livestream/ The trailer ends with one of those iconographic images of a primitive standing on a rock holding a torch-like thing in his/her hand which made me think.

The confrontation between humans and vanduul-aliens is stylised through a visually clear distinction of technology and lifeworlds, and the backgroundstory (that mostly focuses on military and political organization a lot). Think about it:

humans
x white dudes
x technical, cool high-tech look, symmetrical
x civilized, calculated violence, socially and technologically advanced
x peaceful (strive for peace), war is legitimate when threatened, diplomacy favoured
x large scale political organization
x mostly attractive people

vanduul
x animal-like/non-human
x organically looking technologies, asymmetrical (asymmetry seems to suggest a more 'natural' and chaotic look)
x uncivilized, brutal, primitive, culture-less
x aggressive, brutal, diplomacy rejected
x clustered political organization (political negotations practically impossible): "There is little to no communication between the different roaming clans. Each fleet operates as its own society with its own independent set of rules, laws and customs as decreed by that clan’s chieftain. As such, it is probably impossible to make peace or establish diplomatic relations with the Vanduul as a whole since there is no cohesive civilization." (http://starcitizen.wikia.com/wiki/Vanduul)
x ugly, aggressive looking aliens


The depiction of the Vanduul consists of a best-of-primitive-alien-stereotypes. They have these traditional weapons resembling spears or other 'primitive weapons' (they represent their cultural backwardness), similar to the Klingons in Star Trek. Their techology does look very organic, definitely distinct from the high-tech look of the human technology. So it does transport a closer connection to nature on a visual level and also incorporates stylistic elements that remind of feathers, skin and bone-structures.

Their political system is unable to ngeotiate peace on a bigger scale, it is basically said to be not compatible with the implicitly advanced system of the humans. In other words, war against them is inevitable and justified, because you can't talk with these guys (even more so because they attacked first). You have to show them the hard way how to live peaceful together (white mans burden anyone?).

It doesn't require a lot of imagination to see cornerstones of colonial depictions of non-western cultures here. It is made very obvious were the 'inspiration' comes from when you look at this textpiece from their wiki that makes a direct reference to anthropological studies of the 20th century, often strongly connected to colonial rule: "From a purely anthropological perspective, the Vanduul behave like classic hunter-gatherers."

I know about all this pseudo-deep background of the story being an analogy to the fall of rome etc, but seriously, that is not only a completely unimaginative setting, but also an offensive one in my view that transports and transports colonial-racist stereotypes against so-called non-western cultures. If there should be a game one day it will probably be a horrible continuation of this stuff, clear traces could already be seen in the Wing Commander games and probably mirrors Chris Roberts mindset to favour arranging stereotypes to tell a story. And the most easily accessible and popular stereotypes are on the base of gender and race, so he just bakes a story out of that. Horrible.

Yeah - but on the other hand - who doesn't want to chin an alien whilst chomping on a ceeegar!

Spoiler

[video=youtube;OfPWpEKhgfk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OfPWpEKhgfk[/video]

 

[AlPilg]

All the real terrible things that go on in the world, and someone worries about gender representation in video games. Seriously, that's a very privelged position to be in, telling us mere mortals the truth. Could be young though so that sort of gets a get out of jail card, good times being young and idealistic!

 

[frostypaw]

All the real terrible things that go on in the world, and someone worries about gender representation in video games. Seriously, that's a very privelged position to be in, telling us mere mortals the truth. Could be young though so that sort of gets a get out of jail card, good times being young and idealistic!

This thread has taken a somewhat unpleasant turn ever since any mention of SC's lack of gender parity and hypermasculine nonsense has been brought up.

It's not needed folks. You might not agree with the things other people are bothered about but please refrain from belittling them and telling them their opinion and point are worthless. Feel free to just not comment

 

[AlPilg]

This thread has taken a somewhat unpleasant turn ever since any mention of SC's lack of gender parity and hypermasculine nonsense has been brought up.

It's not needed folks. You might not agree with the things other people are bothered about but please refrain from belittling them and telling them their opinion and point are worthless. Feel free to just not comment

Seriously? I said it's cool to be young and naive.

 

[dayrth]

This thread has taken a somewhat unpleasant turn ever since any mention of SC's lack of gender parity and hypermasculine nonsense has been brought up.

It's not needed folks. You might not agree with the things other people are bothered about but please refrain from belittling them and telling them their opinion and point are worthless. Feel free to just not comment

Really wanted to rep that, but can't

 

[Necronaught]

Seriously? I said it's cool to be young and naive.

You are wasting your time with the perpetually offended. When I was protesting it was against the National Front and Fox Hunting. Kids these days worry about pronouns and the representation of minorities. I fear for the future of not only Star Citizen but for the youth as well.

 

[AlPilg]

This issue should go in a seperate thread anyway and not serve as a distraction from the problems that this game has. There is a problem here in this sideways discussion that I have identified but it would be lengthy, I'd have to prepare it to be bulletproof and to be honest I can't be bothered.

 

[frostypaw]

Seriously? I said it's cool to be young and naive.

AH so that's ok - "I'll assume that you said the stupid dumb thing that i'm belittling you for because you're young and naive". Lucky you didn't say it was a silly privileged person's problem (therefore not one for REAL people, just those toffs) and you didn't make any jabs implying assumed superiority ("mere mortals the truth")

Maybe I should find what you've said forgivable because of some patronising judgements I'll ad-lib about you?

If you can't see what's rude about your post then I'd recommend a long slow think about it and ask some people IRL. This isn't the thread to explain it

 

[ianw]

This is why many people consider that politics, religion and other obviously polarising topics are not really suitable for casual conversation amongst strangers - particulalry behind the anonymity of the internet.

Anyway - it's nearly knocking off/beer time here - err, yay!

 

[AlPilg]

AH so that's ok - "I'll assume that you said the stupid dumb thing that i'm belittling you for because you're young and naive". Lucky you didn't say it was a silly privileged person's problem (therefore not one for REAL people, just those toffs) and you didn't make any jabs implying assumed superiority ("mere mortals the truth")

Maybe I should find what you've said forgivable because of some patronising judgements I'll ad-lib about you?

If you can't see what's rude about your post then I'd recommend a long slow think about it and ask some people IRL. This isn't the thread to explain it

I didn't say Toffs, I was inferring a western lifestyle, it wasn't my intention to be rude. I'm not a disrespectful person in general, have my moments though.

 

[Britney]

It is funny to hear in a thread about a videogame to be wasting my time by thinking about sexist and racist stereotypes while the essence of videogaming is wasting time in the first place. Since the advent of the internet time wasting through videogames got another layer by being able to waste even more time by talking about the activity to waste time with other time wasters. So alone in this thread you have the same handful of positions and arguments discussed over and over again since how many years? So I don't really understand the point in this regard.

But probably discussing the stereotypes is not entertaining enough for everybody, even more as they are so widespread that it is not only about Star Citizen anymore, but touches many of those games we all love. What a pity! Yes, all these games are horrible, many are racist, sexist and classist fantasies created by middle-class white guys dreaming about adventures but spending their lives in sterile suburbs and boring offices in front of computer screens. Star Citizen is just one extreme case of that bigger picture, a very amusing one too. That is why I am here. Although imagine myself to fight for a better world and starting that in a thread about mocking Star Citizen sounds pretty awesome. Maybe I should give it a try. Cheers.