That's basically what happens now, because it's not fun to fight. A wing should not be invincible in this game because that is inherently unbalanced, which is why we're asking for a fix.
SDC Presents: Operation Healies4Feelies
- Thread starter Rinzler o7o7o7
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That's basically what happens now, because it's not fun to fight. A wing should not be invincible in this game because that is inherently unbalanced, which is why we're asking for a fix.
BUT THEIR FEELINGS!
it was an EXAMPLE, because people were referring to 'massive' battles? it was entirely and totally taken out of the air, the main point was not the number of players, but you know, everything else I talked about.
See that's the thing, should it? shouldn't it? when should it happen?
I will gladly agree that one huge healing beam being able to keep up with the full assault of say a corvette/conda or such seems a bit lopsided, especially if the ship healed can keep fighting, but again, then the healer would be vulnerable, the problem obvious comes when you get multiple healers, but......yeah, honestly this has happened in many games, healer teams have always been annoying as heck. So I honestly can't say it is a 'problem', but it does sound as if healing with huge beam might need a scaling of sort, but again, it needs to be done in such a way that healing doesn't become pointless, I'd go as far as saying that if all the MJ damage a ship can turn out was turned directly into healing shield, it should only be 'that' damage, and since a corvette has more overall damage then an in this case FDL, a full FDL healer should not be able to heal the full brunt of a corvette?
Deleted member 115407
D
You don't think it's a problem because you don't run into it. When there is literally no downside to using a healing beam, there is something wrong with that.
It'd be fine if it was just "annoying" to fight. It was that way for a while when people had dedicated support couriers that would strafe with heals. It was annoying, but if you had the right tactics, it could be beaten. The problem is when you have 4 ships each with a huge healing beam, because it cannot be fought, and a situation like that should not happen in a balanced game.
My ideal solution is to use the healing beams like a siphon. The healed ship gets MJ from the healing ship. That way, there is a fixed health pool, and the healing ship is vulnerable when they're healing.
And how, exactly do you "tank" that much damage, and "dish out" that much damage?
Pretty sure this requires things like Armor Mods, Shield and Booster Mods, and Weapon Mods.. G5 with whatever happens to be the most advantageous effects. And pretty sure you're wanting the benefits at the highest possible levels, and the penalties at the lowest possible levels. So, yeah, min-maxing to the extreme.
If your EXAMPLE is BAD your argument is BAD.
Size doesn't matter. 1 healing ship projects exponentially more force than 1 DPS ship. 2 healing ships not only project more force, but they do so indefinitely. If for every 1 ship you bring to the fight I have to bring 15 to compete there is a problem. If my only solution is to copy your tactics until we reach the maximum number of ships that can possibly be in one space, which only results in a 30 minute stalemate while we fly in circles around each other because positioning changes by the literal second, what was achieved?
Self-repping healers is something that most games have to actively put special mechanics in to counter and avoid abuse. FDev not only failed to do this, but failed to make healing work like everything else in the game.
Broken is broken, stop trying to defend a broken mechanic.
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NOT REALLY, it's been reported since BETA. 2.3 (where the efficient beam came out...)
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/314823-Regeneration-Sequence-nerf-needed
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I'm about to give up on trying to suggest an idea on this thread because it just gets ignored, but if you want too have a look it's >HERE< (healing beam with downsides)
It is only 'that' damage. Regeneration sequence delivers the full standard damage of the weapon as shield regeneration to a wingmans shields. However, your shields don't resist regeneration (why would they?). They do resist hostile fire.
If I take a fully engineered resist build (and they are fully engineered resist builds), I have ~60% damage resistance to thermal/kinetic/explosive, then another 58% on top of that from 4 pips to SYS. This means that while I take 100% of incoming regeneration damage as regeneration, I only take (0.4*0.42) ~17% of hostile damage as damage. So, as I mentioned several posts ago, each MJ of healing can counter 4-5MJ of damage.
It only takes a couple of regeneration sequence weapons to match the shield restoration rate of the largest SCBs.
A two person FDL wing can heal each other with turrets faster than spamming A5 SCBs will while both can still fire fixed weapons at their opponents. And unlike SCBs, you can't cascade rail through regeneration sequence.
Your suggestion would add more depth to regeneration effects, but it would also increase complexity and difficulty in employing them.
I wouldn't be opposed to it, but it would do less to balance the effect vs. just reducing the magnitude of it.
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With the way you phrased it, you're implying that PvEers don't do the exact same thing. Some people take it to the logical extreme of doing 300 rolls for dirty drives to get the best possible outcome, but most don't.
PvEers just min-max with different end-goals in mind.
Sole Hunter
Banned
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
I was about to make a snarky comment to yet another SDC "controversy" post, but if this is true (and I don't doubt that it is) then you're making a very fair point. That's definitely messed up.
YES, PVErs mostly go for the best to make money, while PvP does the best to win battles... since the NPC is a joke even on non engineered ships...
1: Example is irrelevant, look at what I wrote.
2: again, huge is just another example, look at what I wrote, I'm pointing to the fact that MJ healed should related to their MJ damage, and since an FDL can't outdamage an corvette it shouldn't be able to out heal one either...
3: self-repping healers, have not been countered in a lot of games, so no FDev didn't 'fail', they put in something, which is like most things as patches have proven, under constant change, just like....all the games that have had self-repping healers 'fixed' tey didn't do it in one swoop, or have it initially, they implemented healing in one way, found unintended consequences, dealt with them.......same thing here?
4: Its not broken, you do not know what broken is, it renders some pvp scenario's non-viable, that's what is called a bug. Broken things, you know, break things, can you PvP still? sure you can as long as you don't meet this scenario. thus PvP isn't broken, not even if everyone decides to use it, it isn't broken, it just means honestly? that people aren't interested in actual PvP in my book, and are more interested in 'winning' and thus they place themselves so they can't lose, again, that isn't broken, that's a bug, one that should definitely be fixed yes, but hardly broken, since players 'can' if they want to avoid the issue, so no, I am not defending it, read what I actually wrote?
Sole Hunter
Banned
OMG someone that actually understand, a rare sight.
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If you go by communities, any game community, most games would be 'better off' with one type of weapon and one type of attack, because the moment you add a second people will complain, and we end up with the whole "this is why we can't have nice things" perfect balance is near impossible and people are more then eager to find and abuse the heck out of something that can be abused, because they want to 'win', and at least in my book, when you do that, what is the point of PvP? same if a wing of people interdict and kill a single person, what is the point? 4v1 wins? yay? I honestly would hope so, if they do not then they have a serious problem.
"PvP" as a concept has become insanely competitive and 'losing' is seen almost as a taboo if you look at the various PvP related games around, which is just........sad. More important to strut about and win then you know, having an engaging, challenging and fun battle, win or lose, and where the winner doesn't smear it into losers face?
That's called cheating BTW...
I think plenty understand, the problem is, they chose to show this not with their own participants, but by griefing attacking random people, it could easily have been done with willing participants?
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Go watch twitch, I've seen people that are popular because they use aimbot.....clearly in their book, it isn't cheating, as much as I would agree. Abusing something knowingly that gives you an advantage over everyone else, yup, cheating.