Good job frontier! Engineer exploit fixed in 24 hours!

andrak

andrak
Fixing it is one thing. Cleaning up the mess is another. Frontier has 2 choices if the current engineer system is to be taken seriously from now on:

1. Take hard action on exploiters and prove it publicly

2. Remove this placeholder terrible grind fest that is RNGINEERS. Keep the engineers, remove the RNG.

I've not played in around 6 months. Knowing that ganker exploiters are flying around in god roll ships is even more reason not to come back.

Anything less isn't good enough. This is a massive exploit.
 
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Shinji Ikari

Shinji Ikari
Han_Zen said:
FD presents their solution. If it's good and you trust that it removes the cheats, all players you meet are clean.
If FD's solution is inadequate, only players you know and trust should be considered clean.

This is from a tactical perspective of cource. In reality, 99.9% of players are probably clean. If you are not in the latest CG system, Founders or at the US barnacles, it's probably ~100% clean.
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Guilty until proven otherwise is a terrible idea and that's why most countries use the contrary, clean until proven otherwise.
 

[VR] Merkir

[VR] Merkir
Truesilver said:
My preferred solutions, in order of preference:

1. Delete RNGineers in entirety

2. Remove secondaries and cap primary at blueprint published maximum

3. Make all blueprints require only one g1 mat

Items 1 and 2 are not going to happen. Both would be unfair to those who have ground in good faith.

Item 3 could perhaps be the way forwards. It is late in the season. It is not unknown for games companies to grant unlocks when a new season comes out. Nobody would lose anything, except for exclusivity. Everyone could roll using g1 mats for as many modules and ships as they like.

A solution?
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Anything like this would be better than we have right now.
 

[VR] Merkir

[VR] Merkir
Here's another suggested solution which I feel would be very easy for FDev to implement, changing none of the in-game interfaces or engineering gameplay.

Reduce the secondary ranges by a factor of 10. See the diagrams below. Currently, we have max primaries and secondaries that look a bit like this:

|--------------------PRIMARY---------------------->|---------SECONDARY------->|

Fdev could internally scale down ALL existing secondaries on every module in the game, to 10% of their current value (or similar algorithm), resulting in:

|--------------------PRIMARY---------------------->|->|

The random secondary element is still there. PvPers will still min-max. PvP itself will be more skill based, since the uber-god-rolled modules won't be too OP.
 

-Denali-

D
CAPT. Ho Chi Minge said:
Personally id be happy with sliders and the removal of secondary effects , this i think ould be my preffered middle ground where pilots can tailor their own builds exactly how they want.
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You mean you don't think engineers just roll some dice to decide what sort of product they'll make this time? That's nonsense!
 

Gunnet

G
Truesilver said:
Jason has already replied exactly as I would have done:



Exactly this.

My preferred solutions, in order of preference:

1. Delete RNGineers in entirety

2. Remove secondaries and cap primary at blueprint published maximum

3. Make all blueprints require only one g1 mat

Items 1 and 2 are not going to happen. Both would be unfair to those who have ground in good faith.

Item 3 could perhaps be the way forwards. It is late in the season. It is not unknown for games companies to grant unlocks when a new season comes out. Nobody would lose anything, except for exclusivity. Everyone could roll using g1 mats for as many modules and ships as they like.

A solution?
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Already commented on the same thing in another thread. But since this is the current main thread on the topic I'll just pop in to say that, speaking as a strong supporter of engineering, I'm down with #3 as way to nullify the exploit while offering a reasonable compromise between pro- and anti-engineer viewpoints.
 

Bagginhood

B
Then theres whats going to happen. Nothing. Scrubbed from internet. Forum posters might receive a ban. I would've been on these forums too....IF I WASNT MAT COLLECTING FOR MY ROLLS!!!!
 

-Denali-

D
Kurama 1100 said:
I doubt FD would do that, it would outrage way too much people including me.
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I've spent pretty much all of my in game time over the past year engineering. I did that so I could have a fleet of ships that are the best I could make them. If they remove secondaries and make the listed cap the new max then my not optimized ships will have the absolute best results (which is what I put all that time in hoping to achieve anyways). I have a hard time seeing how that's a bad thing for me. Yeah, some people who worked less will have the same advantage. Meh.

The only downside I see to that is there are some parts that I've compromised on because I didn't really need say, that much of a power gain so why not have more heat efficiency?

Sliders, all the way. After this crap'ola they should come through with a better system. I don't care about the time spent if what I get in return is more fun!
 

Shinji Ikari

Shinji Ikari
-Denali- said:
I've spent pretty much all of my in game time over the past year engineering. I did that so I could have a fleet of ships that are the best I could make them. If they remove secondaries and make the listed cap the new max then my not optimized ships will have the absolute best results (which is what I put all that time in hoping to achieve anyways). I have a hard time seeing how that's a bad thing for me. Yeah, some people who worked less will have the same advantage. Meh.

The only downside I see to that is there are some parts that I've compromised on because I didn't really need say, that much of a power gain so why not have more heat efficiency?

Sliders, all the way. After this crap'ola they should come through with a better system. I don't care about the time spent if what I get in return is more fun!
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It would be unfair if they made this change, that would mean that the new players who come after the update would not be able to compete with other CMDR's so if FD ever do this move they should change all modded modules to the listed cap to make it fair.
 

Arthur Shappey

Arthur Shappey
DeRazer said:
Surely Frontier log materials use? And also Ship Stats. It should be straightforward enough to scan databases for instances where Ship Stats changed but #Materials didnt = Exploiters.
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I don't know why we'd assume FDev keeps a log. They might now, but I wouldn't be at all surprised if they have no surefire way of identifying who historically took advantage of the bug.
 

Han_Zen

Han_Zen
Kurama 1100 said:
Guilty until proven otherwise is a terrible idea and that's why most countries use the contrary, clean until proven otherwise.
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That's a good attitude in a legal system or a social setting, but it's not the best idea in a combat situasjon.

Don't worry, your brain will automatically run the 'possible cheat scenario' when faced with a combat situation. It will be in the back of your mind, when you chose to engage or leave. ;)
 

Arthur Shappey

Arthur Shappey
sovapid said:
Apparently it isn't fixed and is even more broken than it was before.
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Uh. The OP didn't state the source for their assertion it was fixed. You haven't stated your source for the opposite - although in lieu of evidence I would side with you.

Is there anyone with any actual facts?
 

Franc Kaos

Franc Kaos
Arthur Shappey said:
Uh. The OP didn't state the source for their assertion it was fixed. You haven't stated your source for the opposite - although in lieu of evidence I would side with you.

Is there anyone with any actual facts?
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Fdev, but as usual, they're not talking. I fell in love with an MMO, Archage, watched it destroyed by cheats, exploits and gold sellers (and Trions greed with the cash shop). They waited until it was too late to start fixing it. Pretty much dead now.

EDIT: Fdev will probably make an announcement once Obsidian Ant reports on it on Youtube!
 
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Arthur Shappey

Arthur Shappey
Franc Kaos said:
Fdev, but as usual, they're not talking. I fell in love with an MMO, Archage, watched it destroyed by cheats, exploits and gold sellers (and Trions greed with the cash shop). They waited until it was too late to start fixing it. Pretty much dead now.

EDIT: Fdev will probably make an announcement once Obsidian Ant reports on it on Youtube!
Click to expand...

Was that meant to be a joke? How can FDev be the source if they're not talking... Was it sign-language? Mysterious alien hieroglyphs?
 
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