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You forget that many of the older players in ED have been playing games for a long time, in my case most of my life. It's probably a good guess that many older players have at some point played PvP games, many I'm sure still do.
As for statistical samples, what was yours again? I must have missed it.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
There isn't - that was my point - the Solo game is not at all about direct PvP (although there is always potential, but no guarantee, for indirect PvP through the BGS).
We do already (if one wishes to unlock certain Engineers) - although that remains optional.
In fact all this talk of PvP has made me itch for some CQC....now if I can only find the other person who plays it
I think your looking for Wolf Starslayer.
There are people that like pvp, and there are people that like pve, and then there are the people that like watching kids throw their own turds at each other.... aah i digress.
My point is, each should be allowed to persue the things in his free times he likes, and no "faction" should force the other to play the way they like it to (for arguments sake, i call pvpers and pve-ers a faction). However, pvping AFFECTS PVE but NOT vice versa.
FD in the end is a busines, and that busines needs to pay saleriess, those saleries have to be gathered first somehow. So they want to sell their game. Hence they want to sell it to as many people as possible and to achieve that, they need to try to cater to as many people as possible, hence PVP ers and PVE ers. Im pretty sure FD is well aware that a good chunk of the playerbase is PVE oriented and plays either in solo/private group/mobius. (Some like the trill of getting ganked 500ls before you can drop off your rare goods, and thats fine - thats the reason people like Dark souls and such games)
So im not complaining about open, it is what it is after all, and i dont complain about other players playstyle. Some like to Trade, some like to explore, some like to hunt npc's, and some like to gank other players. To each their own.
My point is, each should be allowed to persue the things in his free times he likes, and no "faction" should force the other to play the way they like it to (for arguments sake, i call pvpers and pve-ers a faction). However, pvping AFFECTS PVE but NOT vice versa.
FD in the end is a busines, and that busines needs to pay saleriess, those saleries have to be gathered first somehow. So they want to sell their game. Hence they want to sell it to as many people as possible and to achieve that, they need to try to cater to as many people as possible, hence PVP ers and PVE ers. Im pretty sure FD is well aware that a good chunk of the playerbase is PVE oriented and plays either in solo/private group/mobius. (Some like the trill of getting ganked 500ls before you can drop off your rare goods, and thats fine - thats the reason people like Dark souls and such games)
So im not complaining about open, it is what it is after all, and i dont complain about other players playstyle. Some like to Trade, some like to explore, some like to hunt npc's, and some like to gank other players. To each their own.
Repped for truth.
1) That's ME after a horrible day at work. Want to see no one, hear from no one, and certainly want no interaction in any shape or form.
2) That's ME to! After a mildly bad day, just want to do my own thing, but have folks around so I don't feel entirely alone.
3) That's ME!!! I get home from a regular ol' day at work, and think, yep can run some combat zones with a few friends. Wing up, and shoot things together. Lovely!
4) That's ... NOT... me
Nah. Why? Not my nature. It's that simple to explain [smile]
Players vs Players Instant Combat
Use your own ships, or use Custom battles. In Total War, you set the amount of money each side can spend on combat, then you buy your units in whatever way you like. Lots of small cheap units, or a couple of veteran hard nosed ones. This might work here as well. One side could buy one of the big ships, outfitted and engineered up the wazzoo, while the other side could be 4 snappy vipers.
You can play for reals, where the stakes are ... I dunno, 10% of the cash attributed to each side. Winner takes the pot. Or you could create scenarios for training. Or trying out a build. Or try out that high tier ship to see if you really want it before you grind money and rank and stuff to get it. Same with engineered stuff. If you want to try out builds now, you have to grind all engineers, then find a suitable event to see whether it works.
There could even be a king of the hill scenario.
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Ziggy, it's a great idea.. but we all know deep down the moment you're able to 'distribute' credits, some spoiled goat will game it to transfer money to other accounts
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Yeah ... crap.Ziggy, it's a great idea.. but we all know deep down the moment you're able to 'distribute' credits, some spoiled goat will game it to transfer money to other accounts
Ok, so high score table it is.
More so, NO MODE is "all about PvP". Open facilitates it but that doesn't imply that open "is all about PvP". Rather open is about ALL the things that solo is about AND multiplayer, competitive OR cooperative.
As you point out, engineers is optional... thus there's no requirement to engage in it. If one wishes to unlock certain parts of engineers one must engage in exploration and mining. If one wushes to name a planet one must engage in exploration. If one wishes to sell combat onds one must engage in combat... but one DOESN'T HAVE TO do any of these onless one wishes it.
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Sadly that will never happen. At least there are other games to scratch that itch.
haha.. vrep, run out of real life credible reps!
It's very rarely concentual PvP..
You take a CMDR who is out trading and does not want combat.. He has built his game around trading. Out come Johny Cheat me a God Ship and kills him.. PvP? I don't think so.. more like cowardly killing.
Take another CMDR out exploring, comes back to bubble, to hand in data and get raise his rank. Out comes Johny PvP dude and kills him. For what? Why?
It's not PvP.. Its Johny getting his jollies by killing anyone he can. And those he can't, he creates wings to do so.
PvP is a joke in ED. It caters to the kids. Who have absolutely nothing to lose but their few million, where as the average CMDR who gets killed loses time, credits. ship, cargo, rank. While, ironically, Johny cheater/ganker/killer laffs 'get gud'.. Spare me!
Real PvP should be concentual, where contestants measure themselves against like minded players, who do nothing but build and play to be the best.
What we have is nothing like proper PvP.
You take a CMDR who is out trading and does not want combat.. He has built his game around trading. Out come Johny Cheat me a God Ship and kills him.. PvP? I don't think so.. more like cowardly killing.
Take another CMDR out exploring, comes back to bubble, to hand in data and get raise his rank. Out comes Johny PvP dude and kills him. For what? Why?
It's not PvP.. Its Johny getting his jollies by killing anyone he can. And those he can't, he creates wings to do so.
PvP is a joke in ED. It caters to the kids. Who have absolutely nothing to lose but their few million, where as the average CMDR who gets killed loses time, credits. ship, cargo, rank. While, ironically, Johny cheater/ganker/killer laffs 'get gud'.. Spare me!
Real PvP should be concentual, where contestants measure themselves against like minded players, who do nothing but build and play to be the best.
What we have is nothing like proper PvP.
Because Frontier Developments tried for the holy grail of PvP, meaningful PvP, and failed to follow through on the meaningful part. People will PvP if they have a motive to, after all a LOT of people play the background sim, which is indirect PvP, but direct PvP combat is pretty much pointless in this game. It gains you nothing, and can cost you a lot.
Frontier Developments also, ultimately, failed to keep the population of player-killers and exploiters under control, despite nearly 40 years of online gaming, since the first MUD, adventure, demonstrating the importance of doing so. The DDF clearly demonstrates, IMO, that Frontier understood this concept intellectually, but they failed to understand that this needed to be their top priority. Which is why Frontier has allowed the cancer in Open to proliferate out of control, chasing out anyone who MIGHT be interested in PvP, but is not either a hardcore PvPer, in a gaming masochist.
Frontier Developments also, ultimately, failed to keep the population of player-killers and exploiters under control, despite nearly 40 years of online gaming, since the first MUD, adventure, demonstrating the importance of doing so. The DDF clearly demonstrates, IMO, that Frontier understood this concept intellectually, but they failed to understand that this needed to be their top priority. Which is why Frontier has allowed the cancer in Open to proliferate out of control, chasing out anyone who MIGHT be interested in PvP, but is not either a hardcore PvPer, in a gaming masochist.
Yeah, we do.
A more accurate observation is that, unlike PvPers, we don't demand that others play our way, only that they leave us alone and not try to force us to play their way.
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PvP is, with three exceptions, a complete waste of time, effort, energy and ammunition.
1. PvP Piracy - while not known as a "top tier" career, it is one of few that actually does have a PvP component. Yes, you can pirate NPC's as well, to one degree or another, the interactions are extremely limited. At least with PvP piracy there is a chance for some intra-personal dialog as well.
2. Bounty Hunting - from actively hunting down miscreant commanders to meeting up with a friend to blast them bountyless, PvP bounty hunting, while capped at its maximum payoff, at the very least has a pay off.
3. Power Play - If your just trading merits with a friend, or actively pushing your faction's agenda, this is one area where PvP makes sense.
Beyond this, PvP has no other payout. Destroyed ships give no materials, no rank, no stat. There's really no reason for it, aside from simply wanting to fight with other commanders. And that's generally fine, if those other commanders are willing. But with rebuy costs, many simply do not have the desire to blow their bank on PvP matches. And when it's otherwise unwanted, it only interferes with missions, and carries additional costs. Combine that with our very mortal crew, and there are far more reasons to avoid losing a ship than risking one.
In short the risk-to-reward of PvP is completely absent.
For myself, I just don't PvP because it doesn't interest me. Between over-engineered ship that people call "skill" and the myriad of issues that can and do arise when attempting to interact with others, most notably in Open, there's simply no point.
1. PvP Piracy - while not known as a "top tier" career, it is one of few that actually does have a PvP component. Yes, you can pirate NPC's as well, to one degree or another, the interactions are extremely limited. At least with PvP piracy there is a chance for some intra-personal dialog as well.
2. Bounty Hunting - from actively hunting down miscreant commanders to meeting up with a friend to blast them bountyless, PvP bounty hunting, while capped at its maximum payoff, at the very least has a pay off.
3. Power Play - If your just trading merits with a friend, or actively pushing your faction's agenda, this is one area where PvP makes sense.
Beyond this, PvP has no other payout. Destroyed ships give no materials, no rank, no stat. There's really no reason for it, aside from simply wanting to fight with other commanders. And that's generally fine, if those other commanders are willing. But with rebuy costs, many simply do not have the desire to blow their bank on PvP matches. And when it's otherwise unwanted, it only interferes with missions, and carries additional costs. Combine that with our very mortal crew, and there are far more reasons to avoid losing a ship than risking one.
In short the risk-to-reward of PvP is completely absent.
For myself, I just don't PvP because it doesn't interest me. Between over-engineered ship that people call "skill" and the myriad of issues that can and do arise when attempting to interact with others, most notably in Open, there's simply no point.
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