Only one light source at a time?

[NW3]

I'm sorry this is rubbish, 32bit has no limitations heck you could have even done horizons on it as that's just a height map and some meshes.

As for shadows Neverwinter Nights had multiple shadows back in the early 2000s so it's a limit of the Cobra engine NOT drivers. All FDEV would have to do is get the angle and range and cast light and shadow dependent on those.

EDIT: OpenGL and Direct X have a eight light limit which still doesn't say while they only use one in space. I have been asking since 1.x for just light casting on ships NOT shadows just light it's the easiest thing to do and is even in the NeHe OpenGL tuts.

My credentials are I have been a coder since 1981 and released a space game back in 1999 which had multiple light sources. I have had systems with multiple lights all lighting up ship meshes making them look incredible.

I don't think it's a matter of "Cobra can't do multiple lights/shadows". My understanding is that the performance hit is too high. (It basically halves the framerate.) This has been requested for years now. I'm sure that FD will get around to implementing it on PCs; I'm not sure about consoles, but it probably won't be an option for the current models.

Because they don't have a perfectly adequate one. Did you miss the title of the thread??

This game gets new bugs in every update, taking months to fix. Trivial improvements are "too difficult". Simple fixes like getting the mouse to work properly in the galaxy map are apparently impossible.

These are not signs of "they know how to use it already".

Much of what you are complaining about is "game" code, not "engine" code. Yes there are bugs, yes, it seems to take a long time for ED to fix some of the bugs. As a programmer, I have to point out that you haven't seen the code; it's probably a lot more complicated than you think it is. I assume they are working on higher-priority tasks.

 

[S3B4ST13N]

To get one that is not full of bugs, doesn't need the user to port it himself to each new platform (as Frontier have just had to do for PS4) ... and gives high-performance results. (Such as more than one light source at a time.)

Yeah.. let's spend 5% of our turnover (after $3000 per product per catalogue) on a) something the engine already does (cross-platform), and b) something we can implement ourselves when we're ready to and have managed to satisfy performance concerns.
Perfect business sense. /sarcasm

You have some evidence of that?

"The new game will share an underlying engine with Elite: Dangerous—Frontier’s proprietary COBRA engine. In spite of its Elite-sounding name, the COBRA engine actually has a theme park heritage, being first developed to power Frontier’s 2004 Roller Coaster Tycoon 3. It also powered Frontier’s 2010 Xbox 360 game Kinectimals.

Braben was excited about the engine commonality, too, talking for a couple of minutes about the advantages of having an in-house engine for all games and actually bringing up a lot of the same points that Bioware hit on when they discussed unifying development on Frostbite with us on Monday. “Compare Kinectimals to Elite: Dangerous! It’s a broad range, but actually the engineering problems you have to solve are remarkably similar—weather systems on planets or fluffy fur on the head of a baby tiger.”"
- https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/06/elite-dangerous-developers-talk-to-ars-about-planet-coaster/

Bear in mind that whilst that IS an article, they interviewed DBOBE and he spoke about the COBRA engine which is sufficient evidence in my books.

COBRA has been around since 1988.
COBRA engine since 2004 when they took over RCT from Sawyer.

Believe it, don't believe it.
Makes no difference.

 

[Stachel]

Much of what you are complaining about is "game" code, not "engine" code.

No, it's broken engine code.

Break-dancing capital ships - broken engine 3D processing. Wrong coloured starlight - broken engine lighting. Messed-up galaxy map mouse control - broken engine.

Even the worst game code running on high-quality industry standard engines don't have faults like these.

the code; it's probably a lot more complicated than you think it is.

I think the code is VERY VERY complicated. That's why old bugs resurface, changes to one thing break another, and serious bugs don't get fixed for months, if ever.

I assume they are working on higher-priority tasks.

There's no doubt about that. Those higher-priority tasks are higher-priority games, such as Jurassic watchamacallit.

 

[Stachel]

they interviewed DBOBE

I asked for evidence. The self-promotional guff Braben comes up with in an interview a decade later is not evidence.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Yeah.. let's spend 5% of our turnover (after $3000 per product per catalogue) on a) something the engine already does (cross-platform), and b) something we can implement ourselves when we're ready to and have managed to satisfy performance concerns.
Perfect business sense. /sarcasm



"The new game will share an underlying engine with Elite: Dangerous—Frontier’s proprietary COBRA engine. In spite of its Elite-sounding name, the COBRA engine actually has a theme park heritage, being first developed to power Frontier’s 2004 Roller Coaster Tycoon 3. It also powered Frontier’s 2010 Xbox 360 game Kinectimals.

Braben was excited about the engine commonality, too, talking for a couple of minutes about the advantages of having an in-house engine for all games and actually bringing up a lot of the same points that Bioware hit on when they discussed unifying development on Frostbite with us on Monday. “Compare Kinectimals to Elite: Dangerous! It’s a broad range, but actually the engineering problems you have to solve are remarkably similar—weather systems on planets or fluffy fur on the head of a baby tiger.”"
- https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2015/06/elite-dangerous-developers-talk-to-ars-about-planet-coaster/

Bear in mind that whilst that IS an article, they interviewed DBOBE and he spoke about the COBRA engine which is sufficient evidence in my books.

COBRA has been around since 1988.
COBRA engine since 2004 when they took over RCT from Sawyer.

Believe it, don't believe it.
Makes no difference.

Don't feed the troll. He literally has no idea what he is talking about. Look up his post history.

 

[nanite2000]

I asked for evidence. The self-promotional guff Braben comes up with in an interview a decade later is not evidence.

Amazing. This is must be how conspiracy theorists are born.

OK - let's turn this around. What evidence *would* be required to convince you? And how do you propose we get it for you?

Also, what evidence do you have that you are correct, and that David Braben is actually lying?

 

[S3B4ST13N]

I asked for evidence. The self-promotional guff Braben comes up with in an interview a decade later is not evidence.

Like I said, believe it or don't believe it .. I don't care.
Feel free to take them to court if you don't believe them.

 

[Stachel]

OK - let's turn this around. What evidence *would* be required to convince you?

Any mention of Cobra on the RCT3 game. Any mention of Cobra anywhere at the time of RCT3. Any Cobra credit on any Frontier game before 2013.

Actually any mention at all during the first 25 years in which it was supposed to exist.

Feel free to waste your time searching, but I'll bet you'll find none of this exists. Cobra appeared for the first time in 2013 in Frontier's documents for investors from whom it was trying to raise money. It's simply a label the purpose of which is to inflate the company value in the eyes of people who know next to nothing about game dev tech. Nothing more.

 

[S3B4ST13N]

Don't feed the troll. He literally has no idea what he is talking about. Look up his post history.

Indeed.

 

[nanite2000]

Any mention of Cobra on the RCT3 game. Any mention of Cobra anywhere at the time of RCT3.

Actually any mention at all during the first 25 years in which it was supposed to exist. Or any trace of Cobra in Elite 1984, the sources of which Ian Bell has posted on his web site and which Frontier claims was the first game to use Cobra.

Feel free to waste your time searching, but I'll bet you'll find none of this exists. Cobra appeared for the first time in 2013 in Frontier's documents for the investors to which it was trying to sell shares. It's simply a label the purpose of which is to inflate the company value in the eyes of people who know next to nothing about game dev tech. Nothing more.

That's most likely because they didn't give it a public name until 2013. Up until then i was most likely just their 'development environment'. Just because they didn't give it a label until 2013 doesn't mean it never existed beforehand.

But I can see that's not what you want to hear. You would rather believe that David Braben and Frontier are liars and if only we all had your clarity of vision to see them for what they really are, and if only we would just listen to you, right?

Nah. We're too busy having fun playing Elite, and enjoying it's broken lighting engine (that doesn't accurately reflect the right star colour), to care:

Thankfully, ignore lists were designed for people like you.

 

[S3B4ST13N]

Any mention of Cobra on the RCT3 game. Any mention of Cobra anywhere at the time of RCT3. Any Cobra credit on any Frontier game before 2013.

Actually any mention at all during the first 25 years in which it was supposed to exist.

Feel free to waste your time searching, but I'll bet you'll find none of this exists. Cobra appeared for the first time in 2013 in Frontier's documents for investors from whom it was trying to raise money. It's simply a label the purpose of which is to inflate the company value in the eyes of people who know next to nothing about game dev tech. Nothing more.

So we have two people who worked on, designed and built COBRA (the engine and in-house tools) .. both stating it exists and have stated it exists for decades .. have filed trademark and made it the companies proprietary technology but for some reason that's not good enough for you? Good enough for investors, good enough for gaming articles, good enough for pretty much everyone .. but not you and you seem to want to speak with some kind of authority? .... LOL!
Okay .. I'm done. *wipes tears from eyes*
Welcome to my ignore list.

 

[Stachel]

Just because they didn't give it a label until 2013 doesn't mean it never existed beforehand.

I agree. What suggest it didn't exist beforehand is the fact no-one can find any trace of it existing beforehand.

So we have two people who worked on, designed and built COBRA (the engine and in-house tools) .. both stating it exists and have stated it exists for decades

Two people?? David Braben and... who??

.. have filed trademark

I think you just made that up. The trademark office shows no Frontier Cobra trademark filing.

 

[Whitehair]

I agree. What suggest it didn't exist beforehand is the fact no-one can find any trace of it existing beforehand.



Two people?? David Braben and... who??



I think you just made that up. The trademark office shows no Frontier Cobra trademark filing.

https://www.frontier.co.uk/node/639

A relevant extract:

This modern Cobra platform represents the current state of an ongoing investment that Frontier has made in its proprietary engine technology and development tools since 1988.

The current engine is the fourth generation of our cross-platform technology

 

[S3B4ST13N]

To nobody in particular...
COBRA duly trademarked.

Fiddle dum, fiddle dee, can't believe this heresy! All these years, centuries, not a soul at my parties! *sings*

 

[S3B4ST13N]

A relevant extract:

The CEO/founder stating that four (5?) of their games are built on the COBRA engine isn't good enough; so I doubt quoting the website will do anything to change his mind.
All the evidence is there, if he doesn't want to see it at such, can't force him.. might as well let him wallow in his ignorance; blissful as it is.

 

[Whitehair]

His posts are funny

They help while away some down time at work!

 

[S3B4ST13N]

His posts are funny

They help while away some down time at work!

You get down time?! :O

 

[Whitehair]

You get down time?! :O

Its called delegation

 

[Shadowdancer]

I can't seem to find a registered trademark for "Cobra" by FD in either UK, EU, or US databases (I did browse through some 330 results for snake-related image marks too). They do have a mark for "Thargoid" though, so prepare for "Thargoid™ Probe" in your cargo

(edit) Also, "Right on Commander™"

 

[Winterwalker]

Its called delegation

Ahhh. The great British worker .. so many chiefs, yet indians so few? Yoroshiku.
Just a vague off topic observation by the way, not a personal one.

I play ED on a WAY underspec laptop. With single point light sources it plays .. just about.
Multiple sources might kill my Commander! (Radiation OD)

I haz a sad but do it anyway.