I think that, while those logs do not prove that AEGIS is behind that clean up operation, it is a founded hypothesis, it adds up very well. But until we find a clear "AEGIS ordered to kill anyone near that beacon", we cannot confirm it.
INRA Base Discoveries
- Thread starter aymerix
- Start date
I think that, while those logs do not prove that AEGIS is behind that clean up operation, it is a founded hypothesis, it adds up very well. But until we find a clear "AEGIS ordered to kill anyone near that beacon", we cannot confirm it.
Given that they are not persistent and are RNG POI, I don't think they can point to much of anything.
I'm almost certain this is an artefact of the BGS. Prior to the system becoming populated, they were "No Faction" ships, even when AEGIS was already in the game. You can see similar effects where Anarchy factions can generate System Authority Vessels in state-specific sites, which scan you for illicit cargo.
The only way to verify this (and good bloody luck, to be honest) would be to get AEGIS out of control of the system. They'll be defaulting to the local system jurisdiction, rather than having a specific jurisdiction for that area. Confusing oversight by FD, imo. 609 ships in the last 24 hours, probably handing in bonds for Thargoid kills, you won't flip that.
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So, I brought the old Cobra MKIII out of moth-balls to follow this little bit of 'history'; now to check out some rumours regarding Aegis
Really had to land here, heard it had to be in a Cobra to count...
You may well be correct in that assumption. However I seem to remember posts that implied an unusally high number of SDF ships on planets with Permanent POI, just wondering if anyone actually followed that idea up; just because they’re random and not permanent doesn’t mean their number and placement might not be an FD clue-they may actually have listened to our moans about the difficulty of finding things
Markings on the left and right on that landing pad depicts vector-graph Cobra.
You also have to be oriented in the right position to declare it legit!
Indeed.
I'm not prepared to go as far as saying any pointing direction behaviour or anything would be meaningful, but having done plenty of planetside things (and encountered lone SDF before), the frequency with which they spawned when I toured the INRA sites recently was very uncanny.
It may be as insignificant as "if there's something there, spawn SDFs", but while touring and spending lots of time at things like Barnacles, Alien Wrecks and the Thargoid Structures, I've never seen them spawn with anywhere near the frequency they do at INRA sites.
See, if they're marked as Aegis, that is proof, but the bounty and logs aren't at all.
I'm still very convinced they're marked Aegis just because they control the system, and that they're just owned by whoever the system controllers are. Proof of that would be to trigger and win a war for system control with AEGIS, but that is a huge task considering the amount of people going in and out of Electra.
I concur it is just that Aegis now Controls the system
Prior to Aegis Moving in PSJ-17 still had the same System Authority vessels even though there was no Jurisdiction
Markings on the left and right on that landing pad depicts vector-graph Cobra.
You also have to be oriented in the right position to declare it legit!
Ha! and here I went and carefully aligned with the left landing pad, assuming the ghost of JJ was in the 'right'
You are legit. I rest my case. Rep!
So here's an interesting theory;-
What was the jump range of Jameson's Cobra MkIII? if we assume the modern limit of 17ly (or even 7ly in the original game), shouldn't that mean there will be wreckage of a Hive ship within that range? Now I know that people would say he had fuel scoops but if you make the assumption that INRA's sabotage only hit after he jumped away from the Hive Ship's location, then logically he's only one jump away from the now dead hive ship. Are there any Thargoid bases near his crashed cobra and if so, could we also assume that these thatrgoid bases are not bases but crashed hive ships (which would explain the scavengers)?
What was the jump range of Jameson's Cobra MkIII? if we assume the modern limit of 17ly (or even 7ly in the original game), shouldn't that mean there will be wreckage of a Hive ship within that range? Now I know that people would say he had fuel scoops but if you make the assumption that INRA's sabotage only hit after he jumped away from the Hive Ship's location, then logically he's only one jump away from the now dead hive ship. Are there any Thargoid bases near his crashed cobra and if so, could we also assume that these thatrgoid bases are not bases but crashed hive ships (which would explain the scavengers)?
I've suggested this line of thought myself.
Perhaps a search of systems around of 17ly or less from the crash site with Ammonia worlds in them might yield something?
I was thinking the same thing myself.
There are a couple of possibilities though.
1) Jameson carried out his attack IN HIP 12099.
Maybe the Thargoid hive-ship was there to rescue the Thargoid being held captive at Stack.
Maybe that was deliberate, in order to lure a hive-ship there?
So, Jameson makes his attack and his ship carks it immediately afterwards, crashing on 1B.
In that case, it would seem like INRA would be fairly well in control of the situation - the attack was planned and happened in their own territory, which means it's possible they salvaged the hive-ship and removed it.
2) Jameson carried out his attack elsewhere and then his ship carked it as he was returning to 12 Trianguli (assuming that is what he was doing).
That would suggest the attack occurred somewhere "further out" from 12 Trianguli than HIP 12099.
Extrapolate a line from 12 Trianguli, through HIP 12099, and you might find the location of the attack, and a wrecked Thargoid hive-ship.
3) It doesn't really matter where Jameson carried out the attack because the doomed Thargoid hive-ship escaped afterward.
This isn't much fun for us but it's really the only scenario which explains how the Mycoid virus was actually able to put an end to the Thargoid threat.
After all, if a virus kills it's host before it can spread the contagion, it's not going to be a very successful virus.
If that's what happened, I guess the hive-ship is back in Thargoid space, somewhere, in some kind of "quarantine zone" along with all the other contaminated Thargoid ships... assuming the Thargoids didn't just fly them into a star to get rid of them.
Came here to post exactly this. We know he left from 12 Trianguli to deliver the mycoid virus to the hive ship and we know he crashed in HIP 12099. I would imagine that the place he took off from for the mission would be the place he would return to after the mission (debriefing, decontamination of his ship, etc).
How far is really hard to say, but it's worth looking at plotting a line from 12 Tranguli to HIP 12099 and start looking at what systems lie beyond HIP 12099 (within reason).
Here is a question on my mind:
Could the Mycoid spread? EG from ship to ship, Thargoid to Thargoid, Ship to Thargoid etc.
At the moment I am thinking that the whole of the original Elite Thargoid encounters was a single Hive Ship and that is what INRA defeated. However what if the Hive Ship is nowhere near where Jameson's Cobra lays, as it was still able to function for a time and returned to Miacki (assuming Miacki is even a thing in ED and the Thargoids are not now a purely space based migratory species on many HIve Ships). This would mean there will not be a wreck to find near the Cobra.
I have to say though the INRA logs suggest the Mycoid worked both very fast, and very effectivly which would suggest it would cripple such a ship very fast. But we don't know how large a Hive Ship is or how fast Mycoid spreads beyond the contact point.
My last thoughts about about the nature of INRA and AEGIS. I know they are not necessary the same thing or in the same mould, but I am assuming so until proven otherwise. And this creates a dilemma for me. To me, having to use INRA to defeat the Thargoids would be like having to use the 'WW2 German national socialist workers party', well known by another name that we can't type here, to save you from Aliens. You are being attacked by something that aims to wipe you out, but the thing that is defending you is just as bad, only they and not the ones trying to kill you. The leaves a very bad taste in the mouth. Of course I am still half convinced we started the first war anyway.
But FDEV is good with shades of grey. The Thargoids may just be alien, with a very Athropod mind set, only taken to sentience and high levels of intellect. To them wiping out another species might have no morel implications at all, as they may have no concept of morality. To them it may be seem as completely natural resource competition. I doubt the Wasp or Spider feels anything for the fly. In this scenario there is no negotiation or communication. We are food/resources/ a blocker. And so we have a organisation that is so dedicated to their cause (defeating the Thargoids and saving Humanity), that they cannot let things like morals and ethics get in the way. So people were ruined, scapegoated, murdered to get the bigger job done. And it is justified under a cruel version of 'needs of the many'. But I cannot abide by that. So I will not work for AEGIS. And yet, by not working for AEGIS, I could be helping to doom Humanity to defeat by a far worse foe.
And so I hold out of the hope that the Thargoids are not a totally Athropod like species with no morals we would recognise. As ever, we need a whole lot more information, and a whole lot more history to know where to stand.
EDIT: more stream of consciousness...
I would not be surprised if FDEV have thought on all of this and set things up to exploit it and to see how we react, in a big social experiment. INRA are shown to be a very morally bankrupt organisation doing a very good thing. And then we get given AEGIS. But AEGIS is nothing like INRA and really are just what they say they are. Good guys trying to help and with morals and ethics to boot. But people like my won't help them as we just see INRA.
Further more, it the Thrtgoids really are just evil, and not victims themselves, or as I said above have no concept of morality at all and are just behaving like a hive, then it would make the gun totting, right wing, anti-xeno crowd in the right. And people like me a weakness. And that, more than anything else, is a truly terrifying thought!
Could the Mycoid spread? EG from ship to ship, Thargoid to Thargoid, Ship to Thargoid etc.
At the moment I am thinking that the whole of the original Elite Thargoid encounters was a single Hive Ship and that is what INRA defeated. However what if the Hive Ship is nowhere near where Jameson's Cobra lays, as it was still able to function for a time and returned to Miacki (assuming Miacki is even a thing in ED and the Thargoids are not now a purely space based migratory species on many HIve Ships). This would mean there will not be a wreck to find near the Cobra.
I have to say though the INRA logs suggest the Mycoid worked both very fast, and very effectivly which would suggest it would cripple such a ship very fast. But we don't know how large a Hive Ship is or how fast Mycoid spreads beyond the contact point.
My last thoughts about about the nature of INRA and AEGIS. I know they are not necessary the same thing or in the same mould, but I am assuming so until proven otherwise. And this creates a dilemma for me. To me, having to use INRA to defeat the Thargoids would be like having to use the 'WW2 German national socialist workers party', well known by another name that we can't type here, to save you from Aliens. You are being attacked by something that aims to wipe you out, but the thing that is defending you is just as bad, only they and not the ones trying to kill you. The leaves a very bad taste in the mouth. Of course I am still half convinced we started the first war anyway.
But FDEV is good with shades of grey. The Thargoids may just be alien, with a very Athropod mind set, only taken to sentience and high levels of intellect. To them wiping out another species might have no morel implications at all, as they may have no concept of morality. To them it may be seem as completely natural resource competition. I doubt the Wasp or Spider feels anything for the fly. In this scenario there is no negotiation or communication. We are food/resources/ a blocker. And so we have a organisation that is so dedicated to their cause (defeating the Thargoids and saving Humanity), that they cannot let things like morals and ethics get in the way. So people were ruined, scapegoated, murdered to get the bigger job done. And it is justified under a cruel version of 'needs of the many'. But I cannot abide by that. So I will not work for AEGIS. And yet, by not working for AEGIS, I could be helping to doom Humanity to defeat by a far worse foe.
And so I hold out of the hope that the Thargoids are not a totally Athropod like species with no morals we would recognise. As ever, we need a whole lot more information, and a whole lot more history to know where to stand.
EDIT: more stream of consciousness...
I would not be surprised if FDEV have thought on all of this and set things up to exploit it and to see how we react, in a big social experiment. INRA are shown to be a very morally bankrupt organisation doing a very good thing. And then we get given AEGIS. But AEGIS is nothing like INRA and really are just what they say they are. Good guys trying to help and with morals and ethics to boot. But people like my won't help them as we just see INRA.
Further more, it the Thrtgoids really are just evil, and not victims themselves, or as I said above have no concept of morality at all and are just behaving like a hive, then it would make the gun totting, right wing, anti-xeno crowd in the right. And people like me a weakness. And that, more than anything else, is a truly terrifying thought!
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Sadly there is no way to even guess the range - so really, just go for a number you like the sound of and work on that
Reasoning:
The 7ly limit is a myth (it's not a limit present in ED Lore, it's based solely on Elite). We have zero info on "old" hyperdrive jump ranges as relating to ED Lore other than the FSD (from contextual assumption) jumps further than the Quirium drive. Thatchinho did a pretty cool experiment and proved that "in the past" Hyperdrive ranges did exceed 7ly even in the earliest days of hyperdrive travel: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-Discussions?p=6159264&viewfull=1#post6159264
There's also no telling what modifications, upgrades or experimental drive systems JJ was using - we know that the Pleiades was well outside human space, so it's possible that he was chosen in part for having a long-range hyperdrive - we just don't know.