indeed because having a 18th century market simulation in a space game is absolutely an immersive need.
Still as Inconvenient as Possible to Play
- Thread starter Blackcompany
- Start date
indeed because having a 18th century market simulation in a space game is absolutely an immersive need.
ED world feels a bit like living in Absurdistan. Why can't we order modules anywhere for a premium ?
Heck, for the clock gameplay addicts, add an immershun timer®
Heck, for the clock gameplay addicts, add an immershun timer®
Yes it's in the game already and called telepresence. Anyone else want to tell us why trading data is out of reach for everyone or why it's any issue to "see the galaxy at the touch of a button" (when we already can)?
Yep, one of the reasons why I hate telepresence.
I actually agree with TS here.
All the information is already there in the game to make this work, and as a more developed core feature it fits perfectly in beyond - there should be a "pilots federation data" tab we can use that is essentially a precise replica of EDDB.IO. Maybe with a few extra bells and whistles. Charge players credits to use it if you like - 1k credits per search or something. This would add fantastic immersion to the game and be great fun.
To their credit, the improved route plotter has made those tools obsolete for jumping. They can do the same here.
All the information is already there in the game to make this work, and as a more developed core feature it fits perfectly in beyond - there should be a "pilots federation data" tab we can use that is essentially a precise replica of EDDB.IO. Maybe with a few extra bells and whistles. Charge players credits to use it if you like - 1k credits per search or something. This would add fantastic immersion to the game and be great fun.
To their credit, the improved route plotter has made those tools obsolete for jumping. They can do the same here.
I bet if a CG was created called "transport trading data" and we had to go to stations and take their marketplace to other systems a ton of people would participate, right? So basically you fly to system X, grab their trade data and deliver it to system Y so now you can see data about each station.
To think this wouldn't be done on a daily basis as a service in the universe is pretty stupid. If no tradse data exists because of communication then businesses would pop up with couriers getting that data because that would be crucial to trading and also data that can be sold. So there is no way on earth there would not be trade data everywhere when it takes minutes to jump to a new system and dock.
To think this wouldn't be done on a daily basis as a service in the universe is pretty stupid. If no tradse data exists because of communication then businesses would pop up with couriers getting that data because that would be crucial to trading and also data that can be sold. So there is no way on earth there would not be trade data everywhere when it takes minutes to jump to a new system and dock.
Whilst it doesn't impact my game-play, or my experience of the game; I have had -since BETA- trouble understanding how a galactic community can function using a system of communication that effectively pre-dates the telephone.
The world, right now, would tumble into abject chaos if the internet were to break down; and I'm not talking about all those folks crying that they can no longer check their Facebook accounts, Twitter feeds or browse I Can Has Cheezburger? I'm referring to the majority of the world's infrastructure being dependent on high-speed inter-connectivity.
How does a society so dependent on something like the internet, manage to function without it across hundreds of Light-Years? Treating each system, nay, station or planet as an island (because IIRC not even two stations in the same system know what the other is doing) is all well and good; but how does a governmental body function this way?
The headquarters of each station in the power's influence must be over-flowing with data couriers bringing in all that information .. except they aren't - they look exactly like every other system in the game; which leads me to assume they aren't getting swamped with couriers day in and day out.
So how does Hudson know what the systems under his control are up to? How does he govern effectively if he doesn't have all the data available?
Of course, it doesn't help when you can just teleport a holographic image of yourself to another Cmdr's ship tens of thousands of light-years away instantly, but you need a physical ship to transfer market data to the station on the other side of the system.
I don't like this setup, too many questions and when coupled with contradictory game elements then it just turns the whole thing into a mess.
Eh, like I opened with .. it doesn't impact my game, and I don't think about it much (if ever) anyway; but I still struggle to wrap my head around the design decision for it.
Yes, apply logic to the situation and it doesn't make sense and it's glaringly obvious as well.
Sounds almost like every business out there!
Rafe Zetter
Banned
I made this and similar points on the last page - it got ignored or worse "no, coz reasons".
![[DOOK] Droogie](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/124/124078.jpg?1553527149){kind=avatar}
Apparently, gameplay has to =
It would at least be consistent.
But you can understand OPs point though?
I think you just proved twice, that you possibly don´t know the problem people have with Engineers, i.e. the lack information in this game.
With a vengeance...
LOL yeah I just read that in fact and I also read the prices never change in months so... so much for the "really complicated BGS"
So with the trade history you'll store on your ship, and knowing prices either don't change or won't change that much you're pretty much guaranteed to have relevant pricing wherever you go.
New places of course it doesn't address. There's no logic, at all to the way things are in ED and FDev seem incapable of remembering their own lore when they decide they want to add something in that breaks that law and then apply a heavy dose of either "reasons" or "handwavium"
Personally, I went from playing ED on a single screen without 3rd party tools, to playing ED in VR without 3rd party tools. I've found that using the information the game provides currently, plus my understanding of the game mechanics, my off the cuff trading usually yields profits within 5% of the "best trade" from EDDB.io for a commodity, and it takes me fewer jumps and less time to get it.
Even more amusing in my mind, is that during trade CGs, I'm continually finding good sources of the high profit commodity within one jump of the CG system, when people on the CG threads are complaining about how all the "good" within two or three jumps have dried up.
It'll be interesting to see if this will be the case with the new trade tools. The requirement to actually explore inhabited space will probably mean that many players will continue to travel down the same well worn paths that inevitably lead to panic when these sites aren't available.
As for finding ships and modules: high population boom industrial for ships, high population boom high tech for modules, plus book marks for future ships. For my main account, there's also Jameson Memorial. I also take the time to book mark any interesting systems I see on Galnet, in case I want to visit them in the future.
Yes I do, hence the reason why I am not against more info being made available, which I have said a number of times. I just do not like the OP delivery.
Not really. I suppose if the engineer wants a rare they should say were it is. But that's it to really.
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Even with this information, you could (and I have) fly around for 30 minutes not find the module you want.
If you have used Engineers to tune your ships, you would certainly now this game is lacking regarding information and managing information.
Edit:
That is good for you, but neither has anyone access to Jameson Memorial nor is it the solution to the problem.
Yes, exactly. By discover, I hope, you don´t mean plain and simple searching.
I tied to put your answers into perspective.
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Yes I do, hence the reason why I am not against more info being made available, which I have said a number of times. I just do not like the OP unpleasent delivery.
Nope, but as stated I also fly a ship that is capable for most things, use that while my specialist ship is in transit.
No, I mean discover as you play the game. What would be the point of exploring and travelling around the bubble if you new where all the good stuff is. The joy is discovering that good stuff. Well it is for me anyway.
I suppose the only thing with engineers is if they need rares to open up is to give them the whereabouts of said rare. To be honest I am not sure if they don't do this anyway.I tried to put your answers into perspective.
I know one way to do it. Treat it like ships. have it hop data like a physical object from the location you want to look at. Have it work in real time like an NPC Jumping and use the, "weight," of the data to move at an appropriate speed. But then also have interferance and other factors take place. If a particular place goes past a black whole or large sun have it scue the data potentially. if npc's or players are attacking the base or something similar have it interfere. It add several new aspects to the game.
BTW, I assume most information would be near instant as data would probably be send on the equivilant of protons or very small scale structures. But It could still have effects on the data over larger distances. Anyone know the math on what those distances would be.
And as a thought to that. They could employ larger matter to act as a larger bit so it weighs more. Say they use a large bit with a kilobit-mega or even giga or larger depending on teh nature of the data, data made up of individual 128 bits/protons or electrons etc. Maybe it's something large enough for it to be instant withing a quarter of the galaxy but not longer ranges. No idea what the math would be realistically. Assuming generation of the warp and all... I wonder how big it would have to be to act as a FSD. Or would it be a small machine with miniature FSD drive made to carry data in the form of protons or electrons with data to upload that gets sent back and forth between station and docks and uploads daily. Like an auto mated system. How much could that weight and how much data could it hold and what could be it's max travel speed?
This is under the assumption there is no other way to send the data in the form of wireless direct spot to spot communication in the form of something like a satellite. I would assume these are reusable probes that dock at a station upon request of data and then upload and recharge etc for reuse. It might also require two way transport as each data sender would need to travel the whole distance to recover. This is outside of the possibility of longer stuff using individual nodes to transport for longer distances... Like a normal router or signal repeater which could also be a factor.
Pretend instead of this: https://eddp.co/u/f1wDtS6l or https://eddp.co/u/N45o6yqp
Actually: https://eddp.co/u/cHRTpt9C / 2
It has a mass of 1 ton for hull and nothing else but maybe a small shield for asteroids etc. It's mass would be 10(14) tons max total unladen and 15 tons max laden because of 13 tons less on the hull. And when you look up data you either have to be in a station or you get an actual wireless data transmission from the station you are near too as long as you are within some distance of a station in the same SS and nothing is interfering with the signal. Each station could hold the data and put a time stamp on the last time data was received. And if you want you can hit renew or something and get a new one sent. But you have to wait for it to get to your location. 8)
I'm estimating around:
Single jump:
Laden: 62.67
Unladen: 65.02
Max: 73.53
Max Jump: (Second probe only)
Laden Neutron supercharge: 250.68
Unladen Neutron supercharge: 260.08
Max Neutron Supercharge: 294.12
Total Travel:
Laden: 311.89
Unladen: 315.54
If these were actually killable by players, pirates, and others, people could kill them and interdict for resources etc. This could add fun to the game... Maybe the probe cost the player some money up front to cover potential losses. Say the insurance cost of the probe. There could be different probes like above with different capabilities and cost associated with them. If a probe dies you can pay for a second one at the cost of another insurance payment like with a ship. The choice is yours. They could be probes E-A like with modules. E being the cheapest. A the most capable.
As is the first probe is only 41k. The second is 128k, but much faster. It would obviously be easier to get probe data from safer/closer systems.
Some probes could hop station to station like the first one. If it gets to a station and leaves and died it restarts at the new location. This saves travel distance on the rebuy. The second probe is self sufficient and trys to refuel at stars to make it to your location. If it dies you start at the beginning. Although, maybe, you could allow the second probe to use neutrons for increased jump range. So, pros and cons for each choice. But remember, probes would have to go both direction. One to ask for data and one to send it back. At minimum the second probe would get a save spot at the destination while the other would have numerous ones along the way. It's possible to have the probe charge you for the refueling and rechargeing. This would mean the more expensive probe migth be better for the longer trips. While the first one may be better for shorter cheaper journeys or for longer dangerous ones because of it's save point abilities.
Update:
Other probes:
Data Probe 1.0 Basic probe
Cost: 22,299
Estimate:
Single jump:
Laden: 72.82
Unladen: 75.82
Max: 87.19
Max Jump: (fuel scoop probes only)
Laden Neutron supercharge: 291.28
Unladen Neutron supercharge: 303.28
Max Neutron Supercharge: 348.76
Total Travel:
Laden: 365.32
Unladen: 381.88
Data probe 0 Cost: 2452
Data probe 0.1 Cost: 3160
I assume if this was implemented they would be modified to use power and primary control to maximize survivability where possible appropriately to the cost and desired effect. I assume they are about the size of a thargoid drone. Probably spherical and whatever color is available. Maybe yellow or black.
BTW, I assume most information would be near instant as data would probably be send on the equivilant of protons or very small scale structures. But It could still have effects on the data over larger distances. Anyone know the math on what those distances would be.
And as a thought to that. They could employ larger matter to act as a larger bit so it weighs more. Say they use a large bit with a kilobit-mega or even giga or larger depending on teh nature of the data, data made up of individual 128 bits/protons or electrons etc. Maybe it's something large enough for it to be instant withing a quarter of the galaxy but not longer ranges. No idea what the math would be realistically. Assuming generation of the warp and all... I wonder how big it would have to be to act as a FSD. Or would it be a small machine with miniature FSD drive made to carry data in the form of protons or electrons with data to upload that gets sent back and forth between station and docks and uploads daily. Like an auto mated system. How much could that weight and how much data could it hold and what could be it's max travel speed?
This is under the assumption there is no other way to send the data in the form of wireless direct spot to spot communication in the form of something like a satellite. I would assume these are reusable probes that dock at a station upon request of data and then upload and recharge etc for reuse. It might also require two way transport as each data sender would need to travel the whole distance to recover. This is outside of the possibility of longer stuff using individual nodes to transport for longer distances... Like a normal router or signal repeater which could also be a factor.
Actually: https://eddp.co/u/cHRTpt9C / 2
It has a mass of 1 ton for hull and nothing else but maybe a small shield for asteroids etc. It's mass would be 10(14) tons max total unladen and 15 tons max laden because of 13 tons less on the hull. And when you look up data you either have to be in a station or you get an actual wireless data transmission from the station you are near too as long as you are within some distance of a station in the same SS and nothing is interfering with the signal. Each station could hold the data and put a time stamp on the last time data was received. And if you want you can hit renew or something and get a new one sent. But you have to wait for it to get to your location. 8)
I'm estimating around:
Single jump:
Laden: 62.67
Unladen: 65.02
Max: 73.53
Max Jump: (Second probe only)
Laden Neutron supercharge: 250.68
Unladen Neutron supercharge: 260.08
Max Neutron Supercharge: 294.12
Total Travel:
Laden: 311.89
Unladen: 315.54
If these were actually killable by players, pirates, and others, people could kill them and interdict for resources etc. This could add fun to the game... Maybe the probe cost the player some money up front to cover potential losses. Say the insurance cost of the probe. There could be different probes like above with different capabilities and cost associated with them. If a probe dies you can pay for a second one at the cost of another insurance payment like with a ship. The choice is yours. They could be probes E-A like with modules. E being the cheapest. A the most capable.
As is the first probe is only 41k. The second is 128k, but much faster. It would obviously be easier to get probe data from safer/closer systems.
Some probes could hop station to station like the first one. If it gets to a station and leaves and died it restarts at the new location. This saves travel distance on the rebuy. The second probe is self sufficient and trys to refuel at stars to make it to your location. If it dies you start at the beginning. Although, maybe, you could allow the second probe to use neutrons for increased jump range. So, pros and cons for each choice. But remember, probes would have to go both direction. One to ask for data and one to send it back. At minimum the second probe would get a save spot at the destination while the other would have numerous ones along the way. It's possible to have the probe charge you for the refueling and rechargeing. This would mean the more expensive probe migth be better for the longer trips. While the first one may be better for shorter cheaper journeys or for longer dangerous ones because of it's save point abilities.
Update:
Other probes:
Data Probe 1.0 Basic probe
Cost: 22,299
Estimate:
Single jump:
Laden: 72.82
Unladen: 75.82
Max: 87.19
Max Jump: (fuel scoop probes only)
Laden Neutron supercharge: 291.28
Unladen Neutron supercharge: 303.28
Max Neutron Supercharge: 348.76
Total Travel:
Laden: 365.32
Unladen: 381.88
Data probe 0 Cost: 2452
Data probe 0.1 Cost: 3160
I assume if this was implemented they would be modified to use power and primary control to maximize survivability where possible appropriately to the cost and desired effect. I assume they are about the size of a thargoid drone. Probably spherical and whatever color is available. Maybe yellow or black.
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I already set my at stall out for ship and module info and why, so I won't repeat myself but I have a question: it's kinda bizarre to me that the game is so heavily reliant on 3rd party websites because I at least thought some of them were run by devs in their spare time but this doesn't seem to be the case. What happens if the sites eventually just fold or the owners become unwell or something?