Deleted member 115407
D
I refer to the condition as "Eliteism"
3.0 offers absolutely no protection against big player ships griefing small player ships
- Thread starter Sentience
- Start date
I refer to the condition as "Eliteism"
I don't get what you're saying and I'm seeing a lot of "Mobius". Do you have a reason why "FLAGS" won't work?
That's all I'm saying basically, for the first part of your comment, Everyone's happy (Virtually)
As for the second part: Geez, people can be childish being so quick to namecall...
Deleted member 115407
D
Risk vs. reward.
In Open you get the reward of unlimited social interaction, at the risk of PvP. Players can mitigate that risk by flying in Solo/PG, but the social reward is greatly reduced as a result.
Social interaction is a reward?
It can be. I just took my Chieftain into Jameson Memorial to fit out the final parts, and got interacted with on the way. Turns out that because you now go to the nearest station when you die, it is much quicker to have your behind handed to you on approach than it is to actually get there and dock.
Ok, it might cost a little more... Serves me right for taking a partially built ship along (I did finally decide to deploy weapons, but then remembered that I didn't have enough power for them! ).Deleted member 115407
D
Obviously it is, since so many CMDRs are willing to risk the dangers of Open to have access to it.
I'd be stoked if there was an in game reason for me to kill you (or for you to kill me). Meaningful PVP if you will. But apparently even asking that question is passive aggressive. So I will have to settle for, if the mood strikes, killing for killing's sake.
[video=youtube;pbwy-XP_FbM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbwy-XP_FbM[/video]
PvP flags are a horrible idea because they would kill piracy. If you want to interact with people without PvP then Mobius would be a good option.
You do understand that players can still pirate people, right? Its a flag, so those who want PVP interaction will still have it on.
I do believe that piracy is a part of Elite: Dangerous but even Piracy has a level of Consent between both players, killing a player doesn't. And that's my whole point, consenual interaction between players will make this game better.
To further prove my point, you have to realize that Combat Logging is still a thing so that kills Piracy more than the PVP "FLAGS" because people who Combat Log are either trying to purposely upset you or trying to avoid being pirated. People with their "FLAGS" on will let the pirate player know that a particualar player has consented to the consquences of being pirated, killed or "ganked" giving the game a flow. Social interaction is just a bonus for the "FLAGS" mechanic in general.
I've first started saying "FLAGS" when Frontier was reworking the C&P system, wondering how to give The Rich players and the "gankers" consequences for their actions to where I immediately said, you can't. You can't take enough money from the rich, you can't make Gankers care and even if you do and they will Combat Log to save their own skin so the problem will never be solved. Use "FLAGS" the problem will be solved. that's the whole point of it.
Yeah my group seal clubs and mines salt, I can honestly tell you this upfront. Dont care, its allowed by the game mechanics and I have a suspicion that FDEV like the salt on the forums.
Regardless, OPEN is open world pvp and its great.
Deleted member 115407
D
No, you.
One of the main points of Piracy is to go after the most vulnerable targets. If anyone who wants to play in open, but doesn't feel "up to snuff", can just turn on a PvE flag, then piracy will be truly dead.
No.
Isn't piracy dead already? We have Private Game, Solo Mode, and Combat Logging that have already killed Piracy with the High Value Targets hiding behind it. So, in my opinion "FLAGS" really won't do any harm until you get rid if the other three that stand in the pirates way. You know what I mean?
To further support my point, ObisdianAnt just made a video on the piracy aspect to the game and people are discussing PVP pirating right now. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MIg6Xm0LPZk
A person by the name of Captain Anopheles just said, and I quote "No PVP piracy makes video less useful." to which Terenin responded and I also quote
"PVP piracy is non-existent. It's nothing more than people roaming about looking for people to blow up for lolz, if they run into someone on their own level they can't beat, they just combat-log. No-one is interdicting the ever dwindling traders/miners/flying dead people in haulers or whatever that they might steal from, and then leave them alive after nicking the cargo. They just shoot to kill and maybe after will they consider scrounging the cargo.
You are asking ObsidianAnt to produce footage of a unicorn. Stop it."
So there are others that feel the same and there is fact rooted in this discussion, you.
PVP piracy was always tenuous, at best. There was no upside for the prey...it cost them repairs, cargo, and/or rebuys.
PVP died, along time ago in this game...when the first generation folks decided to find greener pastures. This wave is the second generation, risen from the ashes of the first....but the outcome will be the same. Fewer folks in Open, because the costs to the prey are still to high.
Combat logging killed PvP piracy. A player can just nope out of the interaction at any point in time, and log back in later with all their stuff intact. It'll never be hugely profitable without large tweaks, but epidemic level logging has rendered even piracy RP dead.
This is called Solo. You flag a desire to not interact with players, due to the potential of combat, by not flying with them, at any juncture. No MMO has this 'flag' feature; they just haven't been daft enough to have general population as a free for all. Open, is a free for all. The good news, is you can opt out, at any time. You can also block players to reduce future interaction chances.
If you can swap that flag in and out, at any time, it's going to be gamed by pretty much the entire community. They aren't ever used, because they don't work.
Last edited:
There is no true way to declare your intention to pirate in the first place. Pirate factions should give pirating missions, but the requirement should be that the piratee survives - this would require additional mechanics as part of the game. An actual way to target a ship (NPC or Player), pressing a button that flags that ship as an intended piracy target. Destruction of this ship is an instant fail - not only that, it would need to cost the pirate in the way of fines, thus making destruction of the piracy target totally against the pirates own interests.. A Pirate faction would not want it’s targets destroyed - repeat business, after all, is often more profitable than new business.
The pracy victim then gets a warning of “intent to pirate”, along with whatever message the pirate wants to send, or a generic one if that is their choice. An attack by the piratee will mean the pirate is no longer bound by the rules of piracy, in terms of keeping the victim alive. This means a player will have the choice to fight, or give in (along with fleeing).
The succesful completion of a piracy mission means the pirate in question recovers the required amount of goods, plus, the piracy victim remained alive, and preferably, has a reasonably undamaged ship.
Perhaps “Mass Lock” devices should be a thing for pirates, modules that allow small ships to mass lock large shops - so that piracy of, say, a T-9 or T-7 in a Cobra MKIII is possible.
These are just quick thoughts off the top of my head, having been pirated once in-game, by a player, I actually quite enjoyed the interaction. We had an interesting conversation about my un-armed ship - he was wondering why I was participating in a CG, in Open, un-armed. I then pointed out my reasoning.
My ship was an Asp X, midnight black paint job, set up for max speed but minimum power draw (low heat), and shielded just enough to allow me to take a few hits but get away, but not so much as to weight me down.
I explained that stealth (low heat signature) and speed were my tactics, and there was no my I’d be able to stand up to his engineered for combat FDL regardless (this made sense to him, once explained) - his demands, however, were reasonable, and I saw no point in risking a run, when 2 units of whatever I had was all that was requested.
It was fun, had me on edge in a way no NPC interaction ever has, we had a fun little chat, and everyone was happy in the end.
My only regret, is that I’ve only ever had one such encounter. The very rare instances in which I get interdicted (maybe 3 or 4 times since 1.0), have been people just shooting first. As I said, I know how to fly, and I know my skillset. I know how to set up my ships to get away, and I know how to fly to get away, I rarely lose a ring of my shields in these situations. Mostly, I am aware enough of my surroundings to avoid interdiction alltogether. I have been known to come back to a system with my engineered Vulture for the LULZ though, and whilst I’m not a good PvP combat pilot, I still find it fun.
The game has strong potential for PvP fun, but there are always a group of people that like to bully, because they can, there are always folks that just don’t want to play ball, so they play in PG or Solo (not judging here, it’s just how it is), and there are always ways to cheat the system that ruin it for everyone else.
Ideally, everyone would pay in the “spirit” of the game, but, as we know, it’s very hard to convince everyone to participate in this way.
Z...
The pracy victim then gets a warning of “intent to pirate”, along with whatever message the pirate wants to send, or a generic one if that is their choice. An attack by the piratee will mean the pirate is no longer bound by the rules of piracy, in terms of keeping the victim alive. This means a player will have the choice to fight, or give in (along with fleeing).
The succesful completion of a piracy mission means the pirate in question recovers the required amount of goods, plus, the piracy victim remained alive, and preferably, has a reasonably undamaged ship.
Perhaps “Mass Lock” devices should be a thing for pirates, modules that allow small ships to mass lock large shops - so that piracy of, say, a T-9 or T-7 in a Cobra MKIII is possible.
These are just quick thoughts off the top of my head, having been pirated once in-game, by a player, I actually quite enjoyed the interaction. We had an interesting conversation about my un-armed ship - he was wondering why I was participating in a CG, in Open, un-armed. I then pointed out my reasoning.
My ship was an Asp X, midnight black paint job, set up for max speed but minimum power draw (low heat), and shielded just enough to allow me to take a few hits but get away, but not so much as to weight me down.
I explained that stealth (low heat signature) and speed were my tactics, and there was no my I’d be able to stand up to his engineered for combat FDL regardless (this made sense to him, once explained) - his demands, however, were reasonable, and I saw no point in risking a run, when 2 units of whatever I had was all that was requested.
It was fun, had me on edge in a way no NPC interaction ever has, we had a fun little chat, and everyone was happy in the end.
My only regret, is that I’ve only ever had one such encounter. The very rare instances in which I get interdicted (maybe 3 or 4 times since 1.0), have been people just shooting first. As I said, I know how to fly, and I know my skillset. I know how to set up my ships to get away, and I know how to fly to get away, I rarely lose a ring of my shields in these situations. Mostly, I am aware enough of my surroundings to avoid interdiction alltogether. I have been known to come back to a system with my engineered Vulture for the LULZ though, and whilst I’m not a good PvP combat pilot, I still find it fun.
The game has strong potential for PvP fun, but there are always a group of people that like to bully, because they can, there are always folks that just don’t want to play ball, so they play in PG or Solo (not judging here, it’s just how it is), and there are always ways to cheat the system that ruin it for everyone else.
Ideally, everyone would pay in the “spirit” of the game, but, as we know, it’s very hard to convince everyone to participate in this way.
Z...
Last edited:
I disagree about your "no MMO as a 'flag' feature." DCUO literally has a feature that's called a "PVP flag" where you can freely engage with the opposing players regardless of level.
And I disagree with the notion that "FLAGS" will never work, mainly because they're used. But I'm sure you're notion of swapping a flag on and off at any time, wouldn't be the feature... I'm more than sure a competent developer like FD could put in a timer/barrier for when and where you can be able to turn it on and off. Heck, they have that 15sec wait time when you want to log out in combat, same thing with the PVP "FLAG". Plus this won't be a problem anyway because People who don't want to PVP will just leave it off, right? There is NO logical reason for someone to turn their flag on and off unless their bored in space but again: I'm sure there will be a timer for turning it on and off, along side the barrier of not being able to switch during combat and other physical situations.
Deleted member 115407
D
Here you go, you. Unicorn produced.
Don't tell me PvP piracy is non-existent in this game.
[video=youtube;p3Ol5FCPdgQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3Ol5FCPdgQ[/video]
[video=youtube;A_CkJ2Cclnc]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_CkJ2Cclnc[/video]
[video=youtube;1T0olHocAQY]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1T0olHocAQY[/video]
[video=youtube;P6s0StuxVGM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P6s0StuxVGM[/video]
[video=youtube;C623VAYIz4I]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C623VAYIz4I[/video]
[video=youtube;Qv8ozwpRqnE]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qv8ozwpRqnE[/video]
[video=youtube;eqNB7QFrFwQ]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eqNB7QFrFwQ[/video]
Last edited by a moderator: