The Python is annoyingly good for its price. Its the answer for every question in the mid-game.

One of the problems not yet mentioned here is the oversized power distributer for its class. Multi-rolls should not get
the oversized pd, just as cutter and clipper do not, how is python(or anaconda)any different? Its one thing if dedicated combat ships like fdl or gunship have class 7 and corvette class 8, to fully support their weapons loadout, but both python and anaconda have oversized pd that doesn’t make sense.
 
I think my problem is I don't really understand why it matters? I mean its not like jump range affects PvP or anything.



If you don't like the Conda thats fine, but why do you care if people use it to jump around the Galaxy quicker? How does that affect you and your experience in the game?

I didn't say i didn't like it. I own one. And i dont care if anyone uses it.
I said that to a poster that said it has the best jump in the game and it shouldn't. And I used that to make a point to you the python isnt op. In fact using your points the conda is. And wrote down some reasons to your question of why?. The python is far from op. But you use it as a bar to compare other ships to. When elite started the python was a bit op but far from it now.

Also i said it was my own opinion and that nobody should care about that.

You just used the wrong ship to compare to. As i stated the only downside to the conda is landing pad size.
 
More info on the python. It's considered a "classic" freighter and has had a long history in the Elite verse.
http://www.wischik.com/lu/senses/ffemanual.pdf#page=249&zoom=auto,-263,143

There's a nice short story that takes place in a python by Chris Booker, "Tales from the Frontier". (amazon preview)
rQde6M8.jpg
https://www.amazon.com/Elite-Tales-...swatch_0?_encoding=UTF8&qid=1522644433&sr=8-1
 
For multiple reasons. First off its a container ship of the game. Container ships are slow, not maneuverable, can carry a lot, can take a beating but doesn't go anywhere fast.

It never had a good jump range at the start of the game it just slowly got better and better till at this point its the best.

Why should a conda have a better jump range that the x ships.

Why should one of the big 3 have the best jump range.

Why should the conda have that big a jump range but the vette and cutter dont. Technically the vette should have just as much as its the feds big bad and needs to get to war zones etc fast.

For her size and weight she shouldn't jump those distances.

For example you could say that the conda is the Russian antanov. Can carry a lot. One of the biggest. And has its place but the antanov is slow. Needs multiple stops to refuel. I mean look at the cockpit cable ties holding things in place just like the antanov.

I mean the one of the only big downfalls of the conda is large pad landing. If any ship was going to get an op rating it would be the conda. Thats why people that love the conda will fight to the death to keep her the way she is.

And thats why I'll get a lot of hate for saying the above. But hey its only my opinion which doesn't mean anything. And I'm not trying to get her nerfed.

The python was originally designed in lore as a gunship/support ship for naval convoys which eventually made it into the civilian sector when other newer ships were made and she got a bit old.
It’s definitely NOT a container ship. When’s the last time you saw a navy fight with container ships?

Every time I see an NPC use an Anaconda, it’s for combat. System Security, pirates, bounty hunters, and navy ships, but never miners or cargo haulers. It’s a warship, plain and simple. An unusually versatile warship, but a warship nonetheless. Furthermore, you don’t put a huge hardpoint on a cargo ship.
 
It’s definitely NOT a container ship. When’s the last time you saw a navy fight with container ships?

Every time I see an NPC use an Anaconda, it’s for combat. System Security, pirates, bounty hunters, and navy ships, but never miners or cargo haulers. It’s a warship, plain and simple. An unusually versatile warship, but a warship nonetheless. Furthermore, you don’t put a huge hardpoint on a cargo ship.

Its not a warship plain and simple. As you say. Description says some small navy's use them as frigates or light cruisers. See below.
Fair enough not a container ship. Just feels that way to me due to when elite first came out it was pretty much made out to be that way. Lol mind you the ship descriptions have changed a bit over the years. I cant find the original description from 2014/15 lol.
A warship is the corvette though.

The Anaconda is the pride of Faulcon deLacy's shipyards. The design was first manufactured in 2856 by RimLiner Galactic. After numerous mergers the template was eventually owned by Faulcon deLacy, who have made only minor changes to the classic design. The Anaconda is a versatile craft that can transport large cargos as well as pack a decent punch. Some smaller navies use the Anaconda in the light cruiser and frigate roles. The Anaconda can also be upgraded with a docking bay allowing small fighters up to Sidewinder-size to be carried and launched, however most are only capable of supporting short-range fighters.
 
It is a matter of perspective and personal preference. And IMO one of few things that are well balanced in ED.
A lot of people seem to love python and consider it the best ship, but... personally i struggle to find purpose for it, apart from outpost trading.
Once you've actually tried all the different ships there is always one that is considerably better for specific thing you want to do. And this is how it should be with multipurpose ships...
 
Hopefully this will stop people from reacting to the title alone and actually read the OP like you are supposed to on a forum.
Good luck with that. In the context of this forum certain words in subject titles are less like units of language and more like magical incantations; use the wrong ones and all manner of horrors will be released into your thread. You can try to wrangle them back in with explanations, but more often than not you'll be like Mickey Mouse trying to reign in all those errant brooms.

(I also knew what you meant by "mid-game" in this context, but that's one of the most powerful incantations and should be used with great care.)

But luckily FDev weren't that stupid and allow us mere Commanders to own as few or as many ships as we like.
True, but they may have been as few as 49 votes away from being that stupid depending on how influential you believe the DDF to have been. (Stir, stir. ;))

Part of the problem (if one sees it as a problem) with multi-purpose ships out-conveniencing their more dedicated brethren is the zero cost of moving modules around. It's bad enough that players' own stored modules can be instantaneously swapped for free, but when you can speculatively buy stuff from the Outfitters and sell it back with no depreciation it largely makes non-Engineered module ownership moot. Your passenger Python becomes a trade Python in seconds, with no downsides. The only balancing factor is module availability, and that can be mitigated by buying modules and transferring them strategically around the bubble. (I have various large passenger modules stored at Merope for just this reason).

Please note that I'm not saying FD should change this. It's a game, and sometimes convenience has to win out over believability and complexity. But I'm convinced it's a factor in multi-purpose ship popularity. If it cost a few million credits every time a player refitted a Python, they might be more inclined to aim for multiple hulls and specialised builds. And if they're going to own multiple hulls, they might not all be Pythons.

(And I know some people do have multiple Pythons. I'm taking more generally.)

FWIW I never took to the Python. I've bought and sold several. I've got one in storage, partially Engineered, but I just don't enjoy flying it and I could never quite put my finger on why. Given its popularity and versatility, I really wish I could take to it.
 
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A minor redesign of the Clipper to achieve this is very much needed to make it a good alternative to the Python.

Agree, probably a pass on most of the early ships is required by now. Failing that more variants of the old ships or maybe some MKII versions?
 
Its not a warship plain and simple. As you say. Description says some small navy's use them as frigates or light cruisers. See below.
Fair enough not a container ship. Just feels that way to me due to when elite first came out it was pretty much made out to be that way. Lol mind you the ship descriptions have changed a bit over the years. I cant find the original description from 2014/15 lol.
A warship is the corvette though.

The Anaconda is the pride of Faulcon deLacy's shipyards. The design was first manufactured in 2856 by RimLiner Galactic. After numerous mergers the template was eventually owned by Faulcon deLacy, who have made only minor changes to the classic design. The Anaconda is a versatile craft that can transport large cargos as well as pack a decent punch. Some smaller navies use the Anaconda in the light cruiser and frigate roles. The Anaconda can also be upgraded with a docking bay allowing small fighters up to Sidewinder-size to be carried and launched, however most are only capable of supporting short-range fighters.

And a thing to consider is the in the Elite Universe all ships are armed, rather than looking at then as Modern container ships that are unarmed, best to look back at the age of sail, when Merchant ships were armed.

The Python and the Anaconda are Freighters but armed freighters to deter pirates, and can be armed for conflict, just as a Carrack could hold a lot of cargo, or guns and soldiers or used for exploration.

The Differences in concept of the ships has been lost in changes of Game mechanics or ones that don't exist in game mechanics but do exist in the Lore of the universe.

The "Trade ships" Like the Lakon Type Series would be low cost ships in terms of running costs, maintenance, and crew to run them.
They carry lots of lower margin goods, but their low running costs allow them to still turn a profit and exploit A->B->A or such trade loops.
Their are lightly armed but carry low value cargo and likely run in secure space.
Economic Passenger transport on set routes would also be this type of ships bread and butter.

ZPGs Hauler also would fall into this Category

"Armed Traders" by comparison, are for high value and higher risk trade routes, and so carry better arms, but that comes at a cost of increased running costs and higher crew. For example of the EDRPG is to go by the Python needs a crew of four to the Type 7s three and the Anacondas eight to the Type 9s six.
With the higher running costs, they would look for the higher value higher margin goods, and so more susceptible to market fluctuations as so would be more of a Tramp trader operation, and would move about more, and in the passenger sphere be the Economy Charter runs
Local Militaries and Security forces can outfit them for combat by replacing cargo capacity for military and support equipment.

ZPGs Adder as the budget entry & Falcoun DeLaceys Cobra Mk.III and IV, Python & Anaconda Freighters

Lakon being the Industrial low cost player on the markets, has their Asp and Diamondback series, but are a step in-between the two, having lower crews and maintenance costs (due to being build for scouting and exploration so aim for easy field maintenance and redundency of systems).

The Gutamaya on the other hand is the Prestige Manufacturer , even more costly to run and maintain, would focus on high value contracts be it cargo runs or Business and First Class transport, as it cannot afford to run on basic market trading.
It is a high speed vessels with the Cutter, Courier and the Clipper, they would focus on either very high margin trading that would be short lived in any given market, or high urgency delivery and supply missions, and Corporate Charters, as well as for the Empire Diplomatic efforts.

Again both can be Set up for Military Service, with Lakon being the more economic choice.

On the Combat leaning side, where we should see versatility on cargo and equipment replaced with armour shielding, weapons and the top in systems to keep those system powered and fighting;

Core Dynamics naturally have all ships of war, with the Vulture Assault, Gun and Dropships and the Corvette, and in contrast to Gutamaya, are built around ease of maintenance and repair, but with extra crew than the minimum for redundancy.

Falcoun deLacy Entries of the Vipers Mk.III and Mk.IV fall in there as well as would the Eagle Mk.I but aim for the one crew System Security market so given the closer to home intended area of operations, are probably a bit higher on the maintenance needs as they would be expected to have short deployments when put next to a Federal battle group operating many jumps from home weeks on end.

Both Gutamaya and Core Dynamics have a flavour of Eagle Fighter, which is a copy of the Falcoun Delacy long Range Eagle Fighter (Mk.I) and I would imagine the Eagle Mk.I would sit between the Federal Eagle and Imperial Eagle in both running costs and versatility.
So the Federal Eagle Mk.II is tough cheap to run, the Imperial Eagle Mk.III is costly but has better components, and the Original whilst not as rugged as the Mk.II offers better core internals but not to the level of the Mk.III, showing off the different design philosophies of the Shipyards, just as we do with the SLFs

Saud Kruger as we know has the high end luxury Liner, that whilst paying a hefty fee for such luxury in terms of crew and maintenance costs, ne where it is at for High Ranking VIP Transport and Charter Cruises, as well as the Tours of the key sights in the Galaxy offering from Economy cabins all the way to luxury but still drawing top credit for even the economic cabins due to the prestige of the ship, and the facilities on board.

Whilst in Game transporting a Head of State may fill one Luxury Cabin, I would imagine it more that the HoS and staff takes that cabin but then there is also other Ministerial Staff in First Class, Reporters in business and security & sundry staff in economy filling an entire Beluga on a tour of Star Ports Controlled by the Faction the HoS belongs to or perhaps the Key Star Ports of Trade Partners.

The Fer Der Lance being an outlier as it is by ZPG who specialise in low cost ships but made in Collaboration of Saud Kruger for luxury, and it is a combat focus ship, but is not used by any Navy or Security force (Private/Paramilitary Power Play Agents aside), but really would end up being a Prestige ship, with high running costs, focused on high paying contracts, be it VIP Transport, small valuable cargo or data, or the clichéd for the FDL, assassinations.

So in effect you have a Matrix of sorts of ship Type be it, to given an idea of running costs, crew requirements, armament capabilities, and focus of Core and Optional internals
Trader
Armed Trader
Combat Ship
Passenger Liners

And then the Manufacturer who would modify the running costs of the ship
Low Cost easy field maintenance with redundency Lakon Spaceways
Entry Level & Budget Zorgon Petersen Group
Mid Range and Versatile Falcoun deLacy
Roust and Easy to Repair but for a Military Crew Core Dynamics
The High Price Prestige of Gutamaya
and the Costly Luxury of Saud Kruger

And Yes I left out exploration as a role, as the Lakon entries would tie it up nicely if you combine the Lakon Philosophy of low cost, easy field maintenance with redundancy, with the "armed Trader" suitability of leaving the safety patrolled space with the capacity to trade cargo capacity for exploration tools, just as they can be refit for war cover off the role well, but if you wanted more arms or luxury in your exploration, you have other Shipyards to turn to

and thus tying back into the mention of the Carrack at the start, a ship that could carry cargo, guns soldiers, and supplies for exploration, in what ever combination seemed suitable for the tasks.
 
And a thing to consider is the in the Elite Universe all ships are armed, rather than looking at then as Modern container ships that are unarmed, best to look back at the age of sail, when Merchant ships were armed.

The Python and the Anaconda are Freighters but armed freighters to deter pirates, and can be armed for conflict, just as a Carrack could hold a lot of cargo, or guns and soldiers or used for exploration.

The Differences in concept of the ships has been lost in changes of Game mechanics or ones that don't exist in game mechanics but do exist in the Lore of the universe.

The "Trade ships" Like the Lakon Type Series would be low cost ships in terms of running costs, maintenance, and crew to run them.
They carry lots of lower margin goods, but their low running costs allow them to still turn a profit and exploit A->B->A or such trade loops.
Their are lightly armed but carry low value cargo and likely run in secure space.
Economic Passenger transport on set routes would also be this type of ships bread and butter.

ZPGs Hauler also would fall into this Category

"Armed Traders" by comparison, are for high value and higher risk trade routes, and so carry better arms, but that comes at a cost of increased running costs and higher crew. For example of the EDRPG is to go by the Python needs a crew of four to the Type 7s three and the Anacondas eight to the Type 9s six.
With the higher running costs, they would look for the higher value higher margin goods, and so more susceptible to market fluctuations as so would be more of a Tramp trader operation, and would move about more, and in the passenger sphere be the Economy Charter runs
Local Militaries and Security forces can outfit them for combat by replacing cargo capacity for military and support equipment.

ZPGs Adder as the budget entry & Falcoun DeLaceys Cobra Mk.III and IV, Python & Anaconda Freighters

Lakon being the Industrial low cost player on the markets, has their Asp and Diamondback series, but are a step in-between the two, having lower crews and maintenance costs (due to being build for scouting and exploration so aim for easy field maintenance and redundency of systems).

The Gutamaya on the other hand is the Prestige Manufacturer , even more costly to run and maintain, would focus on high value contracts be it cargo runs or Business and First Class transport, as it cannot afford to run on basic market trading.
It is a high speed vessels with the Cutter, Courier and the Clipper, they would focus on either very high margin trading that would be short lived in any given market, or high urgency delivery and supply missions, and Corporate Charters, as well as for the Empire Diplomatic efforts.

Again both can be Set up for Military Service, with Lakon being the more economic choice.

On the Combat leaning side, where we should see versatility on cargo and equipment replaced with armour shielding, weapons and the top in systems to keep those system powered and fighting;

Core Dynamics naturally have all ships of war, with the Vulture Assault, Gun and Dropships and the Corvette, and in contrast to Gutamaya, are built around ease of maintenance and repair, but with extra crew than the minimum for redundancy.

Falcoun deLacy Entries of the Vipers Mk.III and Mk.IV fall in there as well as would the Eagle Mk.I but aim for the one crew System Security market so given the closer to home intended area of operations, are probably a bit higher on the maintenance needs as they would be expected to have short deployments when put next to a Federal battle group operating many jumps from home weeks on end.

Both Gutamaya and Core Dynamics have a flavour of Eagle Fighter, which is a copy of the Falcoun Delacy long Range Eagle Fighter (Mk.I) and I would imagine the Eagle Mk.I would sit between the Federal Eagle and Imperial Eagle in both running costs and versatility.
So the Federal Eagle Mk.II is tough cheap to run, the Imperial Eagle Mk.III is costly but has better components, and the Original whilst not as rugged as the Mk.II offers better core internals but not to the level of the Mk.III, showing off the different design philosophies of the Shipyards, just as we do with the SLFs

Saud Kruger as we know has the high end luxury Liner, that whilst paying a hefty fee for such luxury in terms of crew and maintenance costs, ne where it is at for High Ranking VIP Transport and Charter Cruises, as well as the Tours of the key sights in the Galaxy offering from Economy cabins all the way to luxury but still drawing top credit for even the economic cabins due to the prestige of the ship, and the facilities on board.

Whilst in Game transporting a Head of State may fill one Luxury Cabin, I would imagine it more that the HoS and staff takes that cabin but then there is also other Ministerial Staff in First Class, Reporters in business and security & sundry staff in economy filling an entire Beluga on a tour of Star Ports Controlled by the Faction the HoS belongs to or perhaps the Key Star Ports of Trade Partners.

The Fer Der Lance being an outlier as it is by ZPG who specialise in low cost ships but made in Collaboration of Saud Kruger for luxury, and it is a combat focus ship, but is not used by any Navy or Security force (Private/Paramilitary Power Play Agents aside), but really would end up being a Prestige ship, with high running costs, focused on high paying contracts, be it VIP Transport, small valuable cargo or data, or the clichéd for the FDL, assassinations.

So in effect you have a Matrix of sorts of ship Type be it, to given an idea of running costs, crew requirements, armament capabilities, and focus of Core and Optional internals
Trader
Armed Trader
Combat Ship
Passenger Liners

And then the Manufacturer who would modify the running costs of the ship
Low Cost easy field maintenance with redundency Lakon Spaceways
Entry Level & Budget Zorgon Petersen Group
Mid Range and Versatile Falcoun deLacy
Roust and Easy to Repair but for a Military Crew Core Dynamics
The High Price Prestige of Gutamaya
and the Costly Luxury of Saud Kruger

And Yes I left out exploration as a role, as the Lakon entries would tie it up nicely if you combine the Lakon Philosophy of low cost, easy field maintenance with redundancy, with the "armed Trader" suitability of leaving the safety patrolled space with the capacity to trade cargo capacity for exploration tools, just as they can be refit for war cover off the role well, but if you wanted more arms or luxury in your exploration, you have other Shipyards to turn to

and thus tying back into the mention of the Carrack at the start, a ship that could carry cargo, guns soldiers, and supplies for exploration, in what ever combination seemed suitable for the tasks.

Nice explanation. Totally forgot about the merchant ships of old. There we go anaconda could be a merchant ship.lol
 
Well I might have a few ships in the garage for that odd occasion, but the Python is the car I drive to work everyday.
 
Huh what you talking about, the best ship in the game hands down is the anaconda, simple as that , can move alot of cargo if need be, can be a great combat ship, can run a crap ton of pass missions, and is the best jumper in the game.

But it can't land on medium pads, this it isn't the best ship in the game. Though it is great, but once you get the rest of the big ships you only need it for the exploration role.
 
The Python is annoyingly good for its price. Its the answer for every question in the mid-game.

Is that so?

Fer De Lance? Yes its a much better dedicated combat ship.. (and cheaper, -az)
Clipper? Python has better damage. Though admittedly the Clipper can run circles around the Python in terms of actual performance....
Dolphin? Dolphin is faster, has better handling and jump range (and much cheaper, -az I noticed you docked price for ships but never docked price for the python when it was more expensive)
Orca? Orca is much faster and handles much better

So, what you meant to say was:

"The python is a much better multi-role ship than the ships not designed to be multi-role ships." Well, what a shock?

I mean, you listed a ton of ships that you admit perform better in their role then the python but then say "but then again if I want to do this other thing at the same time...?" as if it's a dock against the other ship or a point for the python when doing the specialized thing which it's not. If I want a dedicated combat ship I'm going to make a dedicated combat ship and I won't be making sure it can run passenger missions at the same time. If I want to haul cargo I won't be wasting weight on throwing weapons on the damn thing. What you want, based on your gripes, is for every ship to be a multi-role ship that does everything in the game super great all at the same time no matter what and sorry but that's an Elite Dangerous I do not want to play. Even if that were the case, there would still be a "best" ship for the price range, no matter what, because something will always be the best.

A correct statement would be:

The Python is annoyingly versatile for its price. Its the easiest answer for every question in the mid-game.

...and...

"Sure I could use *insert ship here*, but I already own a Python and I can just swap it's modules around."

Which, yeah I agree, is much easier then getting a whole new ship, working with it's limitations knowing that what you bought it for is the only thing you'll be using it for.
 
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Its the best ship in the game, no doubt. Of the big three i have owned a couple of anacondas and the python is a better ship by far. Imo the only good use for an anaconda is seed money to get a python.

Part of the reason why the Python is one of the best ships in the game is it's flexibility. It can be good at any role it is focused on but it's not the best at those roles. Also, the Anaconda is better than a Python due to said flexibility. It can do everything the Python can and is also one of the best ships for exploration.
 
I'm having a hard time deciding to pick between the Clipper or the Python for exploring. Python I can load out with both Repair Limpets and Fuel Limpets plus AFMU but I hate the window screen and the SC handling is OK. Clipper I can have either the Repair Limpets or Fuel Limpets not both because I want an extra fuel tank since the stock 16t is crap. And the window screen and SC handling is just gorgeous.
 
I'm having a hard time deciding to pick between the Clipper or the Python for exploring. Python I can load out with both Repair Limpets and Fuel Limpets plus AFMU but I hate the window screen and the SC handling is OK. Clipper I can have either the Repair Limpets or Fuel Limpets not both because I want an extra fuel tank since the stock 16t is crap. And the window screen and SC handling is just gorgeous.

I worked very hard to get my Clipper, but the lack of a medium pad and the fact the Python could carry MUCH more stuff more efficiently I had to go back to using it.



I fully intend on grabbing the Clipper at some point after I grab my Conda and use it for bounty hunting.
 
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