A Guide to Minor Factions and the Background Sim

[Jmanis]

Out of interest... we know missions don't help a faction in a war/civil war state.

What about the negative effects of a mission? Say Faction A issues a mission that has a positive effect on Faction A and a negative effect on Faction B. Faction B is in a war state, Faction A isn't. Doing the mission counts for the positive influence because Faction A is not in a war state. What about the -ve for B?

 

[Starwolfe]

Referring to states like Boom or Famine? Those still take effect.

 

[Jmanis]

Referring to states like Boom or Famine? Those still take effect.

I meant influence.

 

[Starwolfe]

Not as far as I have been able to tell.

Most everything does not effect influence in Wars or Civil Wars. No Missions, Passengers, Trade, Exploration can effect influence during it.
That includes the negative impacts like sales on Black Markets for most factions or opposing direct influence hits from those activities.
The only way it does hit is as a by-product by doing work for other factions to take up influence in the system.

The only two things that do add influence are Bounties and Bonds - and Murder can still negatively effect the faction.

 

[Fett_Li]

Speaking of which...IF's are inf black holes, right? No inf goes to the station owner of the IF, right?

Right.

 

[Romeo Alpha]

Hi guys. Random question ... can a faction re-expand to a system they retreated from? I have a feeling I know the answer but I want to confirm. Thanks, all.

 

[Starwolfe]

Hi guys. Random question ... can a faction re-expand to a system they retreated from? I have a feeling I know the answer but I want to confirm. Thanks, all.

Yes.

In theory a recent patch made it less likely to do that, but it should still be possible.

 

[Ryan Murdoc]

Several people have reported that Expansions went right back into the Systems they had previously retreated out of. That was just after the 3.0 patch, if there have been any improvements made with the subsequent patches I don't know.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

Hi guys. Random question ... can a faction re-expand to a system they retreated from? I have a feeling I know the answer but I want to confirm. Thanks, all.

It can be done - but if there's somewhere new in range, it'll go there instead. As far as I can tell, the order of priority for expansions is now (usually, surprises are possible):

1) System not previously retreated from, within expansion range, less than 7 factions
2) System previously retreated from since 2.4, within expansion range, less than 7 factions
3) System not previously retreated from, within expansion range, 7 factions {Invasion: requires no pending conflicts and suitable target faction for immediate War}
4) System previously retreated from, within expansion range, 7 factions {Invasion: requires no pending conflicts and suitable target faction for immediate War}
5) Investment: boost range and try again
6) Give up generating expansion states in this system for a while

Then, it will generally go for the nearest within a priority if there's more than one, though small difference in distances (e.g. 18.72 rather than 18.39) may be ignored.

You may see older documentation claiming a fixed (pre- or post-Investment) expansion range. This no longer seems to be the case, as I've seen unInvested expansions go a bit over 25 ... but also sometimes factions fail to reach somewhere closer than 25 without Investment.

Permit systems are much harder to expand into, but I don't have anywhere near enough information on how much harder as there aren't any in my region of expertise - it might be "they fit in between 1 and 2", "they fit in between 2 and 3", "they fit in between 4 and 5" or "when we said much harder we actually meant impossible".

A very small number of systems are completely locked to expansion - Shinrarta Dezhra, the three superpower capitals, Colonia and Ratraii, the detention centres ... maybe a few others. (These can be detected before trying to expand by trying to start a conflict between two already-present factions: in a locked system this won't work either)

 

[Jmanis]

So, dumb question.

War short-circuits Expansion states to provide the expansion state early.
But does war make the Retreat state fail? Same tick, a faction I expected to retreat from a system (at some point) who has been at 1% constantly (and still is) just went into a None state in that same system (and is still present) and is now at war elsewhere... seemingly stopping the retreat from completing

That correct?

EDIT: Resolved, see below.

 

[Starwolfe]

So, dumb question.

War short-circuits Expansion states to provide the expansion state early.
But does war make the Retreat state fail? Same tick, a faction I expected to retreat from a system (at some point) who has been at 1% constantly (and still is) just went into a None state in that same system (and is still present) and is now at war elsewhere... seemingly stopping the retreat from completing

That correct?

It will function similar.

A Retreat cut short and under 2.5% will succeed. If its above 2.5% it will fail when its cut short.

 

[Jmanis]

It will function similar.

A Retreat cut short and under 2.5% will succeed. If its above 2.5% it will fail when its cut short.

Well, that's definitely not what just happened :/ 1% with no fluctuations for the last 5 days, retreat started 2-3 days ago and it got short-circuited after the most recent tick. Faction still at 1%, still present.

Disregard. They retreated from a different system. Guess they're getting smashed everywhere XD

 

[Sousandenar]

Wing mission on BGS

If a wing mission is delivered by each player, will it count as only one mission or four to the BGS?

 

[Jane Turner]

If a wing mission is delivered by each player, will it count as only one mission or four to the BGS?

Its appears to count as just one.

 

[RebelTheorist]

Hi All, Advice needed please..... I have just had it confirmed that our PMF is due for the last pass of checks.... script run by FDEV engineering, problem is that this may be done in a week or two and our chosen system now has 7 factions due to expansion.

Is one to two weeks enough time to get a faction into retreat and which faction should we focus on? The smallest with 4.5% but in BOOM or one that is at WAR with 12.5%?

What are the best tactics for the quickest results?

Thank you in advance.

 

[Starwolfe]

Hi All, Advice needed please..... I have just had it confirmed that our PMF is due for the last pass of checks.... script run by FDEV engineering, problem is that this may be done in a week or two and our chosen system now has 7 factions due to expansion.

Is one to two weeks enough time to get a faction into retreat and which faction should we focus on? The smallest with 4.5% but in BOOM or one that is at WAR with 12.5%?

What are the best tactics for the quickest results?

Thank you in advance.

First, make sure the faction is non-native to the system, you cannot retreat a faction from its home system.
Use EDDB or Inara to find that out, as they tend to be pretty good at helping that information.

The retreat mechanic merely requires no active or recovering conflicts to get a pending Retreat, and only needs to be below 2.5% to start. Some other states with minimum duration may delay it, but not many or for long.

The Retreat itself tends to take about a week nowadays, and can be cut-short by having a conflict go pending in another system after the retreat is pending, forcing it to potentially 3 days until the conflict is active.
Typically a Retreat is 1 day pending, 5-7 days active and a 1 day recovery before you can try again. If you get a conflict started the 3 days pending will allow the Retreat to continue then when the conflict is active the retreat ends.
So long as you keep the influence low, the faction will leave basically.

All that is required is to try and keep the faction in question below 2.5% by the time it leaves. If the retreat goes on naturally that is assumed to be below 2.5% around Day 5 active, but its simply safer to keep their influence low regardless.


To keep it low, direct negative influence actions are the best bet. That is Murder of their Clean NPC faction ships, Black Market sales into a port with a BM they own and they are not anarchy and missions that have negative influence effects like Assassinations or Skimmer missions targeted at them.

Otherwise, just work excessively for every other faction in the system to increase them and push the desired faction down.


If you are lucky, and its a low-traffic system it may be relatively easy to accomplish.

 

[RebelTheorist]

First, make sure the faction is non-native to the system, you cannot retreat a faction from its home system.
Use EDDB or Inara to find that out, as they tend to be pretty good at helping that information.

The retreat mechanic merely requires no active or recovering conflicts to get a pending Retreat, and only needs to be below 2.5% to start. Some other states with minimum duration may delay it, but not many or for long.

The Retreat itself tends to take about a week nowadays, and can be cut-short by having a conflict go pending in another system after the retreat is pending, forcing it to potentially 3 days until the conflict is active.
Typically a Retreat is 1 day pending, 5-7 days active and a 1 day recovery before you can try again. If you get a conflict started the 3 days pending will allow the Retreat to continue then when the conflict is active the retreat ends.
So long as you keep the influence low, the faction will leave basically.

All that is required is to try and keep the faction in question below 2.5% by the time it leaves. If the retreat goes on naturally that is assumed to be below 2.5% around Day 5 active, but its simply safer to keep their influence low regardless.


To keep it low, direct negative influence actions are the best bet. That is Murder of their Clean NPC faction ships, Black Market sales into a port with a BM they own and they are not anarchy and missions that have negative influence effects like Assassinations or Skimmer missions targeted at them.

Otherwise, just work excessively for every other faction in the system to increase them and push the desired faction down.


If you are lucky, and its a low-traffic system it may be relatively easy to accomplish.

Rep'd. Thank you. Better get cracking!!!

 

[RebelTheorist]

First, make sure the faction is non-native to the system, you cannot retreat a faction from its home system.
Use EDDB or Inara to find that out, as they tend to be pretty good at helping that information.

The retreat mechanic merely requires no active or recovering conflicts to get a pending Retreat, and only needs to be below 2.5% to start. Some other states with minimum duration may delay it, but not many or for long.

The Retreat itself tends to take about a week nowadays, and can be cut-short by having a conflict go pending in another system after the retreat is pending, forcing it to potentially 3 days until the conflict is active.
Typically a Retreat is 1 day pending, 5-7 days active and a 1 day recovery before you can try again. If you get a conflict started the 3 days pending will allow the Retreat to continue then when the conflict is active the retreat ends.
So long as you keep the influence low, the faction will leave basically.

All that is required is to try and keep the faction in question below 2.5% by the time it leaves. If the retreat goes on naturally that is assumed to be below 2.5% around Day 5 active, but its simply safer to keep their influence low regardless.


To keep it low, direct negative influence actions are the best bet. That is Murder of their Clean NPC faction ships, Black Market sales into a port with a BM they own and they are not anarchy and missions that have negative influence effects like Assassinations or Skimmer missions targeted at them.

Otherwise, just work excessively for every other faction in the system to increase them and push the desired faction down.


If you are lucky, and its a low-traffic system it may be relatively easy to accomplish.

The system is Beta Circini, 2 non resident factions, which would you advise we focus on? I just dont want to make the wrong decision and not get this done in time.

 

[Falco75]

The system is Beta Circini, 2 non resident factions, which would you advise we focus on? I just dont want to make the wrong decision and not get this done in time.

Very hard.
The most likely faction to pull out is Marubal progressive party, it is NOT anarchic and you will take a LOT of bounties killing their ships at sight.

Also, the system is a whopping 7.51 billion so it will take a LOT of efforts to pull down that faction to 2.5%.

The other faction "skolugumari something" is at war, if it is in some CZ you could easily focus on them, but you must take them down as crazy, you'll need many people doing that, they are now at 11.1% and in CZ you will take down their influence very fast but they are starting much higher than the other faction.

Your choice.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

The system is Beta Circini, 2 non resident factions, which would you advise we focus on? I just dont want to make the wrong decision and not get this done in time.

The Marubal Progressive Party would probably be quicker to get into Retreat - hit them hard enough and they can be pending tomorrow, live Saturday.

The Skogulumari Patrons of Law are already in a War, which you'd have to end before you could start getting a retreat pending, and then you'd have to hope it didn't go in Chujohimba instead where they're already getting close to the threshold. On the other hand the War gives easier options to reduce their influence further quickly (by intensively getting bonds for their opposition) to get it going as soon as the War ends and it would be easier to get them into a second conflict in another system to shorten the Retreat duration - whereas the Marubal option would almost certainly go the full length and need constant maintenance.