PvP The PvE <-> PvP Rift

[lenna]

Regardless of whether you engage NPC's or human's, the entire point for the Vette/Cutter pilot is to be 100% insulated from danger.

As a Corvette pilot myself, I believe you are talking rubbish. The big 4 do require slightly different tactics but to claim that their purpose is to be 100% insulated from danger is just meta-sheep rubbish.

As for the "stacking", it is not restricted to the Corvette/Cutter but applies to ALL the big 4 and possibly some others too. It is not just restricted to the shields either. There are some legitimate non-combat reasons for some of the "excessive" stacking cases but that could be handled in other ways in theory.

FTR I normally do not stack more than two boosters/HRP on any ship (1 or 2 exceptions may have 4 shield boosters).

As for the OP's suggestions, I disagree with their general perspective and personal views wrt how to approach the perceived issues in play.

 

[lenna]

You want rare to never.

As is our right (at least where PG/Solo is concerned), the problem with PvP in mixed mode environments is that it invariably ends up with atleast some taking liberties and engaging in extreme behaviours that should not be permitted (e.g. griefing and habitual ganking). This in turn results in some like myself avoiding Open because of such people.

Those of us that avoid open for such reasons are not against PvP being part of ED just against certain PvP behaviours being permitted.

PvP is an optional part of ED, you don't like it - go back to playing EvE or similar games.

 

[jasonbarron]

As a Corvette pilot myself, I believe you are talking rubbish. The big 4 do require slightly different tactics but to claim that their purpose is to be 100% insulated from danger is just meta-sheep rubbish.

As for the "stacking", it is not restricted to the Corvette/Cutter but applies to ALL the big 4 and possibly some others too. It is not just restricted to the shields either. There are some legitimate non-combat reasons for some of the "excessive" stacking cases but that could be handled in other ways in theory.

FTR I normally do not stack more than two boosters/HRP on any ship (1 or 2 exceptions may have 4 shield boosters).

As for the OP's suggestions, I disagree with their general perspective and personal views wrt how to approach the perceived issues in play.

Speaking of following the herd, what else would someone who stays insulated in both group and a Corvette say?

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Speaking of following the herd, what else would someone who stays insulated in both group and a Corvette say?

Who cares? Their Corvette is probably a rebuy waiting to happen too!

 

[jasonbarron]

Who cares? Their Corvette is probably a rebuy waiting to happen to.

Not in group

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

Not in group

We'll never know.

 

[Sole Hunter]

Sole Hunter, Algomatic, what is this extra risk in Open that you see and I don't?

You can be attacked by another player, but you can team up too. Surely it evens out? I play in Open & don't feel I am at more of a risk, it is a little more exciting because you are less certain about what is going to happen next.

As far as I can see the only reason anyone might think it's more difficult in Open is because players such as you two (straghtforward, honest in intent PKers, good at it too) are out there. So what makes you think it's more dangerous? Who or what are you afraid of?

the extra risk of dying by a player.

 

[Mohrgan]

It's mentioned all of the time that it's easy to be safe in open. Just stay away from hot spots, is the constant refrain. Until there is talk of a bonus, or the dreaded shieldless trader, that is. It's just common to hear that no one need loose a ship in open, because the ease in which one can high wake to safety.

Plus, I hear from the best of sources that open isn't the constant frag-fest it's made out to be. Once again, unless we are discussing incentivizing open. In those cases, the open-only crowd would have everyone believe in the open that is constantly fraught with perils, from the most ultimate of predators.

Which one is it? No one knows, except we're adamant that it completely depends on the conversation, and which version will promote more targets in open on that occasion.

That's why I contend that rewards should be based on actually facing a PvP challenge, and not just for choosing open. Let FD give mission rewards for facing, and finishing a PvP encounter, while completing a mission. Give a bonus for winning, and losing. That way, deciding to play in Solo/PG keeps it's content, and PvP gets a shout out, that is actually deserved.

 

[jasonbarron]

It's mentioned all of the time that it's easy to be safe in open. Just stay away from hot spots, is the constant refrain. Until there is talk of a bonus, or the dreaded shieldless trader, that is. It's just common to hear that no one need loose a ship in open, because the ease in which one can high wake to safety.

Plus, I hear from the best of sources that open isn't the constant frag-fest it's made out to be. Once again, unless we are discussing incentivizing open. In those cases, the open-only crowd would have everyone believe in the open that is constantly fraught with perils, from the most ultimate of predators.

Which one is it? No one knows, except we're adamant that it completely depends on the conversation, and which version will promote more targets in open on that occasion.

That's why I contend that rewards should be based on actually facing a PvP challenge, and not just for choosing open. Let FD give mission rewards for facing, and finishing a PvP encounter, while completing a mission. Give a bonus for winning, and losing. That way, deciding to play in Solo/PG keeps it's content, and PvP gets a shout out, that is actually deserved.

I've been at the CG all weekend, and it's pretty fraggy tbh. Personally speaking, I killed almost thirty CMDR's yesterday right in the no fire-zone of the station. I just bagged a Unicorn a few minutes ago in the local High Res. So, not very safe

 

[ALGOMATIC]

It's mentioned all of the time that it's easy to be safe in open. Just stay away from hot spots, is the constant refrain. Until there is talk of a bonus, or the dreaded shieldless trader, that is. It's just common to hear that no one need loose a ship in open, because the ease in which one can high wake to safety.

Plus, I hear from the best of sources that open isn't the constant frag-fest it's made out to be. Once again, unless we are discussing incentivizing open. In those cases, the open-only crowd would have everyone believe in the open that is constantly fraught with perils, from the most ultimate of predators.

Which one is it? No one knows, except we're adamant that it completely depends on the conversation, and which version will promote more targets in open on that occasion.

That's why I contend that rewards should be based on actually facing a PvP challenge, and not just for choosing open. Let FD give mission rewards for facing, and finishing a PvP encounter, while completing a mission. Give a bonus for winning, and losing. That way, deciding to play in Solo/PG keeps it's content, and PvP gets a shout out, that is actually deserved.

I can agree with this because its true that except the hot spots you will never see another player in any mode. I think the CG should have different payouts in each mode. This will bring piracy and proper bounty hunting back to the game.

 

[Mohrgan]

I've been at the CG all weekend, and it's pretty fraggy tbh. Personally speaking, I killed almost thirty CMDR's yesterday right in the no fire-zone of the station. I just bagged a Unicorn a few minutes ago in the local High Res. So, not very safe

One of the Hot Spot one is told to avoid...

 

[jasonbarron]

One of the Hot Spot one is told to avoid...

Exactly. Now, imagine if I could get my hands on the various players influencing the bgs or a power play system we were mutually interested in. Those areas would become player hot spots, too, and I would be allowed to take several thousand hours of tools and practice off the shelf and use them to influence the outcome

 

[Mohrgan]

I can agree with this because its true that except the hot spots you will never see another player in any mode. I think the CG should have different payouts in each mode. This will bring piracy and proper bounty hunting back to the game.

I don't see why a PvP reward, such as I outline often, can't be applied to a CG. I do think CG's are part of FD's way to promote consensual PvP. Creating PvP opportunity 'Gold Rushes'. People interested, traders and 'pirates' alike, know where to go. Why not give both sides of an encounter something to take away from accepting the risk of another player?

 

[ALGOMATIC]

I don't see why a PvP reward, such as I outline often, can't be applied to a CG. I do think CG's are part of FD's way to promote consensual PvP. Creating PvP opportunity 'Gold Rushes'. People interested, traders and 'pirates' alike, know where to go. Why not give both sides of an encounter something to take away from accepting the risk of another player?

Well thats what I meant. A trader gets a % buff in their cargo sales. Trading in open becomes worth while. More traders in open more pirates more bounty hunters. The food chain works.

 

[Mohrgan]

Exactly. Now, imagine if I could get my hands on the various players influencing the bgs or a power play system we were mutually interested in. Those areas would become player hot spots, too, and I would be allowed to take several thousand hours of tools and practice off the shelf and use them to influence the outcome

I've outlined a way to do that, without taking anything away from anyone, a number of times. Give a bonus in 'Influence' to Commanders that finish out PvP encounters. It adds a reward, to the winner and loser of an engagement, for facing another Commander.

The only caveat that remains, is that each Commander, from either side of the conflict, chooses to play in open. The draw would be the reward given for competing, rather than just logging in in open.

 

[Mohrgan]

Well thats what I meant. A trader gets a % buff in their cargo sales. Trading in open becomes worth while. More traders in open more pirates more bounty hunters. The food chain works.

No, a trader get's a reward, of influence over the outcome, along with the pirate, win or lose. The winner would just get more. Not a flat bonus to bait players into open. But, a reward for actually taking on other Commanders. This is an important distinction.

 

[Riverside]

the extra risk of dying by a player.

Is this something you specifically are concerned about, or are you assuming other players consider open more dangerous? I'm pretty sure I'm less capable of surviving than you against another player but I don't consider it a higher risk overall because A) it's easy enough to avoid gankers, and B) I can get help.

A commonly stated belief is that death is entirely optional in this game. This is incompatible with the concept that Open is more dangerous, it's one or the other. So which is it, for you? Not for people like me, who PvE in Open, for you (and other PvPers I guess).

 

[Sole Hunter]

Is this something you specifically are concerned about, or are you assuming other players consider open more dangerous? I'm pretty sure I'm less capable of surviving than you against another player but I don't consider it a higher risk overall because A) it's easy enough to avoid gankers, and B) I can get help.

A commonly stated belief is that death is entirely optional in this game. This is incompatible with the concept that Open is more dangerous, it's one or the other. So which is it, for you? Not for people like me, who PvE in Open, for you (and other PvPers I guess).

Players are more dangerous than half baked NPC's.

Hence why the risk is higher.

 

[Riverside]

Players are more dangerous than half baked NPC's.

Hence why the risk is higher.

Players are easy to avoid. Do you consider Open more dangerous personally? Seems to me you are likely to be one of the most, if not the most dangerous thing in your instance. You are not at any extra risk, those around you are. And they are not arguing for increased payout, you are.

If I were in your instance I'd be at increased risk. But I can get help from others (so can you) to mitigate that risk (or just not go there), so it evens out.

It's not being in Open that is dangerous, it's other players. Do you see what I mean?

 

[Phisto Sobanii]

No matter how good you think you are Open is always the most dangerous mode. The best never forget this which is often why they are exactly that.