Anyone else thinking of asking for a refund?

[Chaparral]

Not looking for a refund. I think I'm at the pennies per hour enjoyed status now.

It's not like a gym membership.

 

[Sylveria]

Again, the referenced quote was in a dev update thread for CQC- an exclusively multiplayer feature. At that time wings had already been released- an exclusively multiplayer feature. Since that quote, multicrew has been released- an exclusively multiplayer feature. It is ABUNDANTLY clear now, and was clear at the time, that the referenced quote did not mean "all modes currently and will always have equal feature sets." Having a single player mode and a multiplayer mode have exactly the same feature set is technically impossible (no matchmaking netcode need for multiplayer), and a foolish thing to aspire to in the first place. Single player and multiplayer have different needs. Trying to make them exactly the same just guarantees they'll both be sub-par.

Oh, we're in total agreement as to singleplayer vs multiplayer needs. Then again, we didn't have a "vote" as customers before changes were implemented, did we?

Regardless- we're all in the same boat, like it or not. The reality is FD is is in a pickle. They painted themselves into a corner, and they can't really make changes that pander to PvP nor PvE without alienating and entire group of players. So instead of blaming one group or another, wouldn't it be more beneficial and productive to direct your energy where it truly belongs? IOW, not the PvE nor the PvP community.

 

[Ian Skippy]

Oh, we're in total agreement as to singleplayer vs multiplayer needs. Then again, we didn't have a "vote" as customers before changes were implemented, did we?

Regardless- we're all in the same boat, like it or not. The reality is FD is is in a pickle. They painted themselves into a corner, and they can't really make changes that pander to PvP nor PvE without alienating and entire group of players. So instead of blaming one group or another, wouldn't it be more beneficial and productive to direct your energy where it truly belongs?

This isnt about PvE versus PvP. There are tons and tons of PvE players, pretty sure it is the majority of players. There is only a tiny group of players that loves to play powerplay in Solo. Its really a minor subset of the PvE players.

Except Group B has exactly the same ability to counter such actions, they just choose not to utilize them and instead play victim and call the waaaaaambulance.

Now, who's "weak" exactly?

yes, we can all play Tennis on our own private little field without zero oppositions and count how many points we can score. Some thing that would just be a crappy sport, and suggest we stand on the same pitch. Its really feeble to start the 'waaaaaambulance' stuff.

 

[Sylveria]

This isnt about PvE versus PvP. There are tons and tons of PvE players, pretty sure it is the majority of players. There is only a tiny group of players that loves to play powerplay in Solo. Its really a minor subset of the PvE players.



yes, we can all play Tennis on our own private little field without zero oppositions and count how many points we can score. Some thing that would just be a crappy sport, and suggest we stand on the same pitch. Its really feeble to start the 'waaaaaambulance' stuff.

LOL you're ignorant if you truly believe this, as there have been assurances from FD directly that PvP players are the minority in this game.

 

[kilvenny]

No, I wouldn't ask for a refund, I have had my fund, I will simply start looking for a new game to play.

I do wonder if part of the problem here is open players switching to solo to 5C etc.

 

[Sylveria]

No, I wouldn't ask for a refund, I have had my fund, I will simply start looking for a new game to play.

I do wonder if part of the problem here is open players switching to solo to 5C etc.

If they're switching to SC then good riddance.

 

[Ian Skippy]

LOL you're ignorant if you truly believe this, as there have been assurances from FD directly that PvP players are the minority in this game.

I think you are getting a bit overheated. I just literally said that I am pretty sure that the majority of players are PvE. However, not every PvE player is in Solo, and not every PvE player in solo does powerplay. Solo Powerplayers seem very much a minority to me. So its not about PvE versus PvP, its about people who want to powerplay in Solo versus people who want to powerplay in Open. Many PvP and PvE players dont care either way at all.

I do wonder if part of the problem here is open players switching to solo to 5C etc.

Yes.

If they're switching to SC then good riddance.

He said 5C, not SC. I am starting to think you have been drinking, you're randomly disagreeing with everyone, even if they agree with you...

 

[Sylveria]

I think you are getting a bit overheated. I just literally said that I am pretty sure that the majority of players are PvE. However, not every PvE player is in Solo, and not every PvE player in solo does powerplay. Solo Powerplayers seem very much a minority to me. So its not about PvE versus PvP, its about people who want to powerplay in Solo versus people who want to powerplay in Open. Many PvP and PvE players dont care either way at all.

Yes.

I'm not "overheated", I'm just very conscious that the open mouth gets fed. I'm also very aware that there's an agenda for removing the modes in favor of Open-only FFA pew-pew which i will protest until my dying breath. Count on it.

As far as your implying that there's a minority of PvE players- I can guarantee there's no "minority" to be had.

 

[Powderpanic]

I was taking a toilet break and I came up with a super fact. (Nothing like clearing yourself, to clear the mind.)

FDEV have clearly stated by the sheer intent of looking at Powerplay for Open only. THEY, THE DEVELOPER, consider Powerplay to be a multiplayer feature.

So anyone who wants to play a Multiplayer feature in Solo is basically just wrong.

For them to even float this idea, knowing the Salt storm it would produce. The number of players playing Powerplay must be SHOCKINGLY low.
So really, apart from the people who will spite themselves in an attempt to make a point. This is a real minority issue, with no downside.

Powderpanic
The Voice of Griefing

 

[Sylveria]

I was taking a toilet break and I came up with a super fact. (Nothing like clearing yourself, to clear the mind.)

FDEV have clearly stated by the sheer intent of looking at Powerplay for Open only. THEY, THE DEVELOPER, consider Powerplay to be a multiplayer feature.

So anyone who wants to play a Multiplayer feature in Solo is basically just wrong.

For them to even float this idea, knowing the Salt storm it would produce. The number of players playing Powerplay must be SHOCKINGLY low.
So really, apart from the people who will spite themselves in an attempt to make a point. This is a real minority issue, with no downside.

Powderpanic
The Voice of Griefing

*snore* have your PP in Open. When you come back whining about the BGS and removal of the modes, then we'll talk.

Have fun with PP.

 

[Frenotx]

Oh, we're in total agreement as to singleplayer vs multiplayer needs. Then again, we didn't have a "vote" as customers before changes were implemented, did we?

Regardless- we're all in the same boat, like it or not. The reality is FD is is in a pickle. They painted themselves into a corner, and they can't really make changes that pander to PvP nor PvE without alienating and entire group of players. So instead of blaming one group or another, wouldn't it be more beneficial and productive to direct your energy where it truly belongs? IOW, not the PvE nor the PvP community.

The only people they're alienating are the extremists who have wholesale bought into the "us vs. them" mentality that has developed on this forum. FDev shouldn't really concern themselves with the mewlings of EITHER side of that silly situation, as those people don't have what's best for the game in mind- their primary concern is that their "team" wins, and the other "team" loses.

As for where I direct my personal energies, I have been focused on advocating for changes that I think will improve the game (even when they sometimes negatively impact me personally), and helping players arm themselves with knowledge for years. I'll occasionally try to be a voice of reason for situations like this, too. I'm an independent that just wants the game to be the best game it can be.

I'm not "overheated", I'm just very conscious that the open mouth gets fed. I'm also very aware that there's an agenda for removing the modes in favor of Open-only FFA pew-pew which i will protest until my dying breath. Count on it.

As far as your implying that there's a minority of PvE players- I can guarantee there's no "minority" to be had.

He said that the specific SUBSET of PvE players that does powerplay exclusively in solo is a minority. That SUBSET of PvE players, not PvE players as a whole. Are you fluent in English?

 

[Happy Daze]

Pardon me for being a Noob, but I just started playing Elite Dangerous Horizons. What has Frontier done to cause the OP to complain? Seriously, please.
Jibs

 

[Powderpanic]

*snore* have your PP in Open. When you come back whining about the BGS and removal of the modes, then we'll talk.

Have fun with PP.

It's cool fam.

PP Open will be a huge success. Then we are coming for the BGS!

Wait and see

Powerpanic
The Voice of Griefing

 

[Ian Skippy]

Pardon me for being a Noob, but I just started playing Elite Dangerous Horizons. What has Frontier done to cause the OP to complain? Seriously, please.
Jibs

There is a feature called Powerplay. In this feature you pick a power out of ten choices, and then you try to expand/defend your territory together with everyone else in your power. Currently you can do that in any mode, meaning you can 'attack' other powers in Solo without them being able to see you do it. Some feel this goes against the idea behind powerplay. FD recently proposed making Powerplay open-only: if you want to attack the power of other people, you will run the risk of them shooting you. As you can see, many people are vehemently for or against it, and it has caused quite the stir in the community.

 

[Sole Hunter]

I thought the Engineers was as low as it was possible to go in bad game design, but here FD is thinking about changing the basic nature of the game after we bought it.
Not that i really care whether pp is open only or not, but just on the principle that FD shouldnt be rewarded for changing the basic nature of the product from what was advertised and sold, I am thiniking about asking for a refund. This sets a precedent i dont want to see play out.
A vendor removing basic features from a product after its sold and the money is in the vendors pocket seems unethical, maybe fradulent, and possibly illegal.

The engineers is an absolute disgusting atrocious pile of garbage.

This update however is by far the best design decision they've ever made in the last year.

 

[Genus]

Pardon me for being a Noob, but I just started playing Elite Dangerous Horizons. What has Frontier done to cause the OP to complain? Seriously, please.
Jibs

If you've just started, you've missed six years of poltics over just this sort of thing. As such, all the arguments aren't about Powerplay as such. It's more about trying to make ED as good a game it can be, whilst mitigating the damage to it as a whole.

That's going to be difficult to do for FD is this instance. They tend to see the game as a series of technical solutions, and have a habit of discounting all the human factors. This scenario accounts for a Cutter full of human behaviours that they have no technical solution for.

So the forum tends to argue that out for them

 

[Happy Daze]

There is a feature called Powerplay. In this feature you pick a power out of ten choices, and then you try to expand/defend your territory together with everyone else in your power. Currently you can do that in any mode, meaning you can 'attack' other powers in Solo without them being able to see you do it. Some feel this goes against the idea behind powerplay. FD recently proposed making Powerplay open-only: if you want to attack the power of other people, you will run the risk of them shooting you. As you can see, many people are vehemently for or against it, and it has caused quite the stir in the community.

Thanks for the explanation sleutelbos. Well, even Noobs have opinions, so my 1.5 cents is: From the description of PowerPlay I think it should be Open Only. Where is the challenge of "expanding/defending your territory" when there is no risk?
Granted it would be quite a while before I attempt Powerplay... I can barely land my ship much less fight off opponents.

Fly safe!

 

[nrage]

As I've said before, simply including an EULA does not preclude wrongful doing nor intent. If a customer feels like they've been cheated due to advertisement of a product and change of said product after delivery- they have legal recourse, end of story. You may disagree as you wish, as to fulfill your immediate gratification of a forum-fu "win", but the reality is much different.

Let us know how you get on. I can't see any legal leg to stand on, myself, but I am not a lawyer.

 

[Frenotx]

Thanks for the explanation sleutelbos. Well, even Noobs have opinions, so my 1.5 cents is: From the description of PowerPlay I think it should be Open Only. Where is the challenge of "expanding/defending your territory" when there is no risk?
Granted it would be quite a while before I attempt Powerplay... I can barely land my ship much less fight off opponents.

Fly safe!

Good to see a new pilot with some sense.

 

[CMDR Overide_40]

What about instancing? Whos to say in open only your going to see someone at all? Anything done on console is invisable at tbe time to pc and vise versa. So what the heck is this argument really about.? ( its no fair i cant see ppl causing my faction to lose whaaaaa[cry][cry]