David Braben comments on VR [gamedaily.biz article]

Basically I think DB's wrong in most of what he asserts here. This is not exactly surprising given the lack of ED and Frontier in general keeping up with VR development over the last 2+ years. They, like so many other larger developers, have clearly decided it's not worth the bother. When the user base reaches a high enough level I dare say they'll change their minds but for now it is a hard sell on a purely economic level. However as gamers and artists it's hard to imagine how they can't be excited about and actively involved with the innovation and experimentation that's going on in the VR space. It's by far and away the biggest thing to happen to video gaming since the invention of 3d cards (maybe even since their invention period). Every developer I know is as excited about it as I am, and often it's oldies like me who are the most excited of all.

As for his explicit issues, My PC is mid range at best these days and runs VR and ED just fine and even my old gtx960 was okay for many VR games. 90fps is certainly a good target but even as low as 45 is fine for a lot of people, not that 90 is hard to hit so long as you design with that goal in mind. Res could be better but it's totally fine as it is, given that I played and loved Frontier Elite 2 on a 320x200 screen and before that Elite on an old black and white CRT TV hooked up to my spectrum I'd of thought DB would be well aware that while higher res is always nice it isn't a prerequisite of a good experience. I play for hours and hours and hours on end without any eye strain problems, others millage may vary but I suspect this will be no different from regular screen use which also causes problems for some people. As for family environment, well on the PC side that's never really been an issue. PC's tend to be in bed rooms, offices, spare rooms, etc. Even so the PC or console still has a screen and that's still showing what's happening in game. Should a family member have a desperate need to sit and watch someone else play.

Its fine, innovators, indie's and bed room devs will continue to blaze the trail into this brave new world of gaming just like DB and the like did for flat screen gaming. Though I wish folks like DB who aren't interested in the tech just didn't talk about it, rather than talking down the tech, not that it matters just like the people who said gaming would never be main stream back when DB was making Elite, he'll be proved wrong in the end.
 
I only hope that Davids play down of VR isn't down to the (hopefully soon to come) atmospheric planetry landings and extra demands it may put on an already unoptimised game engine for VR.
 
I think DBOBE is very subjective here. For ED, the VR experience is cutting edge, there's nothing like it in the entire market. Another question is whether you can personally enjoy VR. Many of my friends (and possibly even DBOBE) can't, so they render that technology as unimportant. But it's not. It may not become mainstream because of the price tag involved for some time, but on the other hand, not supporting VR will be the doom of any future simulator game. Compare DCS in 2D vs. VR and you'll instantly know why.

O7,
[noob]
 
I hope this doesn't mean that VR will go the way of ED Mac support.

Mac support was cancelled because Apple froze | dropped the required graphics API. If ED would drop VR, they'd lose a major USP. Don't think that will happen. But what irritates me is the feeling that DBOBE almost looks at ED as a project of the past.

O7,
[noob]
 
DB has never expressed any real love for VR. My guess is he had some VR fans working for him during the initial stage of development and they were let off the leash. Not seen much love for VR over the last couple of years so I'd guess that the VR fans have moved on and not been replaced by like minded people. The multicrew gunnery view is probably the most underwhelming VR experience I've ever had, for example. Also every dev presentation always has staffers playing on gamepads.

The attitude seems to be 'be thankful for what you have'.
 
Might explain the lack of any real progress on the VR implementation in Elite for some time now.... VR is the only thing that keeps me playing this title, I wouldn't go near it in 2D. Then again, I don't really play anything outside of VR anymore.

Well honest question, isn't it more a problem with VR itself rather then the game?, the game needs content which lends itself towards vr? or what do you mean by progress in terms of VR?
 
I think DBOBE is very subjective here. For ED, the VR experience is cutting edge, there's nothing like it in the entire market. Another question is whether you can personally enjoy VR. Many of my friends (and possibly even DBOBE) can't, so they render that technology as unimportant. But it's not. It may not become mainstream because of the price tag involved for some time, but on the other hand, not supporting VR will be the doom of any future simulator game. Compare DCS in 2D vs. VR and you'll instantly know why.

O7,
[noob]

A thousand times yes. But PC gamers seem to be a lot more stupid, lacking in imagination and spirit than they once were.
 
Well honest question, isn't it more a problem with VR itself rather then the game?, the game needs content which lends itself towards vr? or what do you mean by progress in terms of VR?

It's up to developers of games like this to dazzle us with imaginative implementation of VR, but with ED we get nothing along those lines. It's clearly a leadership issue from my POV.
 
DB has never expressed any real love for VR. My guess is he had some VR fans working for him during the initial stage of development and they were let off the leash.
Yup, this seems a highly likely scenario actually. It could also explain why no PSVR support, which seemed like such an obvious thing to do and would have taken the PSVR world by storm that I found it unbelievable when it never materialised.

The attitude seems to be 'be thankful for what you have'.
Indeed.
 
Might explain the lack of any real progress on the VR implementation in Elite for some time now.... VR is the only thing that keeps me playing this title, I wouldn't go near it in 2D. Then again, I don't really play anything outside of VR anymore.

Same here.

Yup, count me in on that. I never want to see my desktop again, while piloting a starship... VR was the breakthrough for me in terms of getting back to gaming and it is definitely the number one reason, why i never became tired of Elite Dangerous (besides Elite being a cool space game).
 
Some comments which might raise a few eyebrows...

“I have never believed [VR] would take off. Right from day one, I said it would be niche,” he noted. “And it's a great niche, but it's still quite niche. We were, I think, the first people to support [VR] with a AAA game, with Elite: Dangerous in December 2013. It's a wonderful experience, it is really wonderful. But it puts quite a high bar on the hardware, so my personal view is you can't run any slower than about 90 frames a second, and the resolution you really want to be 4K per eye. [Currently] it is a bit blurry, it's quite hard on the eyes for a long time. And the other problem is, trying to use it in a family environment, it's really divisive. Because no one can see or hear what you're seeing.”

Braben does see a “huge opportunity” in AR, and Frontier has worked with HoloLens and others from the early days, he said.

Link to full article: https://gamedaily.biz/article/194/david-braben-why-the-industry-needs-the-return-of-the-publisher

VR may go the way of 3D tvs, but I doubt it - most new games I get are VR games and I'm having a blast with my Rift.

Honestly, I think in the future VR will be that it's just another display option (like in Elite.)

Especially since most next gen PCs will be VR compatible (most current gen gaming PCs are already)

But I don't see 2D gaming going away either, as many people (like those who get motion sick easily) won't move to VR.

As far as being Divisive, I think that's an odd statement?!?

The majority of PC and Console games are a singular experience, not a social one (for those in the same room not playing.)

And most games these days don't support local multiplayer/split-screen.

So I just don't see how playing Elite on the living room TV is social time with non-players in the same room - I mean I spend my Elite playing time talking to my wing mates...

And btw most VR games do mirror what the VR player sees on the local display anyway, so I don't get that part of his statement either.

In the end I respect his right to his opinion, but personally it doesn't make a lot of sense to me and not how I see the market going.

o7
 
Never used VR nor do I have the money for an adequate system, I'm fine with my head tracker. But what actually does raise an eyebrow here is what TorTorden said:

"Chief of which is eye strain.
The resolution doesn't cause strain.
Trying to force your eyes to see something that isn't there will."

This pretty much sounds like the effect I only know from cinema 3-D glasses (again, I never could check out true VR yet). Can anyone confirm this? Because for me this would be the final nail in the coffin of VR as I can't watch these movies (still remember Avatar that I'd rather watched in 2-D due to this effect). That's just not how my eyes are working - always focused on what they should be focused. [where is it][woah]

I only watched a couple of 3D films before getting VR but the effect is similar but also one you will overcome. In VR your brain wants your eyes to overcome the lack of focus and you will find it rather blurry and visually tiring for a while as your eyes uncontrollably try to focus on things that cannot be focused on to pin sharp levels like the real world. You get past that though as your brain adapts and accepts it can't be fixed.

I think its must be a bit like when someone loses 20/20 vision. They get headaches, complain about not being able to read stuff but eventually adapt. VR is something most people can adapt too I reckon.
 
Yup, count me in on that. I never want to see my desktop again, while piloting a starship... VR was the breakthrough for me in terms of getting back to gaming and it is definitely the number one reason, why i never became tired of Elite Dangerous (besides Elite being a cool space game).

VR is incredible. I always dreamt of being an airline pilot when I was a kid and now with VR it pretty much a hobby; I've had my Rift a couple of years now but every now and then I find myself shaking my head in amazement at what it really does.


I really hope Lord Braben revisits VR because he seems to be missing the point :S
 
A thousand times yes. But PC gamers seem to be a lot more stupid, lacking in imagination and spirit than they once were.

Really?

And there was me thinking that it was the inclusion of 'Console market' that was dumbing down the scope of the PC games, thus leaving the PC users a little bewildered by the lack of imagination of the games studios.
 
mr obvious. it won't be anything but niche until there are wireless headsets weighting the same as glasses, proper cpu/gpu power has become standard, the whole thing costs as much as a regular phone and there is proper software to make use of it. then you can bet it will take off. everybody knew this, but you have to get there first.

resolution is actually secondary, he's making predictions based on his own (narrow) experience and preferences here.

family environment? not that i don't agree but, what family environment? wake up, granpa, gaming (in particular, life in general) has become incresingly individualistic. hot-seat or split screen are the niche now, and afaik only nintendo still gives it some love ... actually, tone down the cinycism a bit bc your game does exploit this phenomenon quite a bit. or tell me, how do i play elite in "a family environment"? with 5 accounts? multicrew with 5 consoles? are you even talking about?
 
And there was me thinking that it was the inclusion of 'Console market' that was dumbing down the scope of the PC games

no, consoles are only a tool. what's been dumbing down the scope of games is massification.

that said, computer games still evolve. you just have to look beyond the risk averse and ever more exploiting top-chart list.

'aaa game' ... the very definition would be obscene, if it weren't so braindead silly.
 
Wow, very spot on comments. What's there to wonder about? He is right - 4k and 90 fps are basically where VR will become most usable for majority of people. And it will stay niche. It doesn't need to be something very huge. Better deliver on what they have.
 
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