Have to disagree here. The cr/h of exploration will go up so it will be even simpler to gain Exploration Elite.
Frontier you talked about the "traveler" style of exploration and misunderstood one key thing
- Thread starter Crusina Luachra
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Yeah I agree and personally I don't think its gonna take away the snap decision process and may even be quicker if the signals are very distinct
Here's why I like this system and why Genar and the Op can't agree with me. As I read through the thread I realised it comes down to a simple thing.
What *I* have always wanted is anaethma to what they want.
They can't be reconciled. That first HONK that revealed everything was always too damned easy for me. I wanted something to do, some gameplay added that involved me looking at readouts and interpreting things.
And that's finally what has come in.
I'm not saying what they want is invalid, in every single post on the subject, I've always stated I do understand why taking that away is going to make some people unhappy. But they're two opposing views 'insta-reveal' and 'want gameplay to reveal'. And sadly, there is no solution.
I think overall the improvements make a better game.
What *I* have always wanted is anaethma to what they want.
They can't be reconciled. That first HONK that revealed everything was always too damned easy for me. I wanted something to do, some gameplay added that involved me looking at readouts and interpreting things.
And that's finally what has come in.
I'm not saying what they want is invalid, in every single post on the subject, I've always stated I do understand why taking that away is going to make some people unhappy. But they're two opposing views 'insta-reveal' and 'want gameplay to reveal'. And sadly, there is no solution.
I think overall the improvements make a better game.
But the new system of discovering planetary bodies is not challenging. Matching patterns and then click on a blob is not challenging. It's simpler than the game "concentration" where the player at least has to memorize where the different patterns are.
Oh, okay, but I suppose you had to fly to each landable to know that. In the new system with the orrery map, it may be more evident. It may even highlight areas that you may not have noticed before in the old way.
Difficult to know until we start using it.
I mean Adam could guess right from the spectral analysis what type of gas giant it was that it had a ring.
Hello everyone,
I feel like I am walking headfirst into a hornet's nest, but I thought now was as good a time as any to bring up an idea that might be worth considering.
As somewhat of a middle ground between the new and old systems, would NPC crew be something that could help speed up the new scanning process?
For example, hiring new explorer NPC crew or giving current NPC crew explorer ranks to buff the speed at which you could identify the stellar objects in a system. Based on explorer rank instead of combat rank, for every object you successfully tag using the new scanning system, your one (or more) crew has a chance of picking up on something at the same time. The better the crew, the faster they pick up on things for you. If money was no object, then an anaconda with 3 explorer elite crew could be something actually close to the speeds some here might want. This still wouldn't be the same as the single honk and switch to system map, but it would be faster than spotting each and every object one by one on your own.
The advantages I see:
- won't completely nullify the new mechanics.
- can tailor a little more to the high scan volume style.
- can scale based on NPC crew numbers and explorer rank.
- gives crew a non-combat reason to be hired.
- gives a way to improve exploration flow other than engineering.
And some potential problems/disadvantages:
- you can still fire crew without paying them.
- limited to multicrew ships (and pressures you to use the biggest you can).
- explorers would have to come to port to hire new crew.
- depending on NPC skill, it could be broken or not even worth it (either way it is still not the same as an instant scan.
- would need more game development time.
Has this kind of idea come up already?
Indeed. There is no way of having both. Or is it ?
What if the new FSS spectral system had two levels of information :
- One easy to read giving you the world type, aas shown in the demo.
- A second signal level, overlaying the first one giving you a hint at the inclination and orbital period of the object from the Spectrum. Small hints, but enough that an experienced player can "read" it.
What's for sure is that the old honk system was too simplistic. But I'm not sold on the fact that the new one will require a whole lot more of skill, while giving less information.
As in another thread, one aspect that seems to have been overlooked is the multi-crew element - with the new mechanics there is finally a "non-pew" multi-crew activity where the manipulation of the various scanning and probing screens will give us a "science officer" role. In fact if the mechanics were made more complicated and time consuming, then that would only add more value to this.
The current mechanics would essentially mean a "science officer" would honk when the ship enters the system and then goes to sleep whilst the pilot approaches and scans each body....not exactly a thrill ride.
If there looks to be something interesting in the system then a multi-crew vessel can go and examine closer and during that cruise get the "orbital mechanics" view that we currently get in super cruise.
I think FDev should be applauded for finally bringing functionality to multi-crew...
The current mechanics would essentially mean a "science officer" would honk when the ship enters the system and then goes to sleep whilst the pilot approaches and scans each body....not exactly a thrill ride.
If there looks to be something interesting in the system then a multi-crew vessel can go and examine closer and during that cruise get the "orbital mechanics" view that we currently get in super cruise.
I think FDev should be applauded for finally bringing functionality to multi-crew...
Well said and I agree. Sadly. But I do agree.
I just hope that people do realise that the likes of my opinion were more to do with questioning this one change to exploration rather than just being a grumpy old stick in the mud for the sake of it. I genuinely believe that eventually lots of complaints will happen due to what's going to happen with the system map thing, once it sinks in after the umpteenth new star system has been jumped to.
But whatever, the beta approaches and I feel I'm just wasting time now repeating the same stuff here, so I think I'll shut up and let FDEV etc. get on with it :/
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In fairness it can be argued (and I think you are actually arguing yourself) that your requirements as a video producer are quite specific and rather different to that of most players. Scouring the galaxy for 'shots' is a rather different exercise than most players experience of exploration as 'undertaking a journey' - by its nature a much slower and less 'economical' affair.
Which has to be the final takeaway I think - in the main this is a change for the better and will help flesh out the experience of role playing as an explorer within the world of E: D.
I explore just like the op and this will make my trips much longer as I understand. Would like the honk to stay the same (quick mapping) with the addition of the new stuff. Didn't the stream say that planets have "sounds" you'd think a scanner/pc could figure out fairly instantly within a certain amount of detail instead of me manually having to pick a higher line multiple times. It just seems its more time for the same thing while adding in probes and splash screens. IMO
My exploration style is identical to that of the OP, and I share their concerns. The new system will undoubtedly slow down the sight seeing form of exploration. Added to that, for me personally, it will also likely add to the time it takes me to create exploration based videos.
All that said, I'm of the opinion that the changes are worth the price. I'm happy to adapt to the new system, because it is clearly better in many ways. We will have to wait until Beta to test for ourselves of course, but my impressions are that the new exploration changes will make this an overall much improved game. If that means I lose my current exploration style, or (more like the case) have to adapt my exploration style, then I'm all for it!
Parts of the sight seeing profession gets buffed as well. True, finding two moons orbiting a ringed gas giant will probably take longer. Finding two moons orbiting a ringed gas giant with brain trees on the other hand will get faster. I'd say that taking interesting shots from the surface of planets is also part of the sight seeing profession.
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Indeed, one need to fly to them in the final step. The thing is that with the new system, the dud / good ratio is made worse by removing a lot of information from the first step, and
therefore require a second, lengthier step to go back to the same dud / good ratio we had before.
If said missing information (mainly orbital periods*, gravity and inclinations) could be seen from the Spectrum as distrotions of the "planet type signal", it would solve 90% of the issue here.
For example :
- High gravity : signal has a larger amplitude
- Low orbital period aka large speed : signal is broadened
- High inclination : the signal is tilted
See how that would make the issue go away ?
Or surface POIs, or geological anomalies, or any new stellar features being added in chpt 4 (or future additions) that the Honk has/could never reveal. Hyperbolic reductionism does not suit you.
Colonia is bigger than a Traveller sector. Let's see how players like one week per jump, and Newtonian system travel.
I wonder if a J6 ship could make it to Beagle Point...even with TL 15 bots, and low berths.
A Type S Scout would be stuck forever in a small cluster of J2 worlds, and would die faster than a Hauler vs one of the new death machines.
Where are the Spinward Marches when you need them?
Indeed, one need to fly to them in the final step. The thing is that with the new system, the dud / good ratio is made worse by removing a lot of information from the first step, and
therefore require a second, lengthier step to go back to the same dud / good ratio we had before.
If said missing information (mainly orbital periods*, gravity and inclinations) could be seen from the Spectrum as distrotions of the "planet type signal", it would solve 90% of the issue here.
For example :
- High gravity : signal has a larger amplitude
- Low orbital period aka large speed : signal is broadened
- High inclination : the signal is tilted
See how that would make the issue go away ? Plus, if the effect is subtle, it requires skill. I.e. good thing in my books.
It will get faster than the current way to find brain trees. A lot faster.
But to find anything interesting on a planetary object the player will have to fly to that object and map it. It has absolutely nothing to do with the system map, the honk or the new FSS.
Thanks for that, but one question Adam:
Can the new FSS be accessed while the FSD is charging?
It may seem like a minor point, but the answer to this means a LOT to the traveler explorer playstyle.
Suprises that what you honked was not what you got.
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