Elite:Dangerous for Linux?

Sorry, but that's nonsense, and it is quite obvious you know very little about subject.

Have you wondered how Valve with Steam platform deals with it? Simple. They have one supported platform - most popular Linux desktop OS - Ubuntu. For every other platform people package it as required, and have short instructions how to setup. As distributions for 10 years now follow Linux Standard Base (or LSB), it is very easy to tune software setup without need or intervention from developer.

Also good software just use proper library calls, which are dynamically found and linked as required. Library versions are stable for very long time, kernel version is very stable for long time. As long this is true, support costs are minimal and major costs are porting itself.

I've worked in the IT business for many years, and no, it's not nonsense.
What Valve does is making a machine that supports WINE or something similar.

BUT! The Steam console will NOT be able to support the more complicated games. So forget about getting it if it's only for not letting Microsoft get a bit of your money.

http://www.tomsguide.com/us/steamos-faq-machines,news-17614.html

So no, you are completely wrong. The Steam box will not be a "way out" for Linux enthusiasts.
Also, it will NOT make developers race out and port for it. Most of the bigger companies don't even support the Steam philosophy.

AND what you write about library/kernel support .. I have to laugh. Windows has a much longer life span in terms of support than fx Ubuntu.
Also, Linux is constantly developed, patched, and modified by people who could theoretically build into it any sort of security hole they wanted, and you'd never know. This is the difference between a commercial, guaranteed product and public development.

If you feel Microsoft are scum, I can't imagine what you think of Apple (well probably the same as I do) ...
 
I've worked in the IT business for many years, and no, it's not nonsense.
What Valve does is making a machine that supports WINE or something similar.

Plenty of people here can claim many years in IT too ;).

Yes for those games on Steam which do not have a native port you can Stream games from a Windows machine to Steam OS, so far I have tried Rise of Flight and Trainsimulator 2014, both have worked with a slight FPS hit.

In this view perhaps I could stream to a SteamBox connected to a large Hidef TV and connect some gamepad or other devices, that could be really awesome.

We don't know know how well Steam machines will sale, I suspect like the first Xbox uptake will be slow and Valve will need to be prepared to sink a lot of money into the project before it can even begin to gain traction.

It could be good for Linux in the long run, graphics aren't an issue anymore (I find it just as easy to install the Nvidia driver on Linux as on Windows), but sound cards and peripheral setup can still be a pain. With my Nvidia graphics card I have to manually blacklist audio HDMI modules and some graphic options, something I wouldn't expect a new person with no or little IT experience to bother. Of course, I am using Slackware, so ymmv.
 
i think its been mentioned before in this thread but what I'd like to see is a live distro that boots straight into the game instead of a desktop, that way you can keep a copy on your keyring usb stick and demo it to friends without even installing it on their computer.

usb key in, reboot, log in to your account and off you go! a truly portable game.
 
Well he got a huge point. Are you gamer first or linux fan first. That the point.

For console gamers go for where the most or better games as exclusives are.

For PC windows >> mac == linux. So as a gamer first you go for the market leader.

Steamos. Well Valve core busnes is not making games. It is ther cash milkin cow called digital distribution online store. That why it so nich to work there because they don't depend on game development. So they can do game dev on more frontier research style.

There linux advebture is that since MS got appstore and following mac they are directly competing with steam. So valve fees that in the balls. So there crusade against MS but going for linux but not mac. Is busness cash flow desision.

Not for the sake of the gamers. But for keping the cash flow high.

So steamos and making steam games linux ports is to compensate sales lost to gain tem back on linux.

Because MS is cashing in more on consoles then desktop. So I wonder to how long that is supported. So I am to currious about win9.

But these appstores steam apple or MS means it it closed as controled so the most extreem crap is filtered out. While on desktop you can release whatever in any state.

Like X-Rebirth. Also steam lost EA they roled out there own as Origin. Just like frontier does with ED.

I stick with windows for now. W8.xvworks fine for me.
 
I've worked in the IT business for many years, and no, it's not nonsense.
What Valve does is making a machine that supports WINE or something similar.

BUT! The Steam console will NOT be able to support the more complicated games. So forget about getting it if it's only for not letting Microsoft get a bit of your money.

You know in all my years of working when people claim to work in IT it seems that they know absolutly ****** all about computers and the above statement seems to bear that out.

Steam OS has absolutly NOTHING to do with WINE and compatability nor steam home streaming or supporting more complicated games. In fact streaming is supported on the windows side of the steam client.

SteamOS is a linux distro based on debian which means it has all their experience with the steam client for linux.

It is also about brining natively running games to the linux platform of which there is an increasingly large amount, my steam list is already quite large with native linux games.

And we are talking about proper games such as the X series, Xenonaughts, cities in motion, Space hulk.

But as I have said before people in IT do seem to think they know it all when they are some of the most incompetent behind a keyboard.
 
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I've worked in the IT business for many years, and no, it's not nonsense.
What Valve does is making a machine that supports WINE or something similar.

As I said, no clue.

99% of the games runs native. Some of them uses DirectX->OpenGL translator *directly* without need of having full fledged Wine, but most of them have native engine support via OpenGL (like Source engine).

BUT! The Steam console will NOT be able to support the more complicated games. So forget about getting it if it's only for not letting Microsoft get a bit of your money.
Again, no clue. It is about control. Microsoft wants to remove control form ISVs and have more controlled environment, because they like numbers Apple crunch.

Also Microsoft have problems with direction. Events around XBox One clearly indicates that. Valve wants to secure it's future - again, for obvious reasons. They are in for long term. They already convinced quite a lineup of devs to try porting. More porting means more coders capable to do it around, and less it cost.

So.....what's said there backs up your POV? Just posting random link won't help your cause.

So no, you are completely wrong. The Steam box will not be a "way out" for Linux enthusiasts.
Also, it will NOT make developers race out and port for it. Most of the bigger companies don't even support the Steam philosophy.

AND what you write about library/kernel support .. I have to laugh. Windows has a much longer life span in terms of support than fx Ubuntu.
Also, Linux is constantly developed, patched, and modified by people who could theoretically build into it any sort of security hole they wanted, and you'd never know. This is the difference between a commercial, guaranteed product and public development.

If you feel Microsoft are scum, I can't imagine what you think of Apple (well probably the same as I do) ...
I didn't claim that I know what devs thinking. Most of them are very cautious towards additional costs for obvious reasons. Also what's this "way out for Linux enthusiastics" thing. Everyone has to use same OS and same software just because there's monopoly? :D
 
Great thing that you guys can argue about which operating system is better, does it worth it or not to port the game, is there a need for it or not, etc. but overall we just want to play this awesome game on Linux hopefully in a year after the initial release for the main platforms. We don't want to harm anyone, we don't want to argue about it, and I do state that the income will be definately multiple times the salary of the Linux specalist who ports this game to Linux.
 
Must admit I'd prefer to be using Linux than Windows. Ugh!

I agree, but as a gamer that would be an extremely bad choice. For work, sure, if you are an IT tech or similar. For any other purpose, Linux sucks. It's simply (still) not user friendly enough; people get tired of it. At least, if by "people" we speak of the average user.
 
I agree, but as a gamer that would be an extremely bad choice. For work, sure, if you are an IT tech or similar. For any other purpose, Linux sucks. It's simply (still) not user friendly enough; people get tired of it. At least, if by "people" we speak of the average user.

My impression was that this thread should just be about Linux and Elite fans wanting to play on Linux. Let's keep it friendly. I don't feel the need to talk badly about Windows or any other OS/console here.

If you feel Linux is not the best fit for you, fine just use something else. It may help overall if people would accept that "user friendly" depends on the user and that "Linux" has no mission to achieve (as there is no single "Linux" entity like a single big enterprise).

If you think Linux is a waste of time, fine. Don't be worried that Windows falls short IF Frontier adds Linux support. Just trust them to make the right call how they spend their resources. If you are worried, raise your voice but please do so in a different thread (IMHO).

Just let Linux fans state their wish to have a Linux port :)
 
+1 for Elite: Dangerous Live

i think its been mentioned before in this thread but what I'd like to see is a live distro that boots straight into the game instead of a desktop, that way you can keep a copy on your keyring usb stick and demo it to friends without even installing it on their computer.

usb key in, reboot, log in to your account and off you go! a truly portable game.

This is a totally awesome idea. Frontier gets to choose the distro they want to develop for, strips it out to include only the bits that are required and then packages it all up onto a Live iso.

No having to support different kernel versions or endless variations of lib-pulse. A standardised, kiosk-like Elite: Dangerous appliance.

I love it!
 
To me it seems the kind of thing they should outsource, depending on how well the game does on launch. I don't think they should spend significant resources developing this internally when it's likely just a small fraction of the user base.
 
To me it seems the kind of thing they should outsource, depending on how well the game does on launch. I don't think they should spend significant resources developing this internally when it's likely just a small fraction of the user base.

Exactly opposite - having their own engine team is one will which can do that cheaply. And as they will have good experience with OpenGL on OS X already, it's really best option to do in-house.
 
My impression was that this thread should just be about Linux and Elite fans wanting to play on Linux. Let's keep it friendly. I don't feel the need to talk badly about Windows or any other OS/console here.

If you feel Linux is not the best fit for you, fine just use something else. It may help overall if people would accept that "user friendly" depends on the user and that "Linux" has no mission to achieve (as there is no single "Linux" entity like a single big enterprise).

If you think Linux is a waste of time, fine. Don't be worried that Windows falls short IF Frontier adds Linux support. Just trust them to make the right call how they spend their resources. If you are worried, raise your voice but please do so in a different thread (IMHO).

Just let Linux fans state their wish to have a Linux port :)

Someone even gave me negative "points" for that post.

I do speak out of knowledge. I have worked in both software and tech support. I KNOW all the implications of letting users run Linux. I KNOW how hard it is to port a game for Linux, and yes, I do know how fragile such a game would be in relation to what you have installed (and how). And the only point I tried to make is why so many games are not ported for Linux, and why you shouldn't hold your breath (too much). It's simply not economically viable to port to Linux as the player base will be a fraction of the Windows player base.

If Frontier actually do make a Linux port, I'd find that awsome for you guys.
 
Exactly opposite - having their own engine team is one will which can do that cheaply. And as they will have good experience with OpenGL on OS X already, it's really best option to do in-house.

We'll have to disagree then. I do have a bit of experience running dev teams, dealing with capex/opex and finances in general. A decision on whether to use resources whether internal or not is almost always going to have a financial basis, not just the cost of the time spent but the expected return. Is it worth it to spend $500k (not to mention an ongoing cost in maintenance) to develop a native Linux client if only a small percentage of the customer base would use it? What would the return on that investment be? How can you determine that? You'd have to look at industry trends such as market penetration of Linux or Mac on the desktop, maybe flavor that with your own expectations of usage by the target demographic, and try to come up with a cost/benefit analysis.

I don't think that's a very easy or clear thing to do for most companies which is why it's relatively rare to see games developed natively for Linux. Or, they do the analysis and don't like the results. Here's a question for you ... does Blizzard develop native Linux clients for their games? So if a company of that size doesn't think it's worth doing, why should we think FD will?

Even if they did do it internally, then those are resources that are tied up on that project and not working on other things that can take the game forward, so the question again becomes is the return worth it? That's actually why I would suggest they outsource it if they think the return would be worth doing. Either way, there is a cost.

I hate to feel like I'm throwing cold water on it all but I'm just trying to convey what the business thinking most likely is (having my own daily experience in this sort of thing).
 
We'll have to disagree then. I do have a bit of experience running dev teams, dealing with capex/opex and finances in general. A decision on whether to use resources whether internal or not is almost always going to have a financial basis, not just the cost of the time spent but the expected return. Is it worth it to spend $500k (not to mention an ongoing cost in maintenance) to develop a native Linux client if only a small percentage of the customer base would use it? What would the return on that investment be? How can you determine that? You'd have to look at industry trends such as market penetration of Linux or Mac on the desktop, maybe flavor that with your own expectations of usage by the target demographic, and try to come up with a cost/benefit analysis.

You misunderstood me then. I didn't say FD will make Linux port for sure. I don't know numbers. it is their decision, and will be done on their own internal calculations.

What I did say FD it seems have solid engine team which are capable to do ports (in fact that's why it's there). What I meant that IF there will be a port, most likely cheapest way to do it will be still internally, not outsource it.

I don't think that's a very easy or clear thing to do for most companies which is why it's relatively rare to see games developed natively for Linux. Or, they do the analysis and don't like the results. Here's a question for you ... does Blizzard develop native Linux clients for their games? So if a company of that size doesn't think it's worth doing, why should we think FD will?

It is more complex than that. First is cost, sure, and people claim Linux is small, which is true comparing to Windows. However coming down to numbers those aren't that small. Problem is large companies have big profit margins because they are responsible to shareholders. FD is owned by David and other shareholders, and David can make such bet much more easily.

Another thing is that everything changes. 2K have released about 10 games on SteamOS this year alone - strategies (Civ5, Upcoming 'Beyond Earth', XCOM series), shooters, you name it. Valve is still serious about pushing platform and work with community to improve it's performance and usability. As many have said, FD will have actually something solid to make decision based on.

Even if they did do it internally, then those are resources that are tied up on that project and not working on other things that can take the game forward, so the question again becomes is the return worth it? That's actually why I would suggest they outsource it if they think the return would be worth doing. Either way, there is a cost.

No one said that doesn't cost, in fact in opposite - we have said many times that we are ready to campaign for new kickstarter to port ED to Linux if necessary. No need for FD to spend their money on that, we want give it to them.

Resources tied up - from what? Engine team improves COBRA and all it's modules, sure, but they most likely don't work on anything else.

I hate to feel like I'm throwing cold water on it all but I'm just trying to convey what the business thinking most likely is (having my own daily experience in this sort of thing).

You operate on assumption we expect Linux port. No. We hope it materialize, and we are ready to help FD if required so.

People always assume Linux users are freebies. This myth has been invalidated long time ago.
 
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