The Star Citizen Thread V10

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Wonder if CiG will address this topic once more evidence is posted and questions from the loyal fanbase arises....same as with other topics in the past. Like a small child admitting things when it becomes impossible to ignore or deny....never honest and up-front. This is a good example. Either is fabricated and an obvious trolling attempt or its true. Sure, if I m innocent I wouldnt care about baseless accusations either seeing them as a waste of time. BUT CiG already has 1 public example where they only shared information at a point when it became futile to deny it (Lumberyards transition) and the following explanation (underway for most of the year prior to the switch) doesnt help to harden CiGs reputation as being "open" development. After all they dont hesitate to batter its community to death with bloated non-information or trivia so yeah.

I mean there is no definitive proof yet right? Just a bunch of plausible posts or did I miss something?

Proof of what? is there some shenanigans or crime here?

Got to go guys I will check in later
 
CIG updated their company web page last week. Job offers are at 94 now. Half of it is in the UK due to the tax rebates. It looks like CIG will be 600 devs in the future which is even more production speed. 2018 has been the best year for the project so far and if they keep it up it looks like they will get to the MVP within a couple of years.

https://cloudimperiumgames.com/jobs

CiG doesnt share lay-offs or announces when people leave the company of their own accord so I find that 600 number highly unlikely especially when you consider that "more isnt better" in terms of game development. Once you reach a certain team-size and cover all the required bases there really is no need to hire new people. And if you do there is a good reason for it. I just cannot see "production requirements" being one of em which leaves only other less favorable explanations.

Of course CiG announced 1 planet and 2 moons for next year. If they really handcraft it all painstakingly without the use of procgen as I think then taking on 94 designers is probably a necessity....still nor reassuring :)


@Number2

Proof of share sales actually happening. Because if thats the case its another red flag?
 
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CIG updated their company web page last week. Job offers are at 94 now. Half of it is in the UK due to the tax rebates. It looks like CIG will be 600 devs in the future which is even more production speed. 2018 has been the best year for the project so far and if they keep it up it looks like they will get to the MVP within a couple of years.

https://cloudimperiumgames.com/jobs

It's reassuring to see that they have no Network Engineering openings - they must have their architecture for those 1000 player instances fully pipelined and ramped up already :D
 
It's reassuring to see that they have no Network Engineering openings - they must have their architecture for those 1000 player instances fully pipelined and ramped up already :D

There are two openings.

Junior Network Gameplay Programmer - Wilmslow

Network Programmer - Wilmslow

--

Their internal team is about 5 people from what I remember.
 
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Proof of what? is there some shenanigans or crime here?

Got to go guys I will check in later

All it says to me is that their current expenditure requires more money than they are bringing in otherwise they would not be needing to seek outside investment, which kind of goes against some of the message they try to perpetrate.

I suppose if you were very skeptical you might see three stakeholders potentially profitting from selling shares for their own gain but that can't really be proved at this time.
 

Harbinger

Volunteer Moderator
Cobra,

I note that in a later post you admit your mistakes in mixing up the lawyers and posts, that is refreshing.

I say that because this guy was wrong or at best his first video was misleading. When I saw the first video, I thought, is he even a qualified lawyer? Having seen his 2nd video he clearly is a lawyer as who else can spend 19 minutes explaining how they were wrong but concluding that they were correct.


More importantly looking at the detail of his arguments if he is correct then CryTech have or soon will have lost all legal arguments.. Do you think he is correct or will it 100% go to trial?

Also does CIG have its lawyers on a retainer or will they have significant legal fees in addition to the settlement fee, and how much will they be? Does anyone know that stuff?

I know this isn't addressed to me but the biggest problem for me with Lior's proposed 3 month timeline is it depends wholly on CIG's honesty in their public facing statements which oftentimes tend to contradict each other.

Take for example this article that Sean Tracy was interviewed for just a few short months prior to the announced switch. This quote in particular caught my attention:

"So, 'Star Engine' has been bounced around. I don't know how absolutely official it is or anything like that. It's a pretty different version than what the CryEngine is; we branched quite a while ago. We haven't taken a new CryEngine version for quite some time – the 3.7 [or] 3.8 version of CryEngine, this was early last year – [is] where we branched off. We branched off entirely because it was getting really difficult to take the integrations. At some point, when you're developing your game on middleware, you're going to get to the point that pulling integrations is hard because you've customized it so much for your game. So, whatever changes you make to your underlying engine systems, when there's a fundamental change that comes in from your middleware provider, it's pretty difficult to consume that all the time.

“Then you start being selective – 'OK, well, we'll take this feature but we won't take this feature.' What you don't know right out of the gate is if there's any interdependency on it. What's going to happen? You find that out usually the hard way later on.

“We do cherry pick on occasion from our particular code base that we have, up to 3.7 or 3.8, but we've made some pretty major changes. It's been ongoing for awhile for CIG; I only came on about two-and-a-half years ago from Crytek with their engine drop versions.”

So they branched off in early 2015 due to the problems of a codebase now so far removed from CryEngine itself but somehow managed to not only reconcile these differences in CryEngine to the point where Lumberyard themselves forked but also reconciled all the problems from the changes Amazon themselves made in the time since they forked and as Chris Roberts stated in December 2016:

I think it took us a day or so of two engineers on the engine team

He also stated (differently to Sean Tracy I might add) that they stopped taking code at the END of 2015 around the time of the Amazon deal. Which one is correct is anyone's guess. Personally I think Sean Tracy was telling the truth just 3 short months earlier but make up your own minds on that one.

So they basically went from being unable to import CryEngine changes due to unreconcilable code changes to being able to somehow switch to a different engine based off of a much newer build of CryEngine in 1-2 days with a couple of engineers.

This is the real crux of the case, not the exclusivity angle. CryEngine will be looking to prove CIG have continued using CryEngine at the core and merely using certain elements of Amazon Lumberyard and that is what is likely to extend that 3 month timeline.
 
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Is there any proof that those are wages? Companies can sell shares to finance salaries and other expenses. Which is much more likely.

These aren't wages, that are the sums the made by selling shares which belonged to them personally. Nothing really unusal except that Crobear was spouting the "We don't want and need investors or publishers" for years.
I'm asking myself how long it will take until he gets EA into the boat. /cynism
 
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CIG updated their company web page last week. Job offers are at 94 now. Half of it is in the UK due to the tax rebates. It looks like CIG will be 600 devs in the future which is even more production speed. 2018 has been the best year for the project so far and if they keep it up it looks like they will get to the MVP within a couple of years.

https://cloudimperiumgames.com/jobs

Probably worth pointing out that adding more people to a software project usually slows it down as they need a lot of help to get up to speed.

I'd probably agree that it's been their best year. Finally looks like something might come from it if players keep stumping up.
 
Question- are those are in effect wages and over what period of time or do they draw a wage as well? I had to look up who Erin was if those are wages it seems about right for a year for him, but Chris on £2 million, maybe I am just jealous I hope he pays tax on that.

Companies house is a UK Government run organisation, so if there are 2million dollars mentioned in a official form, he better pays his taxes otherwise he could end up in HMP Pentonville.
 
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Probably worth pointing out that adding more people to a software project usually slows it down as they need a lot of help to get up to speed.

I'd probably agree that it's been their best year. Finally looks like something might come from it if players keep stumping up.

Yup, another 200 million might see something that can be released!
 
These aren't wages, that are the sums the made by selling shares which belonged to them personally. Nothing really unusal except that Crobear was spouting the "We don't want and need investors or publishers" for years.
I'm asking myself how long it will take until he gets EA into the boat. /cynism

But they did have private investors on from the start, this is known.

The thing is, investors expect a return on their investment, meaning he should be listening to them over the backers, which kind of makes the whole developed for the backers thing a bit incorrect.
 
There is plenty proof out there that a lot of people enjoy it. Which means it doesn't "suck". Enjoyment isn't universal.
No-one is arguing the former, but that does not imply the latter. There are entire communities and subgenres dedicated to enjoying things that suck. Now, if you want to argue the threshold for what levels of broken, incomplete, or just outright missing mechanics and features pushes something into the “suck” category then that's a different matter, but at that point you need to accept that it's a two way street: just like enjoyment isn't universal, sucking is a matter of subjective tolerance for brokenness.

You cannot on the one hand demand that some people must accept that others are enjoying the then, and on the other hand refuse to accept that for some people it does indeed suck. The existence of the latter group does not mean that it doesn't suck.

So yes, it does suck exactly for the reason you offer: enjoyment isn't universal.

Ships are very important in SC. Having that many ships gives the game lots of character as you can mix and match fleet compositions or focus your style.
For what purpose? What game dynamics give rise to any kind of need to worry about “fleet compositions”?

2018 has been the best year for the project so far and if they keep it up it looks like they will get to the MVP within a couple of years.
By what measure, and what leads you to those two conclusions? Especially when you consider that they seem to be suffering from team bloat (something that will only ever slow things down) and have a long history of not being able to actually hire anyone in the areas they need the most — the few ones that actually need to be expanded because they're so pitifully small and lacking in key competences.
 
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I know this isn't addressed to me but the biggest problem for me with Lior's proposed 3 month timeline is it depends wholly on CIG's honesty in their public facing statements which oftentimes tend to contradict each other.

Take for example this article that Sean Tracy was interviewed for just a few short months prior to the announced switch. This quote in particular caught my attention:



So they branched off in early 2015 due to the problems of a codebase now so far removed from CryEngine itself but somehow managed to not only reconcile these differences in CryEngine to the point where Lumberyard themselves forked but also reconciled all the problems from the changes Amazon themselves made in the time since they forked and as Chris Roberts stated in December 2016:



He also stated (differently to Sean Tracy I might add) that they stopped taking code at the END of 2015 around the time of the Amazon deal. Which one is correct is anyone's guess. Personally I think Sean Tracy was telling the truth just 3 short months earlier but make up your own minds on that one.

So they basically went from being unable to import CryEngine changes due to unreconcilable code changes to being able to somehow switch to a different engine based off of a much newer build of CryEngine in 1-2 days with a couple of engineers.

This is the real crux of the case, not the exclusivity angle. CryEngine will be looking to prove CIG have continued using CryEngine at the core and merely using certain elements of Amazon Lumberyard and that is what is likely to extend that 3 month timeline.

Yes, and this is exactly the reason Skadden want the whole kitchen sink in discovery. When and if CIG switched to Lumberyard is central to all of this. Whether they were allowed to in the first place is being disputed.

It's up to CIG to present evidence that they switched, it's up to Crytek to show evidence that they did not. This is when it gets into technical experts presenting source code in court - and in fact snippets of code have appeared in CIG's Bugsmasher videos.
 
Roadmap got updated yesterday. Here is an image to highlight all the changes.
Note the two core OCS pieces, which were originally in 3.3.5 (or earlier), have been moved to 3.5.
AND they are only at 25% completion and 14% completion. But, hey, FoIP improvements made it in.
 
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