PLEASE MAKE POWERPLAY IN "OPEN ONLY"

[Arry]

Unfortunately FD chose to make it a bland PvE grindfest, and making it open only, while presenting more opportunties for PvP it will still be a bland PvE grindfest.

Open only or not open only, PP needs a lot of changes to make it more interesting and engaging for participants.

The main mechanic behind PP is hauling from A to B, over and over and over again. Not too many players are keen to do that i think. For some, playing in open adds some spice, the possibility to be attacked by other players. Those people are already in open. For others, the possibility to be attacked by other players just adds more tedium. "Ok, look, someone is trying to gank me... and all i want to do is go from A to B", those people are likely doing PP in PG/solo.

What will likely change if it goes open only?

Most of those who haul from PG/solo will quit playing. There will be more combat people pledging because they think PP is now better. Remaining haulers will face more opposition. For some, that might be too much.

Result? I suspect the death of PP and the combat players coming to the forusm to complain their powers are collapsing and nobody is hauling and that FD should do something to fix it.

In short, without sweeping changes to PP to make it more interesting, then open only isn't going to be a positive thing, its going to be a negative thing. With those sweeping changes, then open only might not be needed.... it would of course depend on the changes made.

Why are people not clamouring for PP missions? I'm sure some remember they were mentioned in the early days of PP. And then Sandro suggested they might happen as part of his proposals. PP missions have the potential to add some variety to the feature.

I am beginning to wonder, what the gankers would be calling for, to up their player kill rates; if power play was not on the table. Maybe something like: All traders must play in open; for the sake of being a pirate, in the game; because trading in solo; reduces their content.

Whatever is on the table, not everyone is going to be happy.

 

[Robert Maynard]

Compromise means both sides choose to not get their way 100% so that everyone can be happy with part of the agreement. Right now, your side is getting what they want 100% and our side is getting 0%. The attitude of many, not all, people on your side is that if things aren't 100% of our way all the time, we will fight tooth and nail about it.

What is being offered in return for OOPP by its proponents?

If it is nothing then it's not a compromise, it's just a "we want to restrict your access to a feature because our optional play-style demands it".

Are you able to say that there is any possible change out there that you could live with so that more people would enjoy this game? Or is it your way or the highway?

Of course there are possible changes out there that I'd be happy to support.

I can understand people being opinionated and having strong feelings about stuff. But can't we start by just saying that we are open to the idea of change if certain criteria were met. It's no commitment, just an attitude that you're willing to work towards accomplishing something.

As ever the devil is in the detail - specifically the criteria to be met.

 

[Arry]

And that is part of the problem, since these activities cannot be challenged in any way other than doing it faster than your opposition. You can't use skill, you can't disrupt, you can't do very much. It forces everyone to use the same method, which reinforces Powerplays flat gameplay.

No disrespect: You must be flying in the wrong systems. I am getting really bored with hearing about, the lack of PvP opportunities within the game, due to everyone not playing in the open mode: I fly in open and meet humans, every time I enter any of the P/P H.Q. systems. Along with any C.G. space and anywhere else, that have been mentioned in the news letters etc..

As to the 'need to challenge'. This is a ridiculous mind set to have, because you only think that they are there, just out of your reach. You don't actually 'know they are there', you just believe it to be the case. This is the same as stressing about something that might happen. It does not make it happen, or stop it if it does. All you are doing is giving yourself grief. This 'need to challenge' mind-set, can be taken to its extreme. You could be thinking: What happens when I log off? How many opponents will I miss, while a go and grab a bite to eat and I will definitely miss a few more; when I have to sleep.

 

[Rubbernuke]

And that is part of the problem, since these activities cannot be challenged in any way other than doing it faster than your opposition. You can't use skill, you can't disrupt, you can't do very much. It forces everyone to use the same method, which reinforces Powerplays flat gameplay.

No disrespect: You must be flying in the wrong systems. I am getting really bored with hearing about, the lack of PvP opportunities within the game, due to everyone not playing in the open mode: I fly in open and meet humans, every time I enter any of the P/P H.Q. systems. Along with any C.G. space and anywhere else, that have been mentioned in the news letters etc..

Its the total opposite; by having mixed modes people simply go for the easiest and most efficient route which happens to be in solo and PG. That just makes everything a one dimensional gathering race where your opponents can't be tripped up but dictates the pace of the overall game.

As to the 'need to challenge'. This is a ridiculous mind set to have, because you only think that they are there, just out of your reach. You don't actually 'know they are there', you just believe it to be the case. This is the same as stressing about something that might happen. It does not make it happen, or stop it if it does. All you are doing is giving yourself grief. This 'need to challenge' mind-set, can be taken to its extreme. You could be thinking: What happens when I log off? How many opponents will I miss, while a go and grab a bite to eat and I will definitely miss a few more; when I have to sleep.

If I play in solo, I can get rid of a shield and know it does not matter. If I do that in open, there is a high chance I'll be turned inside out. Because I'm in open and that there is a chance of interception I change my behaviour regardless of if I meet someone or not.[/QUOTE]

 

[Florenus]

I don't even care to read through the whole thread, but this whole discussion seems pointless to me for one reason:
Elite is not designed as MMO game. It's a single player game with OPTION to somehow (to some extent, in one way or another) share some of that experience with others.

In Open I can block another player, increasing my chances of not being in the same instance with him.
Blocking function is essential to this game and will not be suspended for open only powerplay, so players of one faction can simply block all other players of another faction.
Even without blocking, you can be in the same place, like starport, but not seeing the same people as someone else, becasue there might be multiple instances.
You can have ty connection and game will prefer to band together those with better pings, etc.

Whatever your opinion is on how would it be cool or not, Open only anything is simply not in the realm of possibilities for this game because of design philosphy.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Hence the cal

I don't even care to read through the whole thread, but this whole discussion seems pointless to me for one reason:
Elite is not designed as MMO game. It's a single player game with OPTION to somehow (to some extent, in one way or another) share some of that experience with others.

In Open I can block another player, increasing my chances of not being in the same instance with him.
Blocking function is essential to this game and will not be suspended for open only powerplay, so players of one faction can simply block all other players of another faction.
Even without blocking, you can be in the same place, like starport, but not seeing the same people as someone else, becasue there might be multiple instances.
You can have poopooty connection and game will prefer to band together those with better pings, etc.

Whatever your opinion is on how would it be cool or not, Open only anything is simply not in the realm of possibilities for this game because of design philosphy.

Hence the call for the block tool to be altered for Open PP and that the proposed mode is opportunistic.

 

[Arry]

I think there are phases of growth as a player in ED. One crucial step is to learn to differentiate between griefers, whose only enjoyment is to up their player kill rates, and pvpers. When you stop thinking powerplay open only people and pvpers are only trying to find fresh meat, relax and see the possibilities of open mode interaction, you might probably reach this phase of enjoyment which will eventually bring to more emergent content and good time to all ED players.

Griefers are there also because ED galaxy is so static. Open mode powerplay would be a step to get people to gather to defend their interests and powers and experience how cool it is to be part of a group of cmdrs working for the same objective against another group, and then joking with the adversaries.

It is not like FD showed they can improve much the mechanics by themselves it seems after all. With just a minimal effort of making powerplay open (EVEN with the current poor mechanics) it will be better than the advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click advance quota click TORTURE we have now.

"Griefers are there also because ED galaxy is so static." This you really believe? Those that wish to give grief to others in a game, (any and every game it is possible to do so) do so because they 'want to' and will use any excuse; to justify their own behaviour. They often use 'cheats' or grind their way up to meta-ships, or one shot killer weapons and then they use them; at each and every opportunity. Unless of course, they meet some real competition. Then its doing a sir robin, with a lot of back-chat, or they simply log off. Greifers are called greifers, because that is what they do. I have met many. I have also met many genuine PvP players, who will often let me escape with a lot of damage and congratulate me, for putting up a fight, against the odds. Yes I have lost ships, for running in the face of genuine pirates; but that IS the game; some I win, some I lose. I would not be taking the risk, if I could not afford the re-buy.

Greifers want to sit outside the starter stations and kill the new players, coming out for the first time; because a lack of content. Rubbish!

 

[Rubbernuke]

False - I have articulated it, but you epically fail to understand the distinction between the gameplay PP offers from a PvE perspective versus that facilitated by Squadrons - the underlying BGS gameplay is not significantly affected by either the presence or absence of Squadrons and is different from PP gameplay.

I've laid out the gameplay of both. Both are territorial. BGS is better at it.

 

[Arry]

"No disrespect: You must be flying in the wrong systems. I am getting really bored with hearing about, the lack of PvP opportunities within the game, due to everyone not playing in the open mode: I fly in open and meet humans, every time I enter any of the P/P H.Q. systems. Along with any C.G. space and anywhere else, that have been mentioned in the news letters etc..

As to the 'need to challenge'. This is a ridiculous mind set to have, because you only think that they are there, just out of your reach. You don't actually 'know they are there', you just believe it to be the case. This is the same as stressing about something that might happen. It does not make it happen, or stop it if it does. All you are doing is giving yourself grief. This 'need to challenge' mind-set, can be taken to its extreme. You could be thinking: What happens when I log off? How many opponents will I miss, while a go and grab a bite to eat and I will definitely miss a few more; when I have to sleep."

seriously

The more I read open mode powerplay detractors' arguments the more I sense a mix of hate revenge and humiliation stemming from the first time they have been ganked that makes them irrationally biased.

How did you formulate that statement; from what I wrote above? You must be running out of things, to add here.

 

[Rubbernuke]

I am beginning to wonder, what the gankers would be calling for, to up their player kill rates; if power play was not on the table. Maybe something like: All traders must play in open; for the sake of being a pirate, in the game; because trading in solo; reduces their content.

Whatever is on the table, not everyone is going to be happy.

Nothing else is being considered because thats not what was on offer. Sandro repeatedly said this was for Powerplay, nothing else. The level of paranoid hysteria from people fearing a slippery slope is incredible.

 

[CMDR KOBAL]

What is being offered in return for OOPP by its proponents?

If it is nothing then it's not a compromise, it's just a "we want to restrict your access to a feature because our optional play-style demands it".

Of course there are possible changes out there that I'd be happy to support.

As ever the devil is in the detail - specifically the criteria to be met.

It's nice to hear someone say they are open to change.

 

[Arry]

And that is part of the problem, since these activities cannot be challenged in any way other than doing it faster than your opposition. You can't use skill, you can't disrupt, you can't do very much. It forces everyone to use the same method, which reinforces Powerplays flat gameplay.



Its the total opposite; by having mixed modes people simply go for the easiest and most efficient route which happens to be in solo and PG. That just makes everything a one dimensional gathering race where your opponents can't be tripped up but dictates the pace of the overall game.



If I play in solo, I can get rid of a shield and know it does not matter. If I do that in open, there is a high chance I'll be turned inside out. Because I'm in open and that there is a chance of interception I change my behaviour regardless of if I meet someone or not.

[/QUOTE]
Both examples are hypothetical. Yes they could be happening; but because they can be happening, does not mean that they are happening.

You disagree? Good. As i have pointed out before, many time in these threads. These actions can be and will be applied, by both sides of the fight.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Both examples are hypothetical. Yes they could be happening; but because they can be happening, does not mean that they are happening.

You disagree? Good. As i have pointed out before, many time in these threads. These actions can be and will be applied, by both sides of the fight.

You are mistaken because its happening right now. AFK merit farming, solo fortifying and preparation. Powerplay becomes a battle of the lowest common denominator with low grade gameplay. An Open only Powerplay would go a long way to disrupt that.

 

[Arry]

I don't even care to read through the whole thread, but this whole discussion seems pointless to me for one reason:
Elite is not designed as MMO game. It's a single player game with OPTION to somehow (to some extent, in one way or another) share some of that experience with others.

In Open I can block another player, increasing my chances of not being in the same instance with him.
Blocking function is essential to this game and will not be suspended for open only powerplay, so players of one faction can simply block all other players of another faction.
Even without blocking, you can be in the same place, like starport, but not seeing the same people as someone else, becasue there might be multiple instances.
You can have poopooty connection and game will prefer to band together those with better pings, etc.

Whatever your opinion is on how would it be cool or not, Open only anything is simply not in the realm of possibilities for this game because of design philosphy.

Some of the people asking for this POOP option, have already called for the block function to be removed, along with their POOP demand. I can also guarantee, that if the POOP happened in any form; the rest would be here, demanding the block player option, to be removed.

 

[Arry]

Hence the cal


Hence the call for the block tool to be altered for Open PP and that the proposed mode is opportunistic.

See.

 

[Rubbernuke]

See.

Because in a mode that would be about conflict you could block someone for shooting you?

Thats like a footballer blocking the person who tackled them and running onto a second pitch.

 

[Arry]

Nothing else is being considered because thats not what was on offer. Sandro repeatedly said this was for Powerplay, nothing else. The level of paranoid hysteria from people fearing a slippery slope is incredible.

You know that we are not discussing 'what is being considered'. We are discussing a dead proposal. Cherry pick whatever you need to enforce your own point of view.

I was talking about what said players, would be asking for, if it was not the subject in hand.

 

[Arry]

Because in a mode that would be about conflict you could block someone for shooting you?

Thats like a footballer blocking the person who tackled them and running onto a second pitch.

Footballers have a rule book to play too. Head butting another player is not in that book and so those wishing to do so, are not allowed to play. Pick a more realistic example.

 

[Rubbernuke]

You know that we are not discussing 'what is being considered'. We are discussing a dead proposal. Cherry pick whatever you need to enforce your own point of view.

I was talking about what said players, would be asking for, if it was not the subject in hand.

Whatever your POV is, thats whats being discussed here.

 

[Rubbernuke]

Footballers have a rule book to play too. Head butting another player is not in that book and so those wishing to do so, are not allowed to play. Pick a more realistic example.

But in Powerplay you can kill what you like, as there are no rules against it, and despite it being nerfed it still rewards you. The simple act of shooting another rival pledge cannot be the basis for blocking them.

And the analogy is apt, because a tackle happens all the time in football, just like conflict in Powerplay.